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How do you stick with one profession?


Doctor Hide.6345

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20 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

   No you not; you can just play roaming and unlock everything that game mode has (which in terms of rewards is the less bountiful game mode) without even moving from a class, and pretty much the same can be said for PvP and PvE.

   The notion that you "need" to migrate to other professions just due the meta changes is just ridiculous; even if GW2 is fairly accessible in terms of alt gearing due the horizontal progression and shared gear, most of MMOs don't work in that way and you usually have to grind just to keep a single character "on track". Sure, you CAN multiclass IF you want, but if you want to remain 100% focused in a single profession in GW2 you can do it and have plenty of success without much troubles.

   I think that the problem Doctor Hide has is more related with the lack of defined notion of what He wants instead of a "fear" of chosing a class He's worried about being nerfed. GW2 currently has 9 core classes + 27 specializations, so is really hard to find out a class which is 100% garbage at every game mode in every of the iterations available.

That is terrible advice. You're telling someone that is playing an MMO to not play with other players in squads in WVW or instanced content.

I know those sorts of players, they end up being quite bitter at the game. Queue the hundreds of threads about rangers getting instakicked in WvW or reapers being instakicked in PVE when they were sub 28K.

If you are talking about PVP in particular people want specific roles for ATs as well ; if a spec if terrible in 2v2/3v3 you are gimping yourself to play it.

Edited by Infusion.7149
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On 12/16/2022 at 7:00 PM, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

 

Well, I already have that to an extent. I have 16 characters now with double of each profession(raced change to human from sylvari), and I did the story already on one. All my characters are 80 as well with all elite unlocks with about 6 in all ascended gear for specific meta builds. The rest are just exotics. I just keep jumping between them all though. For example, I got into a castlevenia mood, so I use the chain whip skin for my Dragon Hunter, but I saw the lastest metabattle change and it is now LB and GS which just killed my mood for it even though I still like it for castlevenia feel. Or I watch Harry Potter, and I want a wand feel. So I look at all the meta builds with wands and can't decide which one I want to play. Theme impacts my mood a lot from media on what my interests dictate.

I guess I better sit down and make a list huh of pros and cons to decide which ones I want to multi-class.

 

The key to playing all professions is to have a great understanding of the game's combat mechanics.  Don't chase meta-builds, you can derive your own.  

I play every professions, with multiple builds on every professions.  Instead of sticking to any profession, I simply play whetever professions I feel like on the day.  I also play PvP, PvE, and some WvW.  I have builds for every profession in every game mode (except raids).  I change it up based on what kind of style I feel like playing.

Chasing meta builds is only recommended if you don't have masterful knowledge of a particular profession.  Meta builds are shared for those who don't understand their mechanics well enough to create their own, effective build.  Rather than chasing changing metas, play all your characters to the extreme limit.  You will fail a lot, but you'll learn so much about the classes.  You'll also understand the limitations of every profession, helping you fight every profession more effectively.

Experience over time supercedes  meta builds every time.  So, rather than worrying about sticking to one profession, just play the game with any random profession you feel like.  Pushing the limits every time will develop that base of knowledge and player skill that will replace any need to rely on meta builds.  

Meta builds are assistive devices to help players, and should not be the end step of being a better player.  Since you play every profession, you can develop to be one of the more adaptable players in the game.  Balance patches never affect me, and with time, they won't affect you, either.  

 

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Put me down on team You Don't Have To.

I can see the argument for needing to commit somewhat to mastering specific builds in order to commit to high-end content, but that's they key: commit to builds, not professions. Fractals can make it inconvenient to switch (the likely reason firebrand was much more common in fractals than raids or strikes was that dragonhunter and willbender don't offer anything that firebrand can't do, so people who have their fractal stuff on a guardian are likely to stick to firebrand even for DPS when in raids or strikes they might be likely to switch characters if quickness is already covered), but in other modes it's often beneficial to be able to flex into multiple roles in order to cover your team's needs. Covering all common endgame roles on one profession can really only be practically done on engineer, although revenant and elementalist come close - otherwise, it's highly likely that your squads would appreciate it if you had one character for quickness, one for alacrity, and maybe more for DPS options or dealing with the peculiarities of specific encounters. So while it's impractical and probably not helpful to try to get all nine professions up to endgame standard simultaneously, having 2-4 rather than one is probably beneficial.

