[Hot Take] Gem store cosmetics suck [Merged]

[Sgt Bubbles.4908]

This is just an opinion and maybe (or may not) be hot take (and I am genuinely curious to hear what other peoples thoughts are on the topic) but I am so frustrated with the slew of cosmetic options available to us on the gem store and strongly think they are slowly destroying the game. But let me explain...

I am 100% for the gem store, and frequently purchase things from it. The more ways I can support the game without having a sub-fee the better.
I LOVE that it is entirely convenience and cosmetics, and not a hint of anything pay to win.

There are cosmetics on there I also LOVE like the god outfits, GW1 skin come backs, anything SAB related.

The thing I hate is this constant stream of mass produced items that feel like they've been outsourced to a company that has never played GW2, making items that could easily be sent to multiple MMOs indiscriminately without a second thought. Specifically I think they have ruined any sense of a distinct and cohesive artist style. The game went from having its own visual language and identity to feeling like a bloated outsourced Perfect World clone. Or like playing Skyrim with *every* mod installed.

Items like the jade bot skins, maid outfit, kitty kat outfit, enormous wings, pointy elf ears, or Pegasus griffon are cute and funny and that's all well and good...but they don't at all feel like they belong in this world. They don't feel "Guild Wars". (And as a side note, they often feel quite pandering which doesn't always feel nice)

And I want to make clear I have NOTHING against cutsie, joking or bombastically over the top kind of items in and of themselves. Because there are items on the gem store that are like this, that manage to still fit into the game in a really wonderful way. Examples being the Choya hammer (bloody brilliant!), Job-O-Tron backpack, the quaggan hat/backpack, SAB mount skins or mad king outfits, just to name a few.

It really feels like there are two teams of people developing items for the gem store that are actively working against each other, and I am  curious if that is infact the case. One set of AnetDevs and some outsourced team to make sure there is a constant revenue stream. (Which if that is the case I certainly understand that the company needs to maintain revenue, but it would be a shame if that corrupts the game).

Because currently I really get turned off the game by this 'Skyrim with *all* the mods' feeling and frequently wish for a universal 'standardize all player models' button like in PvP.

Very curious what other people think about this.

[EDIT] Having read some things, I should clarify that the key thing I am worried about is that the experience and feel of the game is being cheapened because of a diluted and miss-matched artistic identity by outsourced gem store junk.
I am not worried about immersion here (it's an MMO not a single player game after all), nor am I wanting to be fashion police. But if you were to take any item or cosmetic out of the context of the game, increasingly more of them could be from just about any generic mass produced MMO or Mobile Game.
And if it continues I worry it will feel less and less like a polished top 3 MMO in the market game that it is, and more like something cheap and forgettable. 

Edited May 3, 2023 by Sgt Bubbles.4908

[Vavume.8065]

16 minutes ago, Sgt Bubbles.4908 said:

The game went from having a unique visual language and identity 

I disagree, it was never unique at all.

[Sgt Bubbles.4908]

17 minutes ago, Vavume.8065 said:

I disagree, it was never unique at all.

Okay maybe *unique* was the wrong word, but certainly cohesive, consistent and identifiable.

[Vavume.8065]

1 minute ago, Sgt Bubbles.4908 said:

Okay maybe *unique* was the wrong word, but certainly cohesive, consistent and identifiable.

It was cohesive until SAB and the gazillion wing backpacks they added, it all went wrong from there.

Edited May 3, 2023 by Vavume.8065

[Jin.8501]

They do it to get as many people interested in to the game. If someone likes stuff like this they are more likely to try it out. 

 

WoW might be the one and only which stays true to itself due to strong ip and value

[Zebulous.2934]

If the Elegant Canthan outfit had been released as Elegant Courtesan would you have disapproved of the outfit as well?  It would have certainly fit in with Earth's aesthetic for a similar time and a similar culture.  Does the Elegant Canthan outfit really follow Gw2 aesthetic rules?
I can roleplay as a Canthan crime lord with a courtesan on each arm, and you are fine with that, but when someone wants to be a battle maid it is too much?

[Sweetbread.3678]

You can definitely tell when something's monetized in this game because the art style immediately goes from Guild Wars, to that interchangeable "glowing angelic bikini armor" style that almost every single one of NCSoft's korean mmos has.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

Recently someone shared some very old screenshots of the game with me. I realised that while I did love the game in the early days, I was also wearing rose-tinteded glasses; literally every player looked almost exactly the same, there were almost no backpieces, and the vast majority of experienced players were wearing Flame Legion armor or Human Cultural T3 and wielding Sunrise or Twilight.

