Upcoming Warclaw bug fixes/changes

[LimeTwyst.7039]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

@Cronos.6532 said:Could you also add a net throw Trick (AoE targetted throw like Target Painter) that prevents a large number of players from mounting up without putting them in combat?

Yes, this is something we've thought about. The main thing I don't like about it is the user experience of trying to use inventory items. Especially during conflict.

Make it a mount skill, no trap please. I'm not sure I like the idea of it hitting multiple players at once. Guess it could be an AOE though. And I like the idea of it being dodge-able. If it hits, both players are yanked off their mounts and pulled into combat. If it misses, both stay mounted.

Battle Maul should also dismount enemy player on hit, as someone previously mentioned above.

Also add a siege skill or tactic for dismounts. I like the idea up there of the 'no-mount debuff on enemies' tactic being pulled at a keep.

Breakbar- yes. I shouldn't be able to leap through a choke point and smash into the backline on the other side. It's been great fun, but it's OP.

[coro.3176]

Ugh.. medium-long term for a dismount skill? Roaming is dying now! We can't wait a year for a fix here..

Can we at least have a band aid fix - something like reducing warclaw health so that one pounce or attack is enough to dismount a player?

[Karnasis.6892]

Any way.. Also Can mounts "prevent capture-point contribution" too ? This would stop players from sitting on a 10k health mount while capturing a camp or something like a KEEP. Please consider this and read every detailed comment on this post.

WvW, the no fun game mode since apparently mounts "ruin" the wvw experience by giving everyone essentially an extra 10k hp (like that's even hard to deal with but ok). If I'm capping a zone and on a mount I essentially can't do anything if you contest, I can't use skills outside of exploiting the game without getting off my mount. That's the tradeoff, I get 10k hp but can't actually deal a lot of damage without dismounting.

And it's not like I can just run away if I want you to stop contesting, I'll have to get off my mount to do so. Sitting on mounts just stops (or just slows down) players from killing each other out of nowhere in a one shot build....

[Hadi.6025]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 I know you said you weren't considering adding more to the war claw Chain pull skill, but why not consider it at the expense of supply? 10 supply for 1 chain pull dismount on both players? 15/20 second ICD 900 range? for ranged dismounts on players who are run in their territory ? and can only be used against mounts.

[Lightning Xv.8705]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Update on the stealth issues. We've decided that the Warclaw will no longer be able to be stealthed. Updated the original post.

What about reducing mount HP to 5.9k like the jackal(evade mechanic is basically the same)? A dismount skill is nice but with 3 evades your chance of it being dodged would be rather high. Missing means the target I assume would be mounted while you would be dismounted. At the moment few classes have the ability to drop the 10-12k HP before you can just run well out of range with all the evades. The 5.9k health would make it so the maul skill plus 1-3 more hits depending on build/class would dismount a player.

[sephiroth.4217]

@Chaba.5410 said:

@yorick.1305 said:

@Chaba.5410 said:

@Joey.2769 said:Remove stealth on mounts and fix server lag caused by mounts. Please make that priority 1.

Seconding this. Remove the stealth.

Mount has stealth? If that's from other classes, nerf THEM, not the mount.

Yes, mount can be stealthed. Make it like gliding where stealth is removed when activating the glider.

Im not a fan of the stealth either but its much better than the pirate ship we had for years.

[fuzzyp.6295]

Thank for these changes!!! Being able to unmount opposing players will bring the war back into this PvP mode. It's really infuriating right now to have to no reason to engage with opponents because of how safe the mount is. There needs to be some risk to moving on your own in WvW, thats why its a combat mode about zergs. If you on your own, you're on your own because you can handle it. I look forward to these changes. But please don't just stop at the trap. I think the break bar is probably the "best" idea, but I would personally love a de-mounting skill that lets us get right into combat.

Most of all, thank you for being open with your path forward and looking for input from the community. Looking forward to see how we can make the mount work better.

[Kylden Ar.3724]

@Lonami.2987 said:As for the Path of Fire requirement, I would remove it altogether. WvW mounts would be useless in PvE anyway.

Not going to happen and everyone needs to just give up on that idea. They did not do it for gliders, they will not do it for mounts.

The entire point is to get F2P and Alt Accounts to pony up the cash for HoT and PoF. They are not going to remove that reason.

[Queen Anastasia.7103]

Good to see changes coming to stealthed mounts no longer being a thing.

Those who seriously think we don't need a dismount skill are either new to WvW and have zero insight/afterthought riding that sweet get out of jail free card new shiny WvW mount or are special snowflake PvE players who want to watch WvW burn and despise anything to do with having their character die outside of their safezone PvE-land. It's WvW. You kill people there. People prancing around on mounts avoiding combat because whoever dismounts first is at a disadvantage is unbalanced. Zergers (probably necros/guards/revs) with some form of attention span longer than 5 seconds/situational awareness should be fine with their triple evade Timmy edition 10k HP mount. It's not like you have to run through the most obvious straight outta' spawn high dense traffic route to get back to your zerg (there are other ways around, who would have thought).