As an example, I currently have one character I typically bring for healquick or quickdps in squad PvE, and another I typically bring for alacdps, power, or condi DPS, and a third in reserve for specific mechanics. I'm still technically lacking an alacheal, but at the moment it's rare enough that that is missing when it's needed that I haven't felt the need to make one. I have another profession I typically bring to sPvP, and it's beneficial to be able to swap roles there for better party balance - currently, I swap builds on the same character, but in the past it has been more of a case of 'oh, we already have X covered, I'll switch to another character'. And I have a different profession altogether that I bring to WvW, although I'm not especially serious about that mode. In the meantime, everything else can be brought out for open world when I feel like playing them, and maintaining at least a basic familiarity with all of them means I can adjust to changing balance conditions in a pinch.

 

Tldr: You don't need to stick to a single profession. It's more valuable to find a group of builds that gives you maximum flexibility as a player and focus on mastering those. Outside of fractals, it doesn't really matter if those builds happen to be spread across multiple characters.

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Thank you all for the responses. I really do appreciate it. 🙂 I am just going to go over a couple things I read here to clarify some things.

     I think I didn't specify enough on my comment of just sticking to meta builds. I understand the basics of reading traits just fine for builds, and I get the general idea of what that trait does. I was more commenting on the fine details of the build craft. For example, there is a trait that says that it increases bleeding by X percent. I know what that means in general. What I don't really care to know is if that X amount only affects Y amount from another trait that does bleeding. So taking that X amount trait isn't worth it because it only increases damage by a small amount. I don't care for details like that because math is not my strong suit, and it drains me just thinking about it. But general build like torment does this etc I am ok with. I know the basics well enough.

     I also read the sites on proper rotation, and I do try to follow it for the most part on all my characters. I just don't go to master level of it sitting there at the golem for like 4-5 hours until it is 100% ingrained in my head, so I never make a mistake with it. I follow the rotations to close enough levels because I know for a lot of stuff I have to move, do the break bars, and other things which breaks the rotation because I do read most of what my skills do on my hotbar to make some combos that make sense at the moment for the boss and mobs.

     I just wanted to clarify that and get it off my chest. Yes following the meta is a crutch, but I am ok with that crutch if it avoids math I don't want to do. But as for the rest of the advice, I am thinking about some of it, so thank you again there. I started working on my Skyscale finally after years as a way to play different jobs without it affecting much. I know it is a temporary solution, but I am doing all the charged quartz myself to save money, so that is at least 28 days worth of a plan until I can figure something else out.

     I also started focusing on my virtuoso more because I always liked it, but buran mentioning it in their post just double confirmed some things on why I enjoy it so much because it is a magical demon hunter basically with all the weapons I listed. I am also enjoying the revenant a lot more as well from those that mentioned it because the GS reminds me a lot of anime fighting as well which does affect my mood. So mesmer and revenant are more tightly focused for me at least. I still don't care that much anymore about engineer because I hate the toolbet switching since I want to use my actual weapons I made instead of them being stat sticks.

     Sorry about the long post as well, but it is done now.

Edited by Doctor Hide.6345
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On 12/17/2022 at 9:25 AM, Infusion.7149 said:

In WVW unless you play firebrand you would need to adapt. Many revs were quitting after CoR was changed despite it being a common class through every meta.

Reason all the revs quit WvW after nerfs was more a function of the whole "paradigm shift" thing, post the big DPS nerf patchs: DPS just overall feels weak in WvW.  Like pre DPS nerf -> it was rewarding to be an individual good DPSers who could get open and "free cast" on the enemy zerg (if they didnt shut you down, you could generate a ton of downs solo), a few good DPSers could change the outcome of a fight single-handedly.

 

Post paradigm shift has ment focus has been almost exclusively on support, support, and more support.

If your group has good quality support play, you win fights, if your group doesnt have good support, you dont.  DPS became much lower and slower.  Individual positioning no longer rewarded, etc.

 

Overall just felt much less rewarding to play DPS (of any class) in WvW post nerfs.

