What happened to Commanders?

[BlueMelody.6398]

@funassistant.6589 said:Commanders in WvW (the good ones that is) belong to GUILDS

GUILDS don't play anymorethere you goanswered

This of course is not true, as I alone run with 2 different guilds in wvw, one of which is a dedicated wvw guild.

There are also plenty of comms on our server; guilds sometimes move in and out, but the number of comms really hasn't changed. During the heavier hours, you usually have your pick of comms on any given map.

Then again, maybe it's because, as I mentioned, I don't see this kind of hypercasual-critiquing-comms behavior that seems to exist elsewhere.

[Rampage.7145]

@Ari.4672 said:

@Rampage.7145 said:

@Ari.4672 said:

@Rayya.2591 said:i do not understand this etheri guy, and why he hate rangers :(

He hates everyone that isn't taking what he dictates - seems to think he is the liege lord by attitude... let me guess, someone who thinks that WvW is pure PvP too where it is 90% PvE

LOL 90% PVE if all u do is cap empty camps and sentries towers and kitten, most real commanders just want to squad up and fight other groups 90% of the time the only moment they will take to cap a camp or a tower is just waiting for the other group to come back, or trying to figure out where they moved and why. U clearly have no idea what WvW is all about run around all day long doing your own thing running from zergs and capping camps. That is a legit way to play the game yet 90% of the people who squad up play exclusively for PvP and fight another blob they have 0 interest in PVE, most of them dont even PVE at all in Gw2, they log in press B go to EBG, press M right click on the commander tag, join squad, join discord, kill mens, log out, rinse and repeat.

REALLY? No idea what WvW you play but it aint on the maps I see.... PvP in massive groups is just hiding behind others - cowards play for people who think they are big lol

Even fighting people hiding in towers or whatever it's PvP by definition, not the PvP we want that is jsut the PvP arenanet likes but hey, it is no dragon stand meta event lets be real.

[Etheri.5406]

@BlueMelody.6398 said:

@funassistant.6589 said:Commanders in WvW (the good ones that is) belong to GUILDS

GUILDS don't play anymorethere you goanswered

This of course is not true, as I alone run with 2 different guilds in wvw, one of which is a dedicated wvw guild.

There are also plenty of comms on our server; guilds sometimes move in and out, but the number of comms really hasn't changed. During the heavier hours, you usually have your pick of comms on any given map.

Then again, maybe it's because, as I mentioned, I don't see this kind of hypercasual-critiquing-comms behavior that seems to exist elsewhere.

I don't know where you play. Maybe in NA.The amount of comms has drastically decreased across EU as a whole. We lost more than half our guilds and more than half our commanders since HoT release, without a doubt.

Deso has comms left? I seem to remember having 1-3 comms every day during prime and active players from very early to very late for over 2 years. Yeah but we still have a few aim commanders and... yeah. Even dye and sov left LUL.

SFR has comms left? Are we talking about elite, or about AG comms aka KISS? Oh wait KISS commander is banned omegaLUL.Piken has comms that will teach you the art of roleplaying.Kodash has some comms... But nowhere near what they used to either. Where'd bonzo go? Where'd nikash go?Gandara... Shmead once upon a blue moon, all the others tried to get into servers that weren't gankdara. Gandara has comms? lul.WSR ... Does perish still lead? Joey? I guess sky, dye, Ng and KILL guildraids will have to do.FSP... Does FSP have commanders? :trollface:RS still has lyroc and disco and aros and ...they only play a fraction of what they used to, and everyone else left too.vabbi has commanders? Jk. most of their core left as well. I heard rav farmed 1 million rangers then uninstalled game.

No worries friends ! Soon there will be constant daily-trains organised by all the casuals on every server to ensure we can do our dailies in WvW at any time. Rejoice!

[Sovereign.1093]

@BlueMelody.6398 said:

@funassistant.6589 said:Commanders in WvW (the good ones that is) belong to GUILDS

GUILDS don't play anymorethere you goanswered

This of course is not true, as I alone run with 2 different guilds in wvw, one of which is a dedicated wvw guild.

There are also plenty of comms on our server; guilds sometimes move in and out, but the number of comms really hasn't changed. During the heavier hours, you usually have your pick of comms on any given map.