Incorporate dismount on successful battle maul (for both players involved) or as the devs said - some additional skill that does that function. Make the dismount traps if you really want to, anyone with half a brain cell will know to avoid high traffic routes/choke points where one might be lurking near a camp. It's laughable to see some people in here really think there's gonna be a million of these traps littered around WvW when 80% of the players on a map who just lost an objective can't even be bothered to predetermine where the enemy will obviously hit next and lay down supply/stealth traps.

TLDR: combat exists in WvW there needs to be counterplay for successfully landing a skill that will dismount both mounted players so combat can carry on as usual.

[Karnasis.6892]

TLDR: combat exists in WvW there needs to be counterplay for successfully landing a skill that will dismount both mounted players so combat can carry on as usual.

I like the mount the way it is, it's been fine running around roaming and zerging. It excels the most getting from place to place, with a tiny benefit of possibly doing something extra. If you use it that way, you'll still get fights, you will still take objectives. If you are having a problem dealing with someone running away, then we should nerf all of the classes too, since many have ways of circumventing combat, or take 0 damage and can run forever. This is just giving all classes that ability to get away from a bad situation.

We don't need a dismount skill.

[Kayos Z Amakan.9162]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:

@Cronos.6532 said:Could you also add a net throw Trick (AoE targetted throw like Target Painter) that prevents a large number of players from mounting up without putting them in combat?

Yes, this is something we've thought about. The main thing I don't like about it is the user experience of trying to use inventory items. Especially during conflict.

Not directly related to the topic, but would effect it if implemented; since we already have a special skill option in pve (most recently used in being able to throw squired dragonspears), would it be possible to be able to bind an inventory item such as siege/traps/tricks to that special skill to quickly bring out what it is we want to chuck out?

Or has there been thought of adding a wvw unique UI for siege, similar to how we can quickly access novelties (given that they used to be inventory activated items as well?)

I feel that the former would also apply to how the dismounting ability might be implemented, since we kind of have that special skill in PoF story in multiple instances, such as in lassoing mobile targets when they are in range.

[oOStaticOo.9467]

At this point, why even bother keeping the kitten mount? Gutting it to the point of non-usefulness. Might as well just remove it. So dumb.

[Strider Pj.2193]

@oOStaticOo.9467 said:At this point, why even bother keeping the kitten mount? Gutting it to the point of non-usefulness. Might as well just remove it. So dumb.

Well, what would all the PvE people come to WvW to do then?

[HazyDaisy.4107]

@oOStaticOo.9467 said:At this point, why even bother keeping the kitten mount? Gutting it to the point of non-usefulness. Might as well just remove it. So dumb.

Because keeping it would make (if these people exist) those that worked so hard to find and overly point out the faults of the mount in order to maybe eradicate it all the more Haha.

I wish they'd done the same with previous test items that some people found useful instead of flat out removing those things because it didn't suit others.

[Eramonster.2718]

@"Ben Phongluangtham.1065"Not sure if this is possible; a "special action key" will appear when we target/click a mounted player.

• Using the "special action key" will consume a trap charge in inventory. Wouldn't trigger if target is not in range or no trap charges in inventory.
• Need it to be range, 1200 r sounds fair(avg range for all range classes).
• Can be used while not mounted(for players without expansion and not mounted players stucked in combat). Dismounts the user on use.
• Unblockable, guardians have aegis up full time etc.
• Not sure if the trap should be merged with target painter? The trap is pointless atm and prefer not to have another trap taking a bag slot.

A big "IF" there's a breakbar :smile:. A new mounted skill "Roar!" ; AoE for breakbar/dismount? Not sure how the breakbar idea will work, will it just stun the mount or dismount the player altogether? If it's just the mount, will the stun be removed if the player chosed to ditch his stunned mount?

[sephiroth.4217]

@oOStaticOo.9467 said:At this point, why even bother keeping the kitten mount? Gutting it to the point of non-usefulness. Might as well just remove it. So dumb.

Because after its fixed it will still serve as a good addition to WvW?You'll still be gettin around faster and there will be new mechanics and a shift in META.

[whoknocks.4935]

@"Lishtenbird.2814" said:As a primarily PvE player who got back into WvW only because of Warclaw's speed and safety of traversal, I dislike the idea of a dismount skill. It will just bring back the ganking and have the trolls - oh, pardon me, "roamers" - rejoice, while encouraging the new WvW players to return back to their previous activities. Traps - I can understand; they require planning and cost time and supply, but not a ranged mount skill.

If it still happens, I would hope that other limitations are considered extra to "dismounts both players", such as:

• being a fairly long channel that roots you in place (so that you can dismount someone who's trying to get into a tower by timing the skill, but not just gank anyone catching up to the zerg from afar),
• requires supply so that it's not spammable without resupplying,
• has a minimum number of players required to trigger - like, you can dismount a group of, say, 3 roamers in a terrifying AoE roar, but not a single scrub catching up to their tag,
• or if that's a ranged attack like a thrown lance, that should at least be evadable,
• knockdowns the player who used the dismount skill.