 

There was literally hundreds of players dressed like this at events, like the Queensdale champion train.

 

Its not how you remember it to be; even at the best of times players were still trying to run around in either burning fire armor or their lingerie, and they were always trying to have as much flashy with what little was available, but because there was so little of it they all ended up looking exactly the same.

 

The game may look more generic to you now, but at least we have variation, and players can create literally thousands of unique looks with what they have available! The cosplays recently have been insane, although someone who doesn't frequent places like Reddit and GW2Style likely wouldn't know this because they only pay attention to the random players with overstacked infusions and never look at anyone else, even when they're actually in the minority.

 

Its ultimately also a social game, and that has to trump immersion and lore. For example, Charr are war-like and ferocious by nature, but most female Charr players dress them up as  some of the most beautiful characters you've ever seen, which isn't lore-accurate. Even Crecia, who is regarded as one of the prettiest Charr, was rather tame compared to alot of player characters.

 

This is just how it works, and its how things have been ever since Everquest.

 

By the way, most of these items do have in-game lore. For example, the maid/butler outfit is connected to the last episode, all the Shrine Guardian items are connected to the Shrine Guardians in Cantha (who are also physically present in Dragon's End). alot of the wings are connected to in-game real or mythical characters like Aurene, and the capitalist nature of both the Black Lion Trading Company and Xunlai Jade mean that many items are solid purely for profit even if they have no other use, such as the Jade Bot skins.

Edited May 3, 2023 by SoftFootpaws.9134

[Doggie.3184]

Evon Gnashblade is a world renowned hero who owns what's basically the Amazon of GW2's world. He has factories that produce a massive variety of toys, costumes, fashion, etc, just like Amazon. His goal was always to make the most unique items possible. I'm sure plenty of Human NPCs living among their Charr loved ones wanted to mimic them with animatronic ear and tail accessories. It truly cements the peace between races who used to hate each other. I find it very lore appropriate and what's really happening is the GW2 world is evolving into a more modern society. 

[Barabbas.8715]

5 hours ago, Sgt Bubbles.4908 said:

This is just an opinion and maybe (or may not) be hot take (and I am genuinely curious to hear what other peoples thoughts are on the topic) but I am so frustrated with the slew of cosmetic options available to us on the gem store and strongly think they are slowly destroying the game. But let me explain...

I am 100% for the gem store, and frequently purchase things from it. The more ways I can support the game without having a sub-fee the better.
I LOVE that it is entirely convenience and cosmetics, and not a hint of anything pay to win.

There are cosmetics on there I also LOVE like the god outfits, GW1 skin come backs, anything SAB related.

The thing I hate is this constant stream of mass produced items that feel like they've been outsourced to a company that has never played GW2, making items that could easily be sent to multiple MMOs indiscriminately without a second thought. Specifically I think they have ruined any sense of a distinct and cohesive artist style. The game went from having a unique visual language and identity to feeling just like another Perfect World clone. Or like playing Skyrim with *every* mod installed.

Items like the jade bot skins, maid outfit, kitty kat outfit, enormous wings, pointy elf ears, or Pegasus griffon are cute and funny and that's all well and good...but they don't at all feel like they belong in this world. They don't feel "Guild Wars". (And as a side note, they often feel quite pandering which doesn't always feel nice)

And I want to make clear I have NOTHING against cutsie, joking or bombastically over the top kind of items in and of themselves. Because there are items on the gem store that are like this, that manage to still fit into the game in a really wonderful way. Examples being the Choya hammer (bloody brilliant!), Job-O-Tron backpack, the quaggan hat/backpack, SAB mount skins or mad king outfits, just to name a few.

It really feels like there are two teams of people developing items for the gem store that are actively working against each other, and I am  curious if that is infact the case. One set of AnetDevs and some outsourced team to make sure there is a constant revenue stream. (Which if that is the case I certainly understand that the company needs to maintain revenue, but it would be a shame if that corrupts the game).

Because currently I really get turned off the game by this 'Skyrim with *all* the mods' feeling and frequently wish for a universal 'standardize all player models' button like in PvP.