Then again, maybe it's because, as I mentioned, I don't see this kind of hypercasual-critiquing-comms behavior that seems to exist elsewhere.

goes to mention since it was summer awhile ago, kids be like on vacation or the parents (older coms) taking kids to vacation.

still lots of old name popping around and seeing whispers from these veterans.

[Warlord.9074]

@Rimu.7105 said:So, I log into play some WvW to make a legendary weapon... (Im personally not a fan of WvW so thats the only reason im doing it) Im on Jade Quarry, a tier 1 server from what ive been told, but there is NEVER a commander on ANY map... before there use to be many commanders one pur map almost at all times...did WvW die any no one tell me?

OK...Plenty of ktrain commanders out there that will gladly let players like the OP follow them around and PPT. The rest of the commanders don't want people like OP following them thats why he can't find them.

If you are only coming to WvW to work on your legendary, than you are not in WvW for the type of game play other commaders want. Chances are you are not going to contribute properly to that commanders sqaud.

[joneirikb.7506]

I vote for putting back Siegerazor, change his programming to walk a clockwise round around the map and grab every tower/keep. If he dies re-spawn him after 5 minutes. Time him to any other Siegerazors on the map (from the other teams) so they don't interact, so they can karma-train the maps in perfect syncro.

I think we would have much less complaints about lacking commanders.

[Dawdler.8521]

@joneirikb.7506 said:I vote for putting back Siegerazor, change his programming to walk a clockwise round around the map and grab every tower/keep. If he dies re-spawn him after 5 minutes. Time him to any other Siegerazors on the map (from the other teams) so they don't interact, so they can karma-train the maps in perfect syncro.

I think we would have much less complaints about lacking commanders.

And then add 50 NPCs that spawn on them and make friendly Siegerazer clash with enemy Siegerazer on the muddle island so we dont have to.

[Rayya.2591]

@Rimu.7105 said:So, I log into play some WvW to make a legendary weapon... (Im personally not a fan of WvW so thats the only reason im doing it) Im on Jade Quarry, a tier 1 server from what ive been told, but there is NEVER a commander on ANY map... before there use to be many commanders one pur map almost at all times...did WvW die any no one tell me?

wvw game mode started to die after wvw season. Since than ppls slowly started to quit wvw , and too few new players joined wvw mode.You can compare the activity now with 1 year ago where on average you had 30-40% more kills on average /matchup or with 2 years ago where you had 100% more kills/matchup . That only show the population dropped to half in 2 years, so over 50% of old players quit wvw, and not enough new players showed interest in wvw.The lack of interest by the developers in wvw mode , sent a lot of players to go on a break, until this game mode will get more attention and updates. Yet wvw game mode doesen;t have a separate skill balance, skills get nerfed or boosted according to pve meta.There were some discutions regarding alliances, and many of us considered to come back ingame once alliances get intro wvw , yet last time i've asked my friends nobody knew if alliances will be implemented and when.So basicaly you shoudn't expect to see more active commanders unless some huge updates come to wvw game mode

[Sovereign.1093]

bring back seasons. the reason why gw2 was great.

[Stormscar.5489]

Irony...

Blobbing even if you are tryharding is still laughably brainless as far as PvP goes, which is the basic issue some can't seem to grasp in this (and many other threads), what sort of players do you think an activity like zerging that is competitively a joke, rather brainless and relatively low skilled going to attract, those casuals are actually what zerging about in WvW is best suited for.

Those who treat zerging as "serious business" are a tragic joke, desperately trying bang a square peg into a round hole as they cling to a game mode that is a feeble shadow of what it once was. One of the reasons why things were different when WvW was alive, was that back then people (other than PPT heroes) didn't take zerging seriously, you did your tryharding on guild raids, not when you were zerging after the raid had finished.

People still playing WvW banging on about skilled, competitive play aren't fooling anyone, no one genuinely concerned about those things is still zerging about in WvW (or even playing it), the Anet guy was right WvW'ers = PvE players.

You are completely clueless and have no idea what you are talking about. First of all, I'm not claiming WvW is the most skill intensive gamemode. Because otherwise I'd just say that GW2 is trash and go play starcraft 2, league of legends at a high level, dark souls etc. But implying it doesn't require skill is stupid. But in reality yes, you don't need much skill atm to beat most blobs on EU except those of 2 servers mostly (WSR and Vabbi). And why is that? Because the average skill of the players is very low, they come on bad builds and don't understand their role. Also I never implied blobbing is more skilled than guild raids. I do have fun more in guild raids, I GvGed with my guild both as a member and the leader. It is a more competitive format.

