Why do you expect so much from people in Dragon's End meta?!?! [Merged]

[quaniesan.8497]

On 3/2/2022 at 11:16 AM, Deadran.7345 said:

I'd rather they keep it challenging so that more of the casual playerbase simply has to "step it up" and get "better" overall so that the group content gets more enjoyable throughout the game.

Some people have a job you know.    You might be step it up on that regard too so you can understand the other side a little.   What kind of events that everyone have to cheese wipe to win?   Some elitists among the devs also that need to be called out.  This is an open map event, for god's sake.  Set your expectation right.

[kharny.3284]

great ideas, I would like it to be hard, but doable in a not too organised group, this is after all open world content.

[Friday.7864]

Another observation:
Everyone plays new classes in strikes and their damage is pretty much horrible - but you make it through without major issues. Content that's supposed to be more challenging than metas has no dps checks and no timer to ruin your run at launch.

An open world meta on the other hand is an elitist clusterkitten.
They can't even slash the boss HP a bit as a temporary fix so people can experience the expansion in full...

[tekhiun.8653]

Please ,  lets us unlock the mount collection  by just completing the story step that leads us to Dragon's End.  I have  used over 20 hours now trying to beat the meta.  I have seen everything from people being toxic to new players in the map to other purposely sabotaging the meta now.  The whole thing is not fair to players that cant invest hours upon hours  in the game and also people that can.  

[radium.7350]

Changes to this event have to be done fast, because every failed meta is driving more and more people away from this meta and this map in general. What is worse, it damages community. Language and behaviour of some people in failing metas is disgusting. People are blaming eachothers on witch hunt levels. In discussions of this meta in different forums and threads there is people telling how they got picked out, harrashed and bullied on map chat and whispers for "failing the meta". There has been people raging wanting a possibility to kick people out of maps. Open world maps! Is this really what Anet wants from EoD ? Should be called EoC - End of Community.

[Einsof.1457]

14 hours ago, Savoren.3910 said:

Talk about irony. If you want a challenge, gather a squad, make sure to not do any pre events to not get the buff and do the meta like that. This meta is way too overtuned and it needs to be nerfed significantly. I seriously doubt anyone enjoys wasting 2 hours of their lives only to fail the meta and return empty handed, as this meta is nothing but an absolute waste of time as it currently is.

If you dont enjoy it, dont do it. Problem solved. 

[kharmin.7683]

10 minutes ago, Einsof.1457 said:

If you dont enjoy it, dont do it. Problem solved. 

It's not about enjoying it.  It's about gate-keeping things behind a meta event that has a very high failure rate.

[Einsof.1457]

4 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

It's not about enjoying it.  It's about gate-keeping things behind a meta event that has a very high failure rate.

Why are you surprised? I don't get it. End game stuff is behind end game content. You can't expect everything to be hand delivered to you or AFK-able. The entitlement is off the charts. 

[Necrosian.1359]

6 minutes ago, Einsof.1457 said:

Why are you surprised? I don't get it. End game stuff is behind end game content. You can't expect everything to be hand delivered to you or AFK-able. The entitlement is off the charts. 

Tis isn't end game tho, this is an OPEN WORLD META EVENT where EVERYONE CAN ATTEND. Even little Timmy who used lvl booster to get there. Mechanics aren't even hard they're just abusable and boss itself is far too tight for most open world groups.

Not to mention you can't expect everyone to be raid ready with meta builds/gear. From what i remember only 10% of player have completed raids.

Edited March 4, 2022 by Necrosian.1359

[Einsof.1457]

10 minutes ago, Necrosian.1359 said:

Tis isn't end game tho, this is an OPEN WORLD META EVENT where EVERYONE CAN ATTEND. Even little Timmy who used lvl booster to get there. Mechanics aren't even hard they're just abusable and boss itself is far too tight for most open world groups.

Not to mention you can't expect everyone to be raid ready with meta builds/gear. From what i remember only 10% of player have completed raids.

Yeah, it's open to everyone and it teaches everyone how to work together. This is a cornerstone component of an MMORPG (remember you are playing an online game). If anything, GW2 needs more content that brings people UP in skill level rather than trying to cater to the lowest common denominator. There is no way people can work together unless there is content that incentivizes working together. 

Edited March 4, 2022 by Einsof.1457

[Necrosian.1359]

12 minutes ago, Einsof.1457 said:

Yeah, it's open to everyone and it teaches everyone how to work together. This is a cornerstone component of an MMORPG (remember you are playing an online game). If anything, GW2 needs more content that brings people UP in skill level rather than trying to cater to the lowest common denominator. There is no way people can work together unless there is content that incentivizes working together. 

