If Catalyst is a problem, why do Core Ele, Tempest and Weaver get nerfs?

[TheQuickFox.3826]

I'm faily meh at PvP so don't take me as benchmark but I'm just wondering after today's patch notes: If the issue in PvP is an OP Catalyst, why do Core Elementalist, Tempest and Weaver get nerfs as well?

Or were all of them overpowered?

[Lighter.5631]

scepter fire auto is pretty degenerate in general tbh.

doesn't matter OP or not, this kind of gameplay should be nerfed into oblivion.

like these condi scepter tempest..

also i'm pretty sure this is an emergency axe patch, after seeing how tuesday patch did nothing, to prevent mAT in days from being a big joke, since it's gonna get streamed lol

Edited July 20, 2023 by Lighter.5631

[Downstate.4697]

Scepter burning was op on all of them. The damage nerfs and might nerfs was overkill.

Signets are now worse than June 27th but are still carrying what is left of signet cata. You can’t really gut how much healing leaps and blasts do unless it’s game wide or you remove a weapons access to  finishers.

They kind of gutted cata for all its worth. There isn’t much else they can do to nerf it without touching other traits or weapons

[Saiyan.1704]

Honestly, Condi Signet Cata is still pretty darn strong on 1v1 sidenoding in fact the only thing that rivals it is maybe Spellbreaker if that... They mostly nerfed their efficiency when roaming/engaging multiple people at once, which was needed. There should never be a jack-of-all-trade class and cata was exactly that.

A lot of classes need help in PvP. I would rather buff WB instead of your Ele Weaver or Tempest.....

[Brokensunday.4098]

1 hour ago, Lighter.5631 said:

scepter fire auto