Very curious what other people think about this.

Just don't buy the stuff you don't like. Problem solved. Or are you really crying about having to see people wearing outfits you don't approve of? Are you trying to be the fashion police? Did we break your fragile sense of immersion because our Jade Bot is a flying cat? 🤣😂

[Andur.9275]

You can have two takes on this topic, if you care about GW2's fashion:

1) You really like all the diversity and love the different styles that are available. You can cosplay, adapt the looks of characters from other games / franchises and really enjoy the freedom of choice, especially if you consider GW to be a social hub, where you can let your creativity run free to express yourself (or just create an outstanding character).

2) On the other hand you can view the fashion from the perspective of an traditional roleplaying game, where clothing alien to the setting will immediately be immersion breaking.

Imagine Obi-Wan Kenobi wieling his lightsabre came to save the day in the battle of Helm's Deep and not Gandalf. From this perspective GW2 contains many immersion breaking things, from silly legendary weapons (which were there right from the start) with no (convincing) background in the lore to all the items from the gemstore that simply don't fit Tyria's original design.

[Khisanth.2948]

5 hours ago, Sgt Bubbles.4908 said:

Specifically I think they have ruined any sense of a distinct and cohesive artist style.

I agree with your general sentiments but that ship sailed years ago. Around when Daniel Dociu left. Not sure if it left because of the change in direction or the direction changed because he was no longer around to steer ...

[Freya.9075]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't generation 1 legendaries released when the game was released? The dreamer has always been in the game if so. Meaning immersion breaking items already started then. And it's actually a reference to My Little Pony. 

From wiki: The ArenaNet logo on the flank of the unicorn is a reference to the My Little Pony franchise, in which characters have a symbol (cutie mark), which represents a special talent or prominent personality trait, displayed on their flanks.

You choose to play an mmo with a lot of people with different taste and opinions. You should expect things that will break your immersion when you do. I am glad they allow us to do our own fashion in the way we want. Wether that is a shiny, plain, spooky, cute, pretty, futuristic, ancient fashion or whatever you prefer. This is what makes players unique. To me mmos are boring if everyone walks around looking the same. With the same face, hair and dull brown fashion choices. It is way more interesting to see the creative fashion of the community. Don't get me wrong, plain brown fashion can be good, but not when everyone walks around looking the same. 

Players will always find a way to break immersion no matter what. This is not a single player game, it's an mmo. It should cater to all tastes. (For the most part)

[Ashantara.8731]

1 hour ago, Freya.9075 said:

Players will always find a way to break immersion no matter what. This is not a single player game, it's an mmo. It should cater to all tastes. (For the most part)

I disagree with this sentiment. I think that the "furry-lover" art is taking it too far. I don't want to see weird cutesy Asian manga stuff in my MMO.

[Freya.9075]

15 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

I disagree with this sentiment. I think that the "furry-lover" art is taking it too far. I don't want to see weird cutesy Asian manga stuff in my MMO.

You’re free to feel so. But is it your mmo? “Furry-lover”? These are strange statements. It’s not your game more then it’s my game. Or any other player. The players who want cute things has the same right to voice it as you do. And you don’t have to be a “furry-lover” to appreciate cute things. How about respecting other players and their opinions and wishes for “their” game? That seems like a nice thing to do.
 

After all it is Anets game and they will add things to the game as they see fit. It’s not upto you or me. If they want to add “cute Asian manga stuff or furry-lover things” (which is a weird and disrespectful thing to say) they will do so. And there is nothing we can do about that. If they sell the items they release, they will keep adding more of it. The majority of the players and Anet decides this. Not us. 

[Aelin.9317]

I don't get how kitty ears are a no no but the 8 bit looking adventure box stuff is A ok. Neither one really fits guild wars imo. But they are there for fun not immersion. SAB is not my cup of tea but kitty ears are cute and if they did them with a nicer outfit I would have gotten them. 

[Andur.9275]

Imo, it's the decision of the company (management, sales department, design team, marketing or whoever is in charge): do they want to cater to the masses and thus include as many people as possibe, or do they want to reach out for an (smaller) audience with a specific taste. If the latter is the case, they really should care for the overall design of their product. Imo, ANet (or NC Soft, or whoever is in charge in this case) chose to appeal to a wider audience.

Edited May 3, 2023 by Andur.9275
typos

[DanAlcedo.3281]

More stuff like Maid Outfits please! 

