Would changing the max number of targets change WvW forever, for good or for bad?

[aspirine.5839]

Afaik this is still in place right? You can only hit ( I think around 5?But for sure not enough right now) people, but 25+ can still hit you at the same time.So what happens when this is changed, not to max because the server would probably crash and it makes no sense that one meteor show can down half the zerg.

Let's say the max is going to 10 from AOE damage. In that case could 2 or 3 strong small groups of 5 be mobile and strong enough to harash a slow moving zerg enough that it would matter? Would it make the game more or less fun?Could 5 or 10 defender in this case do something enough to not rely on AC fire too much?I always thought I read that it was done not for gameplay reasons, but for server performance. Is it now time to change it up a bit?But perhaps it has some downfalls too that is keeping Anet from implementing it..

[Dayra.7405]

It should not go up, it should go down to 1-2.AoE damage and especially CC is already blocking all fights and you want to even increase that?If you double AoE-targets you are hit twice as often in a zerg fight, that's the end of all fights.

[Optimator.3589]

Yeah, no. Scourge spam already makes for a pretty mindless meta, and your proposal would make it that much worse. No need for coordinated bombs, no need to target the enemy driver....not that these are really needed most of the time now, but blech...no thanks.

[aspirine.5839]

It's pretty obvious they will nerf scourge, if you take a look at people's squads the main consistency of a group is them.Watched the bandwagon stream of teapot yesterday a bit and of his 50 blob half of them were scourges I think. The rest Firebrand and I think 1 warrior for the bubble :P

Perhaps a debuff when you are in 600 range of 20+ teammates your aoe number goes down to less than 5.

[zinkz.7045]

@aspirine.5839 said:It's pretty obvious they will nerf scourge...

You must be new.

[reddie.5861]

@"aspirine.5839" said:It's pretty obvious they will nerf scourge, if you take a look at people's squads the main consistency of a group is them.Watched the bandwagon stream of teapot yesterday a bit and of his 50 blob half of them were scourges I think. The rest Firebrand and I think 1 warrior for the bubble :P

Perhaps a debuff when you are in 600 range of 20+ teammates your aoe number goes down to less than 5.

this is why wvw is so freaking stupid on servers that care to win.or bandwagon servers, every1 is running shitty meta no1 even plays what they enjoy i mean nerf scourge and fb to the ground and ull see heal scrappers replace FB and ele's /rev replace scourges but u wont hear any1 cry they just mindless zombies playing w/e some1 tells them too..

this is why i miss core gw2 :( yes it also had meta but it had more classes in it and it was more active back then so uhad more "randoms" as the pro meta players call "us"(me) playing thiefs/rangers/engi's etc.

[aspirine.5839]

@zinkz.7045 said:

@aspirine.5839 said:It's pretty obvious they will nerf scourge...

You must be new.

:D Well I stopped for a while so. But let's call it optimism.

[GDchiaScrub.3241]

It'd lag more.

D:

[Swagger.1459]

@"aspirine.5839" said:Afaik this is still in place right? You can only hit ( I think around 5?But for sure not enough right now) people, but 25+ can still hit you at the same time.So what happens when this is changed, not to max because the server would probably crash and it makes no sense that one meteor show can down half the zerg.

Let's say the max is going to 10 from AOE damage. In that case could 2 or 3 strong small groups of 5 be mobile and strong enough to harash a slow moving zerg enough that it would matter? Would it make the game more or less fun?Could 5 or 10 defender in this case do something enough to not rely on AC fire too much?I always thought I read that it was done not for gameplay reasons, but for server performance. Is it now time to change it up a bit?But perhaps it has some downfalls too that is keeping Anet from implementing it..

I get that you are trying to theorycraft how a smaller group could fend off a larger group, but you should think about this a little more...

"2 or 3 strong small groups of 5" with " max is going to 10 from AOE damage" VERSUS "zerg" with " max is going to 10 from AOE damage"...

Your theory increases all AoE skills to 10 for ALL players, so your idea backfires and makes the larger group even stronger.

[joneirikb.7506]

Yeah basically the target limit works both ways, if your 10 man group can kill a whole zerg if the target cap is increased, then the braindead plaster everything with aoe's from the zerg also becomes stronger.

I've suggested in the past, that if they could link this up to the outnumbered effect, it might work out. If you're outnumbered get a double target limit, so Target:5 woudl become 10 etc. That could be a change that actually benefited the outnumbered to fight against the outnumbering, without midifying/changing the combat system in a 1on1 or 5vs5 situation.

But then again, WvW is about as competitive as Yatzi, so they can just slap up big bonuses to the outnumbered and call it a day.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

assuming the servers and our pcs can handle it, yeah it would make game play way better. people should stop thinking in terms of zerg v zerg. thats not how you take on a group thats 5-6 times your size.

[Kiroshima.8497]

I'd prefer to see target cap reductions on ranged skills by a little, with a small increase for melee-only skills (especially the ones that aren't 5 targets like 100 blades). Cooldown skills like utilities and such are fine with 5 targets since support skills have 5 targets, these match each other properly.

