WvW Players - After today's Balance Patch and Expansion Announcement

[XenesisII.1540]

Who's ready to buy the new expansion on August 22? Up for another round of power creep? 

Unlocked Elite specs weapons for all specs. New weapon sets for all classes. 6th stat only bonus on Runes. New Relic slot that now holds the 6th non stat bonuses.

Announcement - https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/announcing-guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure/

Main Expansion Page - https://www.guildwars2.com/en/secrets-of-the-obscure/

New Combat changes - https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/combat-in-guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure/

New Content - Skyscale mastery, fractals, strikes, challenge mode. https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/a-new-chapter-begins-in-guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure/

New Rewards - Daily/monthly rework for new rewards. New overworld Legendary Set https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/new-rewards-in-guild-wars-2-secrets-of-the-obscure/

Today's delightful balance patch. https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/132433-game-update-notes-june-27-2023/

 

[TheGrimm.5624]

Saving votes till I can get in game and see what's what but interesting results so far.

[ArchonWing.9480]

I mean, not exactly unhappy, but I don't see why I should buy this expansion.

Haven't cared about the story for a long time. PvE maps could be fun but no real guarantees there, and not to mention longevity always being a problem with gw2 content.

New fractal (after 3 years...) could be cool, but do I actually have to buy that?

It looks more like a DLC than a real expansion.

[Nugatory.8920]

I would have preferred that the next expansion not include the combat rework. It would have been an easy skip for me if it hadn't. Instead I feel like it's not something I want, but something I may need, which makes me resent it in a way. I'm not interested in the PvE content and what's been shown for the content I am interested in seems more of an appetiser rather than a main course. Allowing existing elite weapons to be used openly across their proffesions and later adding additional weapons for each proffession feels interesting, yet underwhelming, and potentially a further headache to balance. I'm also concerned about the relic system, whilst I think it will open up some interesting build options, I'm sceptical about the decision to remove the sixth bonus from runes. For instances will relics be lesser, equal or greater in power to the existing sixth attributes, which relics will be locked behind the expansion, how much of a grind will relics be to obtain, can players unlock all relics exclusively through wvw content? 

So I'm undecided right now. My main thought after the announcement was "I wish it wasn't so soon", which doesn't seem like a positive reaction.

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

2 hours ago, XenesisII.1540 said:

Who's ready to buy the new expansion on August 22?

Necromancer/Harbinger with Greatsword? Hell yeah!

balance changes didn't affect me in any way so gg.

[Jitters.9401]

I only WvW but would have purchased the expansion to support the game till this last IMBALANCE update.

 

This is clearly a @Cal Cohen.2358game made for @Cal Cohen.2358 desires and "f" anyone who thinks different. 

 

My opinion of course, but with the gutting to virtuoso,  I am not willing to keep jumping to new classes. 

[Dawdler.8521]

The counter for "How many expansions can Anet release before they fix a 3x3x6 meter box shaped mesh in WvW" keep going up.

So of course I'll get the ultimate edition just for that.

[Dagger.2035]

The new expansion doesn't seem appealing to me.  Taking away the rune's 6th bonus so we must earn them back, meh.  Allowing us to use elite spec weapons as core weapons, meh.  The newly announced weapons don't seem useful for WvW large scale fights, meh.

The balance patch would be ok, if it wasn't for the Arc Divider change.  Warriors can't have fun in WvW apparently.  I also think the balance philosophy of pushing changes to create a melee meta are just wrong.  This does nothing but make large, organized groups stronger.  When outnumbered it is better to avoid fights rather than being a bag.  Some bad support-oriented guilds which always lost fights to pug clouds are much harder to break now.  I can't say balance is headed in the right direction.

[Riba.3271]

Looking forward to it.

I think they could have gone even further with rune changes and made rune bonuses cap at 4 pieces, or some other way, so that there is reason to mix runesets. Still I love the change of being able to flex stats and effects better.

I already posted on these forums years ago that they can add new weapons to classes without the extra work of adding elite specs. So good that they started doing that.