[Gendalfs.7521]

SAB stuff sound effects throw immersion out of window for me. That glider sound is unpleasant.

[Balsa.3951]

fashion in this game is medicore and way to less armor skins for such a old game. weapons are crazy varieties. 

it's just me but im bored there is nothing i like and all this cute stuff makes.the game look like a discount version of final Fantasy

[Gibson.4036]

For some reason the holosmith sword feels like a fun nod to Star Wars, but the adventurous cat outfit feels like a cheap imitation of FFXIV. Maybe because one came from in game, and the other is from the gem store?

I do appreciate the variety we’re getting. Heavy armor, for example, has always bothered me with the sameness of so many of the sets. The monastery set has been a relief from all the big-shoulder, tin can designs.

At any rate, I’ve always had an easy time with willing suspension of disbelief, so neither the sword nor the outfit give me immersion issues. And Guild Wars has always had contemporary references and jokes in it.

Edited May 3, 2023 by Gibson.4036

[Vavume.8065]

5 hours ago, Andur.9275 said:

You can have two takes on this topic, if you care about GW2's fashion:

1) You really like all the diversity and love the different styles that are available. You can cosplay, adapt the looks of characters from other games / franchises and really enjoy the freedom of choice, especially if you consider GW to be a social hub, where you can let your creativity run free to express yourself (or just create an outstanding character).

2) On the other hand you can view the fashion from the perspective of an traditional roleplaying game, where clothing alien to the setting will immediately be immersion breaking.

Yeah I will go with 2.

[Sciger.1679]

I'm a player who really enjoys having lore-immersed toons and having outfits, weapons, etc. to match them, their personalities, their story I have written for them. I'm not the biggest fan of the maid outfit, cat ears/tail, HMS Divinity even if the concept makes me die laughing etc. But I'm not about to say someone else shouldn't have all those things if Anet chose to make it available. By all means, have your cosmetics, even if they don't fit into my idea of the lore! That's the thing though- my toons, my vision for them and what they wear, what weapons they use and what they look like, what exists in Tyria and what doesn't, it's my interpretation of the base lore. It may be supported by base lore in some place, way or even just NPC dialogue but it's still my take on it.

If someone wants to have the shiniest charr to rule them all, a wibbly wobbly rubbery sword that can somehow unalive risen again or cat ears/tail like we're in FFXIV, then go right ahead. I may not like it myself but that doesn't mean they don't have the right to like it or gods forbid, use it in my presence! </sarcasm> I don't have immersion issues with them because I can think of them as noncanon in my interpretation of lore, just as they may even think that my toons and outfits may not be canon to theirs. That's assuming they even care about lore and immersion.

At the end of the day, you do you for your cosmetic choices. Just don't tell me that I can't do me for my cosmetic choices. 😄

 

[Andur.9275]

50 minutes ago, Vavume.8065 said:

Yeah I will go with 2.

Same, I personally don't (or rather didn't use to) like immersion breaking things in GW2 at all (and it doesn't help if I don't use them), but I wanted to make a statement as objective as possible.

Eventually I got used to it and don't care anymore - I even find it hilarious nowadays, if I meet Long Cats, a Spiderman, etc. The game is way too much fun, so I find it easy to take things I don't like not too seriously.

 

Edited May 3, 2023 by Andur.9275

[Sgt Bubbles.4908]

I haven't read everything yet, but a lot of people are focused on the immersion element of it. Maybe also misunderstood some of what I was trying to say.

To clarify, it's not immersion I'm worried about, or even other players "bad fashion sense". I love the dumb items like HMS Divinity, or the Quaggan shield - they are ANet sense of humor to a T.

What bothers me is the lack of an artistic identity of the game, atleast with cosmetics (as wanky as that sounds). As someone pointed out, Blizzard is really good with this. If you see a cosmetic from one of their games out of context - no matter how ridiculous - you could pretty much immediately tell it's from that game.

It's the polish, and feel of the game. It helps set the game apart from others, helps make it marketable, and I think not having it makes the game feel cheap, like buying a flagship smartphone and having it load up with a bunch of bloat/adware

(And to be clear, it's not entirely lacking, I just think the clearly outsourced Gem store cosmetics are diluting the mix a little to fast and hard).

Edited May 3, 2023 by Sgt Bubbles.4908