The brainlessness involved in blobbing nowadays is due to how casual the playerbase is. Not because of the game mode itself (putting aside complaints about the meta). And there is nothing wrong with tryharding both blobbing and in guild raids. Furthermore, there aren't just 2 extremes (be super tryhard or be absolute trash in blobbing). There is a range that could occur. But nowadays the only decent players around are members of good raiding guilds, and we know how small of a percentage those players are compared to the overall playerbase. So it is no suprise some people attempt to form a couple of stacked servers to fight each other to get more enjoyable gameplay.

[Rampage.7145]

@"Stormscar.5489" said:

Irony...

Blobbing even if you are tryharding is still laughably brainless as far as PvP goes, which is the basic issue some can't seem to grasp in this (and many other threads), what sort of players do you think an activity like zerging that is competitively a joke, rather brainless and relatively low skilled going to attract, those casuals are actually what zerging about in WvW is best suited for.

Those who treat zerging as "serious business" are a tragic joke, desperately trying bang a square peg into a round hole as they cling to a game mode that is a feeble shadow of what it once was. One of the reasons why things were different when WvW was alive, was that back then people (other than PPT heroes) didn't take zerging seriously, you did your tryharding on guild raids, not when you were zerging after the raid had finished.

People still playing WvW banging on about skilled, competitive play aren't fooling anyone, no one genuinely concerned about those things is still zerging about in WvW (or even playing it), the Anet guy was right WvW'ers = PvE players.

You are completely clueless and have no idea what you are talking about. First of all, I'm not claiming WvW is the most skill intensive gamemode. Because otherwise I'd just say that GW2 is trash and go play starcraft 2, league of legends at a high level, dark souls etc. But implying it doesn't require skill is stupid. But in reality yes, you don't need much skill atm to beat most blobs on EU except those of 2 servers mostly (WSR and Vabbi). And why is that? Because the average skill of the players is very low, they come on bad builds and don't understand their role. Also I never implied blobbing is more skilled than guild raids. I do have fun more in guild raids, I GvGed with my guild both as a member and the leader. It is a more competitive format.

The brainlessness involved in blobbing nowadays is due to how casual the playerbase is. Not because of the game mode itself (putting aside complaints about the meta). And there is nothing wrong with tryharding both blobbing and in guild raids. Furthermore, there aren't just 2 extremes (be super tryhard or be absolute trash in blobbing). There is a range that could occur. But nowadays the only decent players around are members of good raiding guilds, and we know how small of a percentage those players are compared to the overall playerbase. So it is no suprise some people attempt to form a couple of stacked servers to fight each other to get more enjoyable gameplay.

100% accurate

[Stormscar.5489]

I don't know where you play. Maybe in NA.The amount of comms has drastically decreased across EU as a whole. We lost more than half our guilds and more than half our commanders since HoT release, without a doubt.

Deso has comms left? I seem to remember having 1-3 comms every day during prime and active players from very early to very late for over 2 years. Yeah but we still have a few aim commanders and... yeah. Even dye and sov left LUL.

SFR has comms left? Are we talking about elite, or about AG comms aka KISS? Oh wait KISS commander is banned omegaLUL.Piken has comms that will teach you the art of roleplaying.Kodash has some comms... But nowhere near what they used to either. Where'd bonzo go? Where'd nikash go?Gandara... Shmead once upon a blue moon, all the others tried to get into servers that weren't gankdara. Gandara has comms? lul.WSR ... Does perish still lead? Joey? I guess sky, dye, Ng and KILL guildraids will have to do.FSP... Does FSP have commanders? :trollface:RS still has lyroc and disco and aros and ...they only play a fraction of what they used to, and everyone else left too.vabbi has commanders? Jk. most of their core left as well. I heard rav farmed 1 million rangers then uninstalled game.

No worries friends ! Soon there will be constant daily-trains organised by all the casuals on every server to ensure we can do our dailies in WvW at any time. Rejoice!