[aspirine.5839]

@Swagger.1459 said:

@"aspirine.5839" said:Afaik this is still in place right? You can only hit ( I think around 5?But for sure not enough right now) people, but 25+ can still hit you at the same time.So what happens when this is changed, not to max because the server would probably crash and it makes no sense that one meteor show can down half the zerg.

Let's say the max is going to 10 from AOE damage. In that case could 2 or 3 strong small groups of 5 be mobile and strong enough to harash a slow moving zerg enough that it would matter? Would it make the game more or less fun?Could 5 or 10 defender in this case do something enough to not rely on AC fire too much?I always thought I read that it was done not for gameplay reasons, but for server performance. Is it now time to change it up a bit?But perhaps it has some downfalls too that is keeping Anet from implementing it..

I get that you are trying to theorycraft how a smaller group could fend off a larger group, but you should think about this a little more...

"2 or 3 strong small groups of 5" with " max is going to 10 from AOE damage" VERSUS "zerg" with " max is going to 10 from AOE damage"...

Your theory increases all AoE skills to 10 for ALL players, so your idea backfires and makes the larger group even stronger.

I thought about that. But right now it makes more sense to zerg vs zerg because of the limit also right? 5 man makes no sense since they cannot hit them all.I know it's not the perfect solution, but I kinda think we need to do something or this gamemode could be blob vs blob forever :(Let's debuff groups larger than 25 in 600 range. Give them weakness or something.

[DemonSeed.3528]

@aspirine.5839 said:

@Swagger.1459 said:

@aspirine.5839 said:Afaik this is still in place right? You can only hit ( I think around 5?But for sure not enough right now) people, but 25+ can still hit you at the same time.So what happens when this is changed, not to max because the server would probably crash and it makes no sense that one meteor show can down half the zerg.

Let's say the max is going to 10 from AOE damage. In that case could 2 or 3 strong small groups of 5 be mobile and strong enough to harash a slow moving zerg enough that it would matter? Would it make the game more or less fun?Could 5 or 10 defender in this case do something enough to not rely on AC fire too much?I always thought I read that it was done not for gameplay reasons, but for server performance. Is it now time to change it up a bit?But perhaps it has some downfalls too that is keeping Anet from implementing it..

I get that you are trying to theorycraft how a smaller group could fend off a larger group, but you should think about this a little more...

"2 or 3 strong small groups of 5" with " max is going to 10 from AOE damage" VERSUS "zerg" with " max is going to 10 from AOE damage"...

Your theory increases all AoE skills to 10 for ALL players, so your idea backfires and makes the larger group even stronger.

I thought about that. But right now it makes more sense to zerg vs zerg because of the limit also right? 5 man makes no sense since they cannot hit them all.I know it's not the perfect solution, but I kinda think we need to do something or this gamemode could be blob vs blob forever :(Let's debuff groups larger than 25 in 600 range. Give them weakness or something.

What if the smaller group had a pulsing "survival aura" which would give them a little bit more sustain against bigger groups? Nothing out of hand of course. The only problems I see with this is if it should be applicable to groups in a set area, or map wide in outnumbered buff.

[Red Haired Savage.5430]

Some skills they should increase the target cap for and others should go down. To me I think all mele AA's should be increased to 3 targets regardless of the weapon. Other skills that are support (looking at you warrior warhorn that does 0 damage, only 1 of 2 weapons in the game that do 0 damage that I know of) should increase targets to 10. At the end of the day however they'd have to look at all individual skills (which they've already done) and decide based on what the skill does if it should increase it's target cap or decrease it's target cap.

[Strider Pj.2193]

Instead of just increasing the target cap, als decrease the area of effect. So, half AOE range but double the cap.

Might punish the people who stack and 'run tight'

Of course, not sure if the ratio would be good, but might be something to look at.

[Lord Trejgon.2809]

there was a time when the target cap was not a thing.

ever seen these vids of 4 eles destroying full zergs on their own? yeah these are from back then.

and tbh when they introduced the target cap I was personally hella sure it was to nerf efficacy of AoE spam ;) only got informed about it being to improve server performance not so very logn time ago

[Kovu.7560]

I once watched a couple of elementalists use their elemental ice bows to take out 50+~ people in an objective circle in EotM.That was soothing.

~ Kovu

[iKeostuKen.2738]

@aspirine.5839 said:

@zinkz.7045 said:

@aspirine.5839 said:It's pretty obvious they will nerf scourge...

You must be new.

optimism.

You still have this? Must not be a engie main.

[RedShark.9548]

all this would do would just benefit the pirateship, melees would be rendered completely useless because you cant split the dmg on your numbers, never do that pls, as a warrior im already way too bored while the zergs ship each other

[hobotnicax.7918]

Horrible suggestion in my opinion. AOE skills should all be lowered to hit 3 enemies at a time. This would combat the braindead skill spam we have right now in WvW to a degree. It won't happen (the lowering), because Anet love cheese and braindead gameplay mechanics.