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12 hours ago, Tammuz.7361 said:

Reason all the revs quit WvW after nerfs was more a function of the whole "paradigm shift" thing, post the big DPS nerf patchs: DPS just overall feels weak in WvW.  Like pre DPS nerf -> it was rewarding to be an individual good DPSers who could get open and "free cast" on the enemy zerg (if they didnt shut you down, you could generate a ton of downs solo), a few good DPSers could change the outcome of a fight single-handedly.

 

Post paradigm shift has ment focus has been almost exclusively on support, support, and more support.

If your group has good quality support play, you win fights, if your group doesnt have good support, you dont.  DPS became much lower and slower.  Individual positioning no longer rewarded, etc.

 

Overall just felt much less rewarding to play DPS (of any class) in WvW post nerfs.

Healing was nerfed as well. Let's not pretend just damage was cut.

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18 hours ago, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

Thank you all for the responses. I really do appreciate it. 🙂 I am just going to go over a couple things I read here to clarify some things.

     I think I didn't specify enough on my comment of just sticking to meta builds. I understand the basics of reading traits just fine for builds, and I get the general idea of what that trait does. I was more commenting on the fine details of the build craft. For example, there is a trait that says that it increases bleeding by X percent. I know what that means in general. What I don't really care to know is if that X amount only affects Y amount from another trait that does bleeding. So taking that X amount trait isn't worth it because it only increases damage by a small amount. I don't care for details like that because math is not my strong suit, and it drains me just thinking about it. But general build like torment does this etc I am ok with. I know the basics well enough.

     I also read the sites on proper rotation, and I do try to follow it for the most part on all my characters. I just don't go to master level of it sitting there at the golem for like 4-5 hours until it is 100% ingrained in my head, so I never make a mistake with it. I follow the rotations to close enough levels because I know for a lot of stuff I have to move, do the break bars, and other things which breaks the rotation because I do read most of what my skills do on my hotbar to make some combos that make sense at the moment for the boss and mobs.

     I just wanted to clarify that and get it off my chest. Yes following the meta is a crutch, but I am ok with that crutch if it avoids math I don't want to do. But as for the rest of the advice, I am thinking about some of it, so thank you again there. I started working on my Skyscale finally after years as a way to play different jobs without it affecting much. I know it is a temporary solution, but I am doing all the charged quartz myself to save money, so that is at least 28 days worth of a plan until I can figure something else out.

     I also started focusing on my virtuoso more because I always liked it, but buran mentioning it in their post just double confirmed some things on why I enjoy it so much because it is a magical demon hunter basically with all the weapons I listed. I am also enjoying the revenant a lot more as well from those that mentioned it because the GS reminds me a lot of anime fighting as well which does affect my mood. So mesmer and revenant are more tightly focused for me at least. I still don't care that much anymore about engineer because I hate the toolbet switching since I want to use my actual weapons I made instead of them being stat sticks.

     Sorry about the long post as well, but it is done now.

 

There is a non-math way of doing builds for the beginner, which I often used.  I'm going to use your bleeding trait example just to help keep it simple.

  1. Instead of calculating how much more damage a trait does, just find all the traits that mention bleeding.
  2. Does your build do a lot of bleeding on its own?  This is not a mathematical question, but a guesstimation.  For example:
    1. "Hmm, I have auto attacks that bleed and a few other skills that bleed.  That's good enough."
  3. Pick all the bleeding traits.
  4. The same is true for every other condition and boon.  Just pick the things that match.
    1. Do this until you don't have any further traits and skills to pick, i.e., you have a full build.
  5. Now play the game.  The next evaluation question is:
    1. Are you having a good time or a bad time?
      1. If good time, you have the first draft of a build you can master and tweak.
      2. If you're having a bad time, scrap the build and try some other matching stuff.

This is how I figured out Guild Wars 2 on day one to.... large number.  It took a while to get to where I'm at, but first hand experience with trait/skill/weapon/stat combos is how you master the professions.  During you're playtime, you'll uncover synergistic combinations the way you understand them, without having to figure out what a particular guide is trying to tell you.