Not sure about the actual expansion content though and I hope there is more to the expansion than just story. Maybe new PvP mode or something? Some kind of faction gameplay? Dungeon Rework? GvGs from GW1? I still think the game is missing a lot of good things from Guild Wars 1. Surely they can't charge us 25 euros/dollars for just piece of story and unlocking couple of relics? I understand HoT and PoF both revolutionized the game, and EoD was bit lackluster with useless Skiffs and Jade Bots but at least had Elite Specs. Are we now at point where we get nothing?

Edited June 28, 2023 by Riba.3271

[Burnfall.9573]

I walked into the same pile of Trash before the patch. What service are we paying for? For more trash disposal? 

Certainly Not!!

[DeceiverX.8361]

Honestly, probably the most worthwhile "expansion" (I use that term loosely here since we have no real sense of scope of what's actually to come), from a systems POV.

I skipped EoD having more or less quit playing, but this push towards build options is probably one of the best moves they've made in a while.

The real catch is if they can manage the nightmare of balancing that's going to come with it.  I have a feeling they can't, but I guess we'll see what happens.

[prototypedragon.1406]

And the mention of the next expansion full on splash spectacular  on the same day considering many peoples concerns about the wvw balance update left unanswered  seems kinda like the devs are flipping wvwers the moa bird 😂🤣🍿 idk all, by the 5 I miss the old days of gw2 which things flowed alot better and boons were not a requirement to be viable. Kinda makes you wonder where the dart with the blind folded spinning wheel act shall land next🤷‍♂️ at times it's like wvw is a Quggan without gills   and anet just straps some weights onto it and thinks it should be fine in the water, there is a reason beached quaggans don't appear often.

[MarkBecks.6453]

I would like to know the difference between Balance and gutting of a class? I think balance means if you have a skill that is OP or underpowered, you rework the time from say 1.75 secs to 1.5 seconds and monitor the outcome, but to destroy a skill completely is to gut it to the point that is no longer viable to play. I think as a company you have the right to release and change skills and builds to what you feel is fair and viable, but when you completely destroy a build then I become cynical about where this is going or are we going to hope the cash cow does not die from overmilking. 

[RlyOsim.2497]

It's grown on me

Edited July 15, 2023 by RlyOsim.2497

[Bristingr.5034]

Not gonna buy the expac. I'm already losing interest in the game as it is. Money's tight right now too.

[solemn.9670]

Necros can eat it, you had this coming for years and it's shocking that the condi spam wasn't nerfed earlier. Great patch. Ele is equalized 🤘

[Jugglemonkey.8741]

Tbh I'm more annoyed it's so soon, I'm not sure I have money to spare on an expac right now. That said I made fun of HoT being announced too early and the fact I'd almost lost interest by the time it came out, so I guess I can't have it both ways. 

[PrinceValentine.9320]

No. Thank you. Will probably do if they put it on huge sale discount.  

[Zevelon.6512]

When Anet make my favorite class(warrior) playable again in the play mode (WvW) i love the most then i will think about buying something from them. Till then they are not geting a cent from my wallet. The balance patch proves Devs don't even play the game.

Edited June 28, 2023 by Zevelon.6512

[TheGrimm.5624]

Just doing a pre-primetime checks and there is a number of people testing in WvW which is good to see. Can see a lot of theory crafting. May need to grab a power DD with a Staff and Rifle. Popped a quick build on a Virt with Axe/Shield, played out pretty well and added some more depth on the Virt making it more into a mid/front bruiser.

[cyberzombie.7348]

Between the lack of EoD runes, current balancing, storytelling, and PvP/WvW updates. The writing is on the wall as to how the 4th expansion will turn out, so hard pass.

Edited June 29, 2023 by cyberzombie.7348

[ArchonWing.9480]

Everyone, please take a look at these threads:

 

They are changing rune functionality, and it doesn't look like they thought it through very well.