That's for raids and fractals, here you are at mercy of randoms and/or trolls and that very bad game design.

[Savoren.3910]

1 hour ago, Einsof.1457 said:

If you dont enjoy it, dont do it. Problem solved. 

That's not how it works. The problem isn't solved, because one of the most advertised features of the expansion is still gated behind that overtuned mess Anet tries to pass as a meta.

[kharny.3284]

-gating a major salespoint of the expansion behind a hard raidlevel encounter is bad design to the level of world of warcraft's current designers....

-making open world content harder and more punishing than raids is idiotic in the extreme, this fight should be the "hardmode raidversion" of the event, with a much less nasty version in the meta.

-people are seriously currently trying to kick/bribe/harass others from "their" maps to make full raidgroups in there...it's killing one out of only 4 new zones....

[Forum Moderator.3419]

Hello Everyone,

Just a reminder to keep it civil and avoid attacking each other.

Regards.

[Brangwen Liana.5632]

I have tried this meta 13 times so far. It pretty much sucked up two days of play with no reward to speak of. I actually like the map and the meta. I think the meta, like many others, is too hard for open world content. Here is what I have noticed over the 13 tries. 
1. The tsunami mechanic with the orange half circle happens too often. We will just start doing dps on Soo Won and that will happen and we have to stop attacking. It is a boss fight so some of that is expected, but the cadence of it is way off. 
2. Too many enemies in the fight zone. Some have recommended they be halved, and I agree. Expect those enemies to be there, but not so many. 
3. There are people who want to skip the green circles all together, or just have 1 person do it, and come back quickly to end those phases. Since achievements are tied to doing that phase, its very hard to get people who want the achieves to not stand in the circles so that they can both do the mechanic, the fight is designed for it after all, and get the achieves tied to doing that mechanic.
4. Yesterday afternoon and evening I saw what seemed like glitches where Soo Won was stuck. This was after the patch where this was supposed to have been fixed. 
I really think this fight should have been set up like Dragonstorm. A public fight a little less punishing and completable, and then a private squad option mostly at the level it is now for those who want to go in and have the harder mechanic. This is a big deal because you tied the Siege Turtle Mount mastery to the meta. I know the mechanic, but if you can have 1 thing go wrong and it wipes because of that, the mechanic is too tight. Most players are casual and don't do fractals, raids and strikes. 

[Joraan Adenard.2061]

I've finally been able to complete after numerous tries.

I think the meta should remain challenging BUT the wisp phase should be reworked.  The only reason this phase feels awful is because if only one person fails it, not only did the whole group waste 2 precious minutes but you also don't get the buff, and that alone can mean failing the whole meta. It also allows griefing/trolling which has no place in an OW meta. The group I was in did amazing DPS, was in voice-comms, was quick to react and succeeded in both wisp phases, and yet we only had 2 min to spare. If we had a griefer, that amazing group would have failed, and that's unacceptable.

 

There's a way to keep it challenging, requiring players to up their game, without failing a whole group for one single person's mistake. You can't choose your team in an OW meta.

Edited March 4, 2022 by Joraan Adenard.2061

[Vlad Morbius.1759]

The final battle is the most convoluted mess of mechanics I've ever experienced in gaming. There is little to no strategy because all of it constantly pops and it is completely overwhelming to new players trying to beat it. This is like you tossed every known mechanic into one fight and hoped for the best, brutal design. Not to mention that it is very easy for people to bug it out purposely which leads to people just leaving mid fight. The meta was not properly tested and shouldn't have been released, especially in light of the ability to bug it out because we know there is one in every group selfish enough to do it. Go back to the drawing board, bloody awful!

Edited March 4, 2022 by Vlad Morbius.1759

[inaho.2046]

So did it again this morning (Time #19 since it dropped) had 3 commanders, and everything was explained to everyone. Especially about not standing in the greens. Sure enough, I person just had to stand in the green and ruin it for everyone - and about 3/4 of the peopel in the map just left then and there rather than try to finish the fight (knowing it was impossible to finish given the short timer). The whole meta has made the jade sea map outright toxic at this point. There is more than a little anger and grief about a meta that one person can wipe for everyone in open world. One person wiping everybody when you're in an open world map with no control who gets in is madness. This needs to be fixed, or the turtle needs to drop from finishing the story. This meta isn't fun or challenging, it's simply depressing. Especially with peopel taking joy in standing in greens to foil the meta.

[Brangwen Liana.5632]

There is an achievement, Untamed Spirit, that gives a mastery point. You can only get that if you stand in the green circle and become a spirit, and make your way back to the fight without getting hit. Is it that people are trying to grief the fight, or are they trying to get that achieve? Anyone who is an achieve hunter is going to have looked the achieves up and want to get it. The mechanic of the fight should not be so hard that people wanting that achieve can never get it in order to complete the fight successfully. 