First hand knowledge and experience is always better than reading a guide that may not be explaining it in a way you understand things.  This baseline level of knowledge will then enable you to better understand why certain builds are considered meta, and what tweaks can be made for your specific circumstances and play style.

 

It is a lot of trial and error, but I cannot emphasize enough how much more you'll learn playing the game.

 

Edited by Rogue.8235
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On 12/16/2022 at 2:41 PM, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

I seem to have a problem in games in which I can't stick to one class/job/profession. I am this way with all MMOs really. I am on one class and gear it out according to snowcrows or metabattle, and then I get the urge to play another class because it has something else I want at the moment. How do most people just stick with one and just settle down? I can't escape the Jack of all trades(professions) it seems and just be a master of one for the long run.

You don’t stick with one profession. You swap them for the next best thing, and continue to learn the game mechanics and understand each professions well enough. At that point you will have one or two builds that work really well for you and you will enjoy.
 

After that, you will continue to swap professions based upon the buff/nerf of the patch cycle.  See once you understand this game the reality is that the devs have been hamfisted in updates to the professions so that what you play changes year over year.  Meaning you either get used to your fav profession not playing the same so you rebuild/regear/relearn it every once in a while, or you swap to a different profession and invest the time and energy into learning that one until it gets buffed/nerfed and you decide to change again. 
 

Embrace being pretty good at like 4-6 professions. 

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2 hours ago, Mungo Zen.9364 said:

After that, you will continue to swap professions based upon the buff/nerf of the patch cycle.  See once you understand this game the reality is that the devs have been hamfisted in updates to the professions so that what you play changes year over year.  Meaning you either get used to your fav profession not playing the same so you rebuild/regear/relearn it every once in a while, or you swap to a different profession and invest the time and energy into learning that one until it gets buffed/nerfed and you decide to change again. 

 

I have never drastically changed a single build I play to the extent you describe.  The only reason to do this is the pursuit of mathematical optimization.  In that case, you're less actually playing the profession and more executing the optimized mathematical solution of, for example, most damage per second.  

Some enjoy this type of gameplay, and I don't wish to detract from that.  However, recognize that the pursuit of optimization is less about having a favorite play style and more about mathematical optimization.  If you don't find mathematical optimization fun, then realize that there has yet to be a balance change that requires a complete change of build, down to the gear.  

For context, I play every profession.  My most played are thief, warrior, and mesmer in PvP, and I have never used a meta build.  All of my builds are of my own making based on how I play and my decision-making tendencies during a match.  My least played profession in PvP is revenant.  For PvE and WvW, all professions are equally played.  Again, I have never adjusted builds based on balance changes because they're effective.  Any drastic change I make is because what I originally built was just that bad to begin with.

 

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39 minutes ago, Rogue.8235 said:

 

I have never drastically changed a single build I play to the extent you describe.  The only reason to do this is the pursuit of mathematical optimization.  In that case, you're less actually playing the profession and more executing the optimized mathematical solution of, for example, most damage per second.  

Some enjoy this type of gameplay, and I don't wish to detract from that.  However, recognize that the pursuit of optimization is less about having a favorite play style and more about mathematical optimization.  If you don't find mathematical optimization fun, then realize that there has yet to be a balance change that requires a complete change of build, down to the gear.  

For context, I play every profession.  My most played are thief, warrior, and mesmer in PvP, and I have never used a meta build.  All of my builds are of my own making based on how I play and my decision-making tendencies during a match.  My least played profession in PvP is revenant.  For PvE and WvW, all professions are equally played.  Again, I have never adjusted builds based on balance changes because they're effective.  Any drastic change I make is because what I originally built was just that bad to begin with.

 

It’s not about metrics for me, I mix meta and non-meta builds. It’s about how the profession build plays.  The feel of combat is more important to me than the results as long as the build has merit.  Unfortunately how various builds play has changed over the years to the point that almost all builds have been notably affected at some point, some multiple times. 
 

and that isn’t saying it’s all nerfs, as some changes are intended to be buffs. But some meta buffs or updates do sometimes affect the tools other builds use in a negative way. 

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On 12/18/2022 at 7:44 PM, Infusion.7149 said:

That is terrible advice. You're telling someone that is playing an MMO to not play with other players in squads in WVW or instanced content. 