There are quite a few of lower quality commanders on deso atm, which obviously for somebody who hasn't seen a decent commander before might appear as good (especially compared to Kiss commanders lol..), so that's why it might seem ok for him. Otherwise, atm there's Tiru, me (I don't expect you to know me since I'm new compared to most commanders you mentioned), 2 commanders from [Loot] and 1 from [Odds].

Also, Kiss isn't on AG, it's on GH (linked to deso atm).

[Etheri.5406]

@"Stormscar.5489" said:

Irony...

Blobbing even if you are tryharding is still laughably brainless as far as PvP goes, which is the basic issue some can't seem to grasp in this (and many other threads), what sort of players do you think an activity like zerging that is competitively a joke, rather brainless and relatively low skilled going to attract, those casuals are actually what zerging about in WvW is best suited for.

Those who treat zerging as "serious business" are a tragic joke, desperately trying bang a square peg into a round hole as they cling to a game mode that is a feeble shadow of what it once was. One of the reasons why things were different when WvW was alive, was that back then people (other than PPT heroes) didn't take zerging seriously, you did your tryharding on guild raids, not when you were zerging after the raid had finished.

People still playing WvW banging on about skilled, competitive play aren't fooling anyone, no one genuinely concerned about those things is still zerging about in WvW (or even playing it), the Anet guy was right WvW'ers = PvE players.

You are completely clueless and have no idea what you are talking about. First of all, I'm not claiming WvW is the most skill intensive gamemode. Because otherwise I'd just say that GW2 is trash and go play starcraft 2, league of legends at a high level, dark souls etc. But implying it doesn't require skill is stupid. But in reality yes, you don't need much skill atm to beat most blobs on EU except those of 2 servers mostly (WSR and Vabbi). And why is that? Because the average skill of the players is very low, they come on bad builds and don't understand their role. Also I never implied blobbing is more skilled than guild raids. I do have fun more in guild raids, I GvGed with my guild both as a member and the leader. It is a more competitive format.

The brainlessness involved in blobbing nowadays is due to how casual the playerbase is. Not because of the game mode itself (putting aside complaints about the meta). And there is nothing wrong with tryharding both blobbing and in guild raids. Furthermore, there aren't just 2 extremes (be super tryhard or be absolute trash in blobbing). There is a range that could occur. But nowadays the only decent players around are members of good raiding guilds, and we know how small of a percentage those players are compared to the overall playerbase. So it is no suprise some people attempt to form a couple of stacked servers to fight each other to get more enjoyable gameplay.

I agree with everything; but the "range" between both extremes is mostly gone.

In the past you had servers with a wide array of more and less skilled players, commanders and guilds doing their own things and styles. And players respected eachother for that, despite occasional drama. You had high-end GvG guilds and commanders and super casual ktrainers at the same time. And players would follow what they enjoyed. Even casual players would try to contribute to their group in the ways they saw fit.

But links destroyed server identity and communities; and overcasual PvE players joining the mode en-masse after gliding + reward updates killed the remaining and made new communities impossible. They expect to jump into WvW, demand to follow a nice organised group without ever organising or respecting these groups. Meanwhile casual commanders and groups constantly struggle to get anyone to follow them, someone to talk to and play casually with them as the pve hordes rather just join the biggest blob that will get them bags without interacting with others, and afk the rest of the time.

So the "half skilled" wvwers; especially the ones that focussed on pug-style gameplay were the first to leave; mostly because the players who followed them wouldn't actually interact or improve with them at all making it impossible to be anything more than a random chatmander. There is no casual friendly server comm anymore. There is no in-betweens as much as there used to be. Most of those players are... also gone.

It's funny cause the reason WvW will never be the style of "jump in and enjoy the gameplay" across most servers / as common as it used to be is because the players that demand it screwed it over and ruined that for everyone, but mostly themselves.

[funassistant.6589]

@"Etheri.5406" said:It's funny cause the reason WvW will never be the style of "jump in and enjoy the gameplay" across most servers / as common as it used to be is because the players that demand it screwed it over and ruined that for everyone, but mostly themselves.

thanks obama

[Etria.3642]

Etheri's description of the keep taking is priceless. True and priceless. We just had a watch-together of the last time we attempted to take fire keep from blackgate(props to bg, it was a fun couple hours) but a few times we had our commander-in-training instruct us to swing right up the steps and literally 30 of us do so, we are getting bags all is well then we realize we are are starting to lose--the greens and folks not in voice didn't swing, they went to the Lord.