[Lupini.6938]

I've tried to keep up with replies, but not sure I saw this discussed much.

Summary:  this open map meta is punishing differently-abled people in ways that for which the "Get Gud" crowd just has no empathy.

My housemate is on the spectrum.  On the whole, he does really well with the Open PvE content of the game.  He has completed all the story lines by himself with the exception of  "Hearts and Minds."  If we play together, I let him take the lead so I don't push too much at him. He has all the masteries except those for raiding and fractals.  He doesn't pretend that he is "good," but he enjoys the game.  He believes me when I say he would not enjoy raiding, challenge mode strikes, etc. He's been able to complete every other map meta (and the Marionette) WITHOUT the terror that he will mess it up for everyone, and actually finding some things that improved his performance that I hadn't known about. 

My housemate was REALLY excited about the siege turtle.  He bought the expansion before I did.  He took launch day off,  pushed through the story, got to the end zone, and it's been nothing but misery since then.  While I started out taking things slowly and enjoying the journey, I've had to rush to the end myself to try and figure out what is problematic for him.  He's fine with commands on "stop attacking," "dodge," "go to ***," "CC!" etc.  But when the commanders start doing what is basically a pre-raid run through of builds and buffs, and then does a ready check...he is lost.  It is a real anxiety that he will do something (or fail to do something) and the group will fail.  He has just left the map when the meta started now because he doesn't want to screw it up for others.

That isn't good game design.

This event is in a stinking open map.  Sure, go ahead and  have some unique mechanics, but not this mechanic bloat.   It is gating something that we were all led to believe we could obtain, no matter the play level.  I wonder how many other people that have various issues or abilities are not able to complete this content--how many kids that were excited about their own Battle Turtle are now stuck.

Don't kittening "Get Gud" at us.

Edited March 5, 2022 by Lupini.6938

[Cranberry.5849]

I would like to compliment Anet for the design mechanics of this Meta. I believe it was fun and well-made [Excluding the wisp mechanic]. The issue is that the meta  is ridiculously overtune and the wisp mechanic doesnt help it either. Some first timers who are doing the wisp mechanics will not know what to do and because of that the entire meta will fail.

 

Initially when I first started playing this meta. I heard in map chat people complaining if Anet even play test this meta before they release it. I am thinking "Duh of course they must have play test this! That is what a game company should do before they release any kind of content" But now I am beginning to doubt myself.

 

After my 5th fail in the Meta. I am done. Wasted 10 whole hours in the game with no reward whatsoever. I wont be playing it again until Anet do something about this.

 

To those who did it more than me, clocking more than 20 hours of playtime and still did not get their turtle. I feel you! Don't keep punishing yourself and play something else instead until they rebalanced this ridiculously overtune  Boss.

[Necrosian.1359]

2 minutes ago, Cranberry.5849 said:

To those who did it more than me, clocking more than 20 hours of playtime and still did not get their turtle. I feel you! Don't keep punishing yourself and play something else instead until they rebalanced this ridiculously overtune  Boss.

Yeah that's my idea too. Gave up on it already.

[Xephir.7635]

Just add 4 more minutes ro meta or 6. Done. Meta will get completed. No wipes. Done.

[Avanijade.5620]

I would like the chime in currently the End of Dragon meta event is currently unbeatable and im pretty frustrated. I haven't heard of anyone who has completed the event.

 

Some issues incl:

1. Green circles/wisp phases are a complete mess. Currently the whole map can't avoid the wisps as the whole map isn't coordinated enough to listen to comms and avoid green circles. In the same breath they also arent coordinated enough to do the intended mechanic.

 

Please fix this mechanic so if a few people fail the mechanic the whole meta doesn't fail.

 

2. It takes a long time, between 1- 2 hours. And everything in the meta other than the final chest (which noone has achieved yet) is not worth the effort put in just for the event to fail. You could add 10 minutes to the boss timer/ fix the tail mechanic there's a clear target and a bit more time to kill it.

 

I'm pretty disappointed I just want to get the turtle mount 🐢

[Vlad Morbius.1759]

No quest should have that many mechanics up at one time especially in an open map with this moronic achievement tied to it. I swear this is the worst gaming experience I've ever had in an MMO. Every mechanic hits with seconds over and over again, it is a bloated festering pile of a design and most certainly should not be tied to a major feature promised in the expack. it's a festering pile of shite! And by the way where the hell is the feedback , has everyone gone home for the day?????

Edited March 4, 2022 by Vlad Morbius.1759