   I'm not telling anyone what they must do, I'm telling that they don't need to do if they don't want.

   And as a player which was in a WvW guild for 4 years, and which has been playing outside any guild since ~2018, when the lack of content in that game mode made the guild fade away, that anyone can find out success in GW2 playing solo. Again:

1) You don't need to play in a guild to unlock the warclaw and the 1226 WvW levels you need to have access to all the abilities; by the way if you play in WvW do it due you enjoy the game mode, since in terms of rewards is the worst place in the game and in terms content once the Alliance is implemented will be abandoned content for ANet.

2) You don't need to play in a guild in PvP nor master all the classes and builds; ranked Conquest doesn't allow to queue with more than 2 players and rewards outside ranked are relatively weak. PvP is also abandoned content and as a whole, very few teams try to improve their own level. Most of guilds in GW2 do care 0 about PvP, anyway, and the ones who care won't admit new members unless they are outstanding playing on their own.

3) Instanced PvE content is the focus of most of guilds, and some devote strong efforts trying to teach these to the newcomers, but the thing is that you  can earn similar amounts of gold and rewards playing solo content with a single class the whole time.

    So, there's nothing wrong about socializing and "trying to be accepted" in groups if you want, but IF you don't want, if you don't want to be at the logistic requirements from others, GW2 offers plenty of worthy content for lone wolves.

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5 hours ago, Buran.3796 said:

   I'm not telling anyone what they must do, I'm telling that they don't need to do if they don't want.

   And as a player which was in a WvW guild for 4 years, and which has been playing outside any guild since ~2018, when the lack of content in that game mode made the guild fade away, that anyone can find out success in GW2 playing solo. Again:

1) You don't need to play in a guild to unlock the warclaw and the 1226 WvW levels you need to have access to all the abilities; by the way if you play in WvW do it due you enjoy the game mode, since in terms of rewards is the worst place in the game and in terms content once the Alliance is implemented will be abandoned content for ANet.

2) You don't need to play in a guild in PvP nor master all the classes and builds; ranked Conquest doesn't allow to queue with more than 2 players and rewards outside ranked are relatively weak. PvP is also abandoned content and as a whole, very few teams try to improve their own level. Most of guilds in GW2 do care 0 about PvP, anyway, and the ones who care won't admit new members unless they are outstanding playing on their own.

3) Instanced PvE content is the focus of most of guilds, and some devote strong efforts trying to teach these to the newcomers, but the thing is that you  can earn similar amounts of gold and rewards playing solo content with a single class the whole time.

    So, there's nothing wrong about socializing and "trying to be accepted" in groups if you want, but IF you don't want, if you don't want to be at the logistic requirements from others, GW2 offers plenty of worthy content for lone wolves.

Go read the topic poster's posts again. It is nothing about guilds but very much about instanced content just as much as OW.

"Like how do you do your fractals, raids, and OW, etc.." --- literally 2nd post from them.

Good luck as a "lone wolf" trying to get a group easily with a super offmeta build. Ask any reaper player about raids in the past years.

It's a team game in the context of instanced PvE and WvW as much as you want to spin it to be otherwise, it's less about being accepted but playing what is wanted for said content. You don't show up to someone needing a plumber as an electrician.

Edited by Infusion.7149
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I play all classes and all game modes. In open world I just play what I feel like. But for other modes where performance is more important and you need that muscle memory I usually have 2 or 3 classes that are the current mains for that mode. These change with time.

In pvp I currently play mostly necro and ranger, sometimes engie.

In wvw its rev, necro and spellbreaker.

In instance pve guardian and rev. 

I would probably quit year a go if I only played one class.

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I always play on my guardian. Have few alts which i never really play. Cant make new char, becouse i "need" to have map comp. 100 %. Drives me crazy otherwise.

Thou i really enjoy guardian. Atm mainly playing wvw as core, but sometimes i do strikes as fb. Its just a solid class.