Otherwise the new mount's usefulness will be hampered even more - and it already feels anemic after the nerfs.

If you come to WvW to avoid fights, that's a reason why you are only a PvE player and it's just better stick to it instead.

To be honest ganks are even more frequent now, you are in combat and people chase you forever with the mount speed and kill you.

WvW is a war zone map, if you like the safety, stick to PvE mobs, it's safe there and you can avoid them easily.

[Tyyphoon.5301]

Wow, Warclaw hasnt even been out for 1 month yet and its already getting nerfed to the ground due to fairweather and troll QQs. Lol. Might as well just rollback pre-WvW mount era and refund all our mount-related purchases. RIP.

I was hoping we would get mounted combat in the future...but wow, this just killed it before it even had a chance to begin.

What a way to squander resources that could have gone towards WvW alliances features.

[Blocki.4931]

@Tyyphoon.5301 said:Wow, Warclaw hasnt even been out for 1 month yet and its already getting nerfed to the ground due to fairweather and troll QQs. Lol. Might as well just rollback pre-WvW mount era and refund all our mount-related purchases. RIP.

I was hoping we would get mounted combat in the future...but wow, this just killed it before it even had a chance to begin.

What a way to squander resources that could have gone towards WvW alliances features.

Sorry, but there was no chance in hell to ever get mounted combat. The way mounts function in this game simply doesn't allow it.

[sephiroth.4217]

@Tyyphoon.5301 said:Wow, Warclaw hasnt even been out for 1 month yet and its already getting nerfed to the ground due to fairweather and troll QQs. Lol. Might as well just rollback pre-WvW mount era and refund all our mount-related purchases. RIP.

I was hoping we would get mounted combat in the future...but wow, this just killed it before it even had a chance to begin.

What a way to squander resources that could have gone towards WvW alliances features.

Refer to the post above yours.

The only thing that will end up changing is that youre not guaranteed safe passage in a warzone anymore when travelling to your zerg, which is the way it has been since release.

Theres literally like 50 maps you can go too if you don't enjoy open world pvp.

[Kicast.1459]

@Ben Phongluangtham.1065 said:Update on the stealth issues. We've decided that the Warclaw will no longer be able to be stealthed. Updated the original post.

What were the issues?

[joneirikb.7506]

• Make battle maul do +x% damage against mounted characters, in order to quick fix a dismount skill. Example if Dismount does +400% dmg against mounted characters, it would do almost enough damage to dismount with the direct damage, and the bleed should be just enough to dismount afterwards. Might be the easiest way to create a dismount.

Traps:

• I understand that making a "trap" is an easy/low effort way to make a counter, it's better than nothing, but as Ben noted, it's not optimal to go through inventory each time.
• Depending on how much work it is, I've always wanted a sort of "Quick Items" bar that lets you put items into slots F6-F10 (I don't think they're currently used for anything in-game?) That would allow players to pre-set 5 items like siege, traps, food etc without having to go through inventory each time. I understand this probably takes a good bit of work (UI, coding, testing).
• Another option would be to stuff traps into the "Novelties" section, thus allowing us to use that silly button for something useful in WvW.
• Depending on some of the other options here, it might be worthwhile to combine several/all traps into 1, might make them more tempting to use, but also gives the risk of triggering for the wrong reason (dismounts and takes away supply when you really wanted it to reveal instead for example).

[Manuhell.2759]

@whoknocks.4935 said:

If you come to WvW to avoid fights, that's a reason why you are only a PvE player and it's just better stick to it instead.

To be honest ganks are even more frequent now, you are in combat and people chase you forever with the mount speed and kill you.

WvW is a war zone map, if you like the safety, stick to PvE mobs, it's safe there and you can avoid them easily.

We already had classes able to do so, or even to escape in the middle of the fight and come back after they recovered (and keep doing that until they killed the opponent). So, are they getting a nerf in their mobility as well? Or escaping and avoiding fights is fine in that case?Cause the only thing that changed with the mount is that everyone else can avoid fights as well (albeit not necessarily escape from them). And now it's being severely neutered.But either this is in issue, or it is not. If it's an issue, then fix it for everyone. Instead of just nerfing the mounts.

[alexdpsg.8549]

break bar for mounts is a good change, can not happen fast enough. Stealth was buggy way before mounts

[Fat Disgrace.4275]

@Manuhell.2759 said:

@"whoknocks.4935" said:

If you come to WvW to avoid fights, that's a reason why you are only a PvE player and it's just better stick to it instead.

To be honest ganks are even more frequent now, you are in combat and people chase you forever with the mount speed and kill you.

WvW is a war zone map, if you like the safety, stick to PvE mobs, it's safe there and you can avoid them easily.

We already had classes able to do so, or even to escape in the middle of the fight and come back after they recovered (and keep doing that until they killed the opponent).

I don't understand?? How are they able to kill you when you both reset? Surely you are able to wp out when they try to reset, of if not then run the other way and force them classes to burn more stuff up to re-close the gap.

When even I tried to do that reset "trick" the other guy has either wp out or also reset and back to full health