Well.Lord in fire keep isn't a cakewalk. They died. Didn't res or did and couldn't get back in.

Also props to our commander in training because it is NOT EASY trying to command when you're in a well known guild. People expect instant success. We practice shifting and dropping veils and suddenly half the people on us are green and wondering why we aren't moving.

I could go on but even though Etheri is criticized he's so right on so much of this. I do feel for the person in the other posts that can't hear but a firebrand IN SQUAD that can capably play and put out stability would still be taken along. A scourge who knew when to bomb as well. Chrono and spellbreaker really need to hear.

If you aren't in squad you don't get heals, stability, boons, rezzes. And as someone who mains druid and soulbeast in pve I don't bring either to wvw zergs. Chrono and scourge. Learning firebrand. We get more than one character slot. Use them!

And be patient with commanders. It is stressful learning cadence and anticipating. A good commander has to know cooldowns not just of his own class but others too. You can't call veil, see it go and call veil again ten seconds later(unless you have more than one chrono or the chrono is forewarned). Same with winds or shades.

Heck. Try commanding sometime. You might suddenly find the demanding pugs you think don't exist.

[zinkz.7045]

@"Stormscar.5489" said:

Irony...

Blobbing even if you are tryharding is still laughably brainless as far as PvP goes, which is the basic issue some can't seem to grasp in this (and many other threads), what sort of players do you think an activity like zerging that is competitively a joke, rather brainless and relatively low skilled going to attract, those casuals are actually what zerging about in WvW is best suited for.

Those who treat zerging as "serious business" are a tragic joke, desperately trying bang a square peg into a round hole as they cling to a game mode that is a feeble shadow of what it once was. One of the reasons why things were different when WvW was alive, was that back then people (other than PPT heroes) didn't take zerging seriously, you did your tryharding on guild raids, not when you were zerging after the raid had finished.

People still playing WvW banging on about skilled, competitive play aren't fooling anyone, no one genuinely concerned about those things is still zerging about in WvW (or even playing it), the Anet guy was right WvW'ers = PvE players.

You are completely clueless and have no idea what you are talking about.

Oh look more irony.

@"Stormscar.5489" said:First of all, I'm not claiming WvW is the most skill intensive gamemode. Because otherwise I'd just say that GW2 is trash and go play starcraft 2, league of legends at a high level, dark souls etc. But implying it doesn't require skill is stupid.

What is stupid is not reading things properly and inferring things that were never there, I did not say it required no skill, I said it was "relatively low skilled", which in the grand scheme of PvP in video games is exactly what it is, if you think blobbing is anything other than that, then you have my commiserations.

@"Stormscar.5489" said:But in reality yes, you don't need much skill atm to beat most blobs on EU except those of 2 servers mostly (WSR and Vabbi). And why is that? Because the average skill of the players is very low, they come on bad builds and don't understand their role. Also I never implied blobbing is more skilled than guild raids. I do have fun more in guild raids, I GvGed with my guild both as a member and the leader. It is a more competitive format.

You've never needed much skill, because the things that go into making skilled gameplay (a significant competitive playerbase, ways to match players/groups of similar ability, skilled combat system, high twitch/mechanical requirement, ways to force multitasking, etc) have always been in short supply in GW2, especially zerging in WvW.

As for guild raids I didn't say you implied blobbing is more skilled, the point was back when WvW was alive you didn't have this crying about blobs because people had the right attitude to it, guild raids was the bit you did your tryharding on, blobbing was quite rightly not taken seriously, because even by GW2's low standards of "skilled PvP" it was considered a joke.

@"Stormscar.5489" said:The brainlessness involved in blobbing nowadays is due to how casual the playerbase is. Not because of the game mode itself (putting aside complaints about the meta).

Completely wrong, blobbing has always been relatively brainless due to the mode/ gameplay. You have one guy that in large part makes decisions for everyone else, decisions that are normally a key part of what makes skilled PvP in games like positioning, when to push, when to back off, etc, and people wonder why it attracts players who don't want to put in effort, it is something where a large part of PvP is handed off to one guy, even if you tryhard.

Then you have that blobbing is ridiculously simplistic and one dimensional, so things like map knowledge are so basic it is laughable, plus that it largely consists of the most basic sort of "deathmatch", so again very easy on the brain don't need much awareness beyond what is right in front of you.