Edited by Palikka.8249
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On 12/17/2022 at 2:00 AM, Doctor Hide.6345 said:

 

Well, I already have that to an extent. I have 16 characters now with double of each profession(raced change to human from sylvari), and I did the story already on one. All my characters are 80 as well with all elite unlocks with about 6 in all ascended gear for specific meta builds. The rest are just exotics. I just keep jumping between them all though. For example, I got into a castlevenia mood, so I use the chain whip skin for my Dragon Hunter, but I saw the lastest metabattle change and it is now LB and GS which just killed my mood for it even though I still like it for castlevenia feel. Or I watch Harry Potter, and I want a wand feel. So I look at all the meta builds with wands and can't decide which one I want to play. Theme impacts my mood a lot from media on what my interests dictate.

I guess I better sit down and make a list huh of pros and cons to decide which ones I want to multi-class.

If you don't like the new meta version, there's always something you can do: go to training area and test how your favourite build compares to metabuild in your hands and are you willing to pay the DPS loss to continue using your build?

In general, as long as you do mechanics cleanly, doing over 30k at golem is enough for almost every encounter unless squad is super-tryhard. 25k+ is enough for most raids, mostly stuff like some Strike CMs, fractal CM100 with pugs and maybe Twin Largos on melee build becoming an issue. Build being ranged compensates for DPS loss at encounters with lots of movement.

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  • 4 weeks later...

GW2 is very "jack-of-all-trades" friendly, so don't feel bad or anything if you keep playing different professions without sticking to just one 🙂 My main is a Ranger and I basically just play Ranger. I love it that way and don't get bored of it. To keep things interesting I change elite specs, weapons, and builds often, not to mention the game mode itself. 

But I do have more characters, one per each profession I like (Warrior, Guardian, Engineer, Thief, Elementalist), and I play those to do map completion. 

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For me this has changed quite a lot over time. In core and HoT I used to play warrior exclusively. Then in PoF I switched to ranger, playing some necro and guard on the side. Between PoF and EoD I tried different classes and specs but still stuck with the soulbeast as my main one. Nowdays I have one of each profession, actively (more or less) playing 2-3 of them but which ones varies. Currently loving the condi virtuoso but I also play some engi and bit of thief. Finally getting untamed build ready and if I like it I'll likely play it more. Also planning of respeccing my guard as cele firebrand, haven't played it in such a long time. And I'm slowly leveling revenant again since I remade the toon (race change).

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I haven't talked in this one for a while, but yeah, I kind of settled on three professions which I mainly play now. The necro for condi harbinger is one. The weaver for the scepter if I feel like it, but I mainly play weaver now for weaver sword because it allows me to play close enough to Weiss Schnee with a rapier. Lastly, it is the mesmer's virtuoso with main focus on condi, but I play the power every once in awhile.

I kind of let the others slip finally once I found my footing in those. They are still around of course for alt farming if I need a lot of something for an item. But they are mostly on the wayside now minus the three light armored ones.

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Max min with in the ability of the class you want to only play. Dont max and min with running one class over the others. Find a group of friends who understand what you want and what your looking to do in the game. Yes there are a lot of ppl out there who DO like to only play one class (ele only player here.) Just build your chosen class to fit the roll you want it to be and you may have to do a bit of imagination on how to build to make it work out.

Just understand there are ppl out there who will hate you just because you embody a class. Not because of who you are but purely base of the class you play as. As well as your want to not play any other classes.

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I used to play all classes for months and switching to them back and forth especially for PvP and WvW to have a knowledge of all of them when I have to face them against. The so called multiclasser. 
I played on my cousin account, but now I decided to buy my own and I just chose 3 professions out of the 9. Ranger which will be my PvE main because of the pet tame which is cool, to do all maps and open world, but sometimes PvP and WvW as well, then a Revenant to purely PvP and finally a Mesmer to PvP and WvW.

As you see I chose 1 heavy 1 med 1 light profession as my 3 mains and I don't bother playing the others because I simply don't enjoy them. Having 3 is also good for meta changes and not to feel bored of playing over and over the same profession and nothing else, which happened to me a lot.

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I only play the the class(or spec)  I like the most in terms of style, If that isn't viable for some content, then I won't play that content.  There are enoguh other barriers keeping me from doing the top stuff so it's not much of  a loss and I wouldn't change to any other class anymore just for that.

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