What's happening is that runes will only give stats and the final bonus is going to be on a "relic" equipment slot. That may be a problem because you may have to grind for runeset bonuses that you already had. Now they say they will give you some free boxes but they don't say how many. 

The good news is they say you can earn it through reward tracks. If you are a WvW regular, I would recommend saving some reward potions (80 will complete a track fyi)

They said they would look into the situation but I'm not sure if they really are aware of the ramifications of what they're doing.

A lot of people don't care because in pve most runesets are just ways to increase damage, and most couldn't even notice a 5% damage difference anyways but in WvW, you may be using runes for more special effects than just raw damage.

Currently, I don't think most people will have too much difficulty, unless you're one of the unfortunate people to dump gold on legendary runes (situation is ambiguous) but it may come off as a annoying disruption if you didn't think the expansion will affect you.

However, I do feel like it's a rather unnecessary change and seems to be again another example of developer centered balance ("let's simplify things so it's easier for us to balance").  We'll see if they actually put more thought into it to make sure people stay happy.

The good news is you may no longer have to care about sticking a rune in your aquabreather, assuming you even had one to begin with.

FYI I'm not telling anyone to panic or rage or freak out, but rather you should probably take some precautionary steps like stocking reward potions or halting legendary rune creation until we get further information. And you know as well as I do if you've read the forums that there will be many people posting "wtf happened to my runes" on release.

How they handle this will definitely affect my decision on whether to buy the expansion or not.

Edited June 29, 2023 by ArchonWing.9480

[XenesisII.1540]

My only worry about this system is how many op relics are they going to gate behind content of the expansion.

While we've already had runes locked behind expansions, most of them you can do without, and get cheaper versions from even the tp. With this though I feel like this break from runes will give them freedom to put in even more broken effects, maybe even enough to finally slip over the slope to p2w. 

Well in any case I have like 10 stacks of reward track potions if they stick it all on those lol.

[Leger.3724]

Yes I will get it. It will provide strikes, fractals, open world content including involving the griffon and skyscale. That is GW2 at its best.

In terms of WvW and pvp more generally... I don't blame them for ignoring it.

This game mode is literally never going to succeed and very few new players will join. It's basically all on us... the people already invested who can't leave. We are the sweats of varying degrees. This is it. No update by Arena Net or time investment by the developers is going to change this.

The things they would have to do to get a healthy community invested in WvW would be shouted down and criticized to hell here. The trolls would be out with their confused emoji on the forums here.

What am I talking about? Drastically increasing survivability of all professions in WvW. Dramatically reducing the effectiveness of layering and stacking of damage, condition damage and boons. Cutting off teleportation and stealth mechanics off at the knees for stuff like Willbender and Thief. Re-thinking the Warclaw mount and the ability track for it. Should you be able to throw a spear and dunk on a new player? Should the skillbar have so many abilities? Should cooldowns be so short? What about the PIP system? Someone trying and failing in this game will have trouble maintaining tier 6 participation without playing the "cap the camp game". How can we better reward players for trying and failing to take objectives or fight another player?

This is all stuff widely derided by the same group claiming Arena Net won't make WvW or sPvP attractive. For many this place is an echo chamber of blaming Arena Net while shouting down any proposed change that would actually bring people into the game mode. 

So again Arena Net - if you are making GW3 or planning to eventually make a GW3 - keep the combat system in mind and how the average player will engage with it. Keep things simple. Give people clear role choices. Make it forgiving so a mistake isn't instant death. Maybe reconsider a monk class/profession since removing it has led to so many awkward choices surrounding skill cooldowns, the introduction of boons. A smiting prayer monk could have explored open world solo. The open world in GW2 itself is fantastic. The group content is a struggle though and it's mainly because of combat, a lack of clearly defined roles and a lack of a good group matcher or henchmen to replace them. Imagine doing one of the regular story dungeons with henchmen to get a feel.

Edited June 30, 2023 by Leger.3724

[pukish.5784]

R.I.P GW2

Edited June 30, 2023 by pukish.5784