@"Stormscar.5489" said:And there is nothing wrong with tryharding both blobbing and in guild raids. Furthermore, there aren't just 2 extremes (be super tryhard or be absolute trash in blobbing). There is a range that could occur. But nowadays the only decent players around are members of good raiding guilds, and we know how small of a percentage those players are compared to the overall playerbase. So it is no surprise some people attempt to form a couple of stacked servers to fight each other to get more enjoyable gameplay.

Tryharding at blobbing is simply an act of stupidity, nothing about it facilitates good PvP, so unless you are a PvE'er at heart that wants easy, dull fights and bags, (basically you are happy with trash tier PvP) where frankly you don't even have to tryhard the majority of the time, then it is pointless, as is stacking servers, because you won't get enjoyable gameplay, you'll get face roll, and even the supposed "best" matchup that you'll get once a month if you are lucky will actually be trash compared to even a couple of years ago, let alone back pre-HoT.

Which is why players who genuinely want some decent PvP have left over the years (i.e - most WvW players and guilds), the handful of tryhards still playing are basically addicted to the game, so continue to play despite the pitiful state WvW is in and the pitiful gameplay it provides.

Really if even Mr Ravya has got bored of it, then you know you have a problem if you are still playing this mess.

[Etheri.5406]

@Stormscar.5489 said:

I don't know where you play. Maybe in NA.The amount of comms has drastically decreased across EU as a whole. We lost more than half our guilds and more than half our commanders since HoT release, without a doubt.

Deso has comms left? I seem to remember having 1-3 comms every day during prime and active players from very early to very late for over 2 years. Yeah but we still have a few aim commanders and... yeah. Even dye and sov left LUL.

SFR has comms left? Are we talking about elite, or about AG comms aka KISS? Oh wait KISS commander is banned omegaLUL.Piken has comms that will teach you the art of roleplaying.Kodash has some comms... But nowhere near what they used to either. Where'd bonzo go? Where'd nikash go?Gandara... Shmead once upon a blue moon, all the others tried to get into servers that weren't gankdara. Gandara has comms? lul.WSR ... Does perish still lead? Joey? I guess sky, dye, Ng and KILL guildraids will have to do.FSP... Does FSP have commanders? :trollface:RS still has lyroc and disco and aros and ...they only play a fraction of what they used to, and everyone else left too.vabbi has commanders? Jk. most of their core left as well. I heard rav farmed 1 million rangers then uninstalled game.

No worries friends ! Soon there will be constant daily-trains organised by all the casuals on every server to ensure we can do our dailies in WvW at any time. Rejoice!

There are quite a few of lower quality commanders on deso atm, which obviously for somebody who hasn't seen a decent commander before might appear as good (especially compared to Kiss commanders lol..), so that's why it might seem ok for him. Otherwise, atm there's Tiru, me (I don't expect you to know me since I'm new compared to most commanders you mentioned), 2 commanders from [Loot] and 1 from [Odds].

Also, Kiss isn't on AG, it's on GH (linked to deso atm).

My bad. You're right its GH with KISS, and a part of the FSP core as in RT who joined AG with Kazo if i'm not mistaken.

I do know Tiru; who's one of the few old comms left. I hope he's enjoying his T1 adventures. I'm enjoying T5 ;). I think tiru is a good pugmander as long as he isn't triggered or leaping.

[steki.1478]

@Etheri.5406 said:

@Stormscar.5489 said:

I don't know where you play. Maybe in NA.The amount of comms has drastically decreased across EU as a whole. We lost more than half our guilds and more than half our commanders since HoT release, without a doubt.

Deso has comms left? I seem to remember having 1-3 comms every day during prime and active players from very early to very late for over 2 years. Yeah but we still have a few aim commanders and... yeah. Even dye and sov left LUL.

SFR has comms left? Are we talking about elite, or about AG comms aka KISS? Oh wait KISS commander is banned omegaLUL.Piken has comms that will teach you the art of roleplaying.Kodash has some comms... But nowhere near what they used to either. Where'd bonzo go? Where'd nikash go?Gandara... Shmead once upon a blue moon, all the others tried to get into servers that weren't gankdara. Gandara has comms? lul.WSR ... Does perish still lead? Joey? I guess sky, dye, Ng and KILL guildraids will have to do.FSP... Does FSP have commanders? :trollface:RS still has lyroc and disco and aros and ...they only play a fraction of what they used to, and everyone else left too.vabbi has commanders? Jk. most of their core left as well. I heard rav farmed 1 million rangers then uninstalled game.

No worries friends ! Soon there will be constant daily-trains organised by all the casuals on every server to ensure we can do our dailies in WvW at any time. Rejoice!

There are quite a few of lower quality commanders on deso atm, which obviously for somebody who hasn't seen a decent commander before might appear as good (especially compared to Kiss commanders lol..), so that's why it might seem ok for him. Otherwise, atm there's Tiru, me (I don't expect you to know me since I'm new compared to most commanders you mentioned), 2 commanders from [Loot] and 1 from [Odds].

Also, Kiss isn't on AG, it's on GH (linked to deso atm).

My bad. You're right its GH with KISS, and a part of the FSP core as in RT who joined AG with Kazo if i'm not mistaken.

I do know Tiru; who's one of the few old comms left. I hope he's enjoying his T1 adventures. I'm enjoying T5 ;). I think tiru is a good pugmander as long as he isn't triggered or leaping.

Tiru is the biggest booly on deso and he doesn't let us ppt without meta builds.

#PPT4Deso

[Diku.2546]

@"Etheri.5406" said:

I agree with everything; but the "range" between both extremes is mostly gone.

In the past you had servers with a wide array of more and less skilled players, commanders and guilds doing their own things and styles. And players respected eachother for that, despite occasional drama. You had high-end GvG guilds and commanders and super casual ktrainers at the same time. And players would follow what they enjoyed. Even casual players would try to contribute to their group in the ways they saw fit.

But links destroyed server identity and communities; and overcasual PvE players joining the mode en-masse after gliding + reward updates killed the remaining and made new communities impossible. They expect to jump into WvW, demand to follow a nice organised group without ever organising or respecting these groups. Meanwhile casual commanders and groups constantly struggle to get anyone to follow them, someone to talk to and play casually with them as the pve hordes rather just join the biggest blob that will get them bags without interacting with others, and afk the rest of the time.

So the "half skilled" wvwers; especially the ones that focussed on pug-style gameplay were the first to leave; mostly because the players who followed them wouldn't actually interact or improve with them at all making it impossible to be anything more than a random chatmander. There is no casual friendly server comm anymore. There is no in-betweens as much as there used to be. Most of those players are... also gone.

It's funny cause the reason WvW will never be the style of "jump in and enjoy the gameplay" across most servers / as common as it used to be is because the players that demand it screwed it over and ruined that for everyone, but mostly themselves.

---

I believe (pug-style gameplayers) are still here...I'm one of them. I think many are choosing not to tag up anymore because it's thankless & is mainly without meaning since server identity was taken away.

Churn & Burn of Commanders are well underway...

WvW is still "fixable", but sadly our window of opportunity will consistently be squandered (since game launch) by well-meaning developers that don't really grasp concepts behind this game mode...to them this is only a job. My past posts have consistently communicated the same ideas & warnings surrounding WvW...that are based on my love of this game mode.

Tigers can't change their stripes.

It's painful to see the "Golden Goose" slowly starving to death as both players & developers take a selfish or easy way on finding a solution that should fix this game mode.

There is a solution & it's simple btw...

Alliance & Server Linking...Is Not the solution. These options only encourages Long-Term Population Decline & Toxic gameplay.

In the end...it almost seems like both will end with less than what they wanted...as the source of their happiness & revenue diminishes as the WvW ecosystem that somehow managed to survive Pre Server-Linking continues to erode away You can't have a sustainable supply of commanders without providing a calm & safe tide pool...that Lower Tier Servers once provided.

Your post...and many others reference...that there USED TO BE a wider range of play styles, but few folks realize that this was only possible when we had a WvW ecosystem based on Server Identity. I agree with you...that there USED TO BE a wider range of play styles.

Server-Linking is allowing our "WvW Fish Keepers" to dump the baby fry that used to be in the Lower Guest Servers to interact directly into the Bigger Host Server tank...so we're left with a vicious cycle that kills off the babies & only the big fish are allowed to mature & survive. It's no surprise that we end up with Only Big Mature fish in the Tank...and New WvW Players simply turn around & leave...in the Long-Term.

Alliance-Linking will Completely Dump Everybody into Player-Controlled Fish Tanks....that will open the door to a Wider Range of Guild Politics, Power Play, Hypocritical, Self-Serving, etc. behavior that will only encourage Toxic game play...once again...In the Long-Term.

It's not because the game is old, or players are on vacation, etc. The game mode is floundering because choices were made & continue to be made that run Counter to the Long-Term health in regards to its sustainability.

Prime Example of an Old Game still being played & followed passionately by millions:

SuperBowl - First played January 15, 1967 - 51 years agohttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Bowl

p.s.See some of my past posts for details...please vote Helpful or Thumbs up if you agree.

[Junkpile.7439]

So nowadays pugmander means commander that run with guild + zone blob. :D

[Jugglemonkey.8741]

The game is 6 years old, can't expect people to do the same thing indefinitely.

[Sovereign.1093]

time moves forward, we all change.

some will play gw2 and some will move to new games or something else. thats just how things work. =)

[Thelgar.7214]

Big blob fighting used to be a fun time. Nobody took it or themselves that seriously. The commanders were entertainers as much as commanders - and recognized that as part of what got people to follow them. Havok groups ran with varying levels of skill, mostly hanging out and chatting with friends as they contributed in their own way. Serious fight commanders ran tight groups with insane time commitments and strict build requirements and were recognized for what they did and could do. Then, suddenly, not being a "fight commander" meant those other commanders were all kinds of bad things. Everything became serious business and there was no respite from it.

It's like we had this great, fun, everyone plays, softball league and it filled up with angry, bitter, ex-baseball players that took it too seriously.

[Substance E.4852]

@"Diku.2546" said:Alliance-Linking will Completely Dump Everybody into Player-Controlled Fish Tanks....that will open the door to a Wider Range of Guild Politics, Power Play, Hypocritical, Self-Serving, etc. behavior that will only encourage Toxic game play...once again...In the Long-Term.

More than that, it creates a nearly impossible barrier to entry for new players.

Gone will be the days when you could join a server and follow a Tag around and see what the mode is about. (Though you could argue that's already gone)What new players will experience is being dumped into the amalgamated soup of guildless pugs flopping about in constantly rotating match ups that will be indistinguishable from EotM. There will be no server identity and no reason to care if your "team" wins because you have no reason to care as long as you get dem pips.

For those who do want more than that, they will be met with guilds that have been coalesced into alliances. Such a system will put a high value on skill because now guilds have direct control over who they play with. You'll be faced with needing GvG skill but having no means to actually earn that skill.

In the end, the whole mode will just stagnate and rapidly die from people losing interest exponentially as the player pool dries up.

[snarfrificus.4230]

@"Thelgar.7214" said:Big blob fighting used to be a fun time. Nobody took it or themselves that seriously. The commanders were entertainers as much as commanders - and recognized that as part of what got people to follow them. Havok groups ran with varying levels of skill, mostly hanging out and chatting with friends as they contributed in their own way. Serious fight commanders ran tight groups with insane time commitments and strict build requirements and were recognized for what they did and could do. Then, suddenly, not being a "fight commander" meant those other commanders were all kinds of bad things. Everything became serious business and there was no respite from it.

It's like we had this great, fun, everyone plays, softball league and it filled up with angry, bitter, ex-baseball players that took it too seriously.

Completely agreed there mate, this game used to have certain norms and values while playing a GAME for fun!The current stupidity that is going on, is people litterly are having the wrong values for a game meant casually, some 'fighting' commanders even think probably that this game ends into an esport LOL!

Nowadays it is or play serious and show sacrifice instead of just coming together and having a blast, i remember the days when we did quaggan runs (all quaggan potion up, running towards our opponents and some of them also changing into quaggans while laughing about it), but noooo if you do that now you are feeding bla bla bla.

But now everything is a 'must' to be competitive, i play for fun and i play to relax in the gamemode i like indeed without the actual need for competition, getting people with their fun and enthusiasm in.

Some groups do not accept different thinkers, because if they do ooooooo boi! they get crazy, i rather walk alone then to be part of some group like that. I notice the level of students and kids nowadays also has risen a lot, which also does explain a lot as well. This game used to be run more by adults with fun alliances not little boys in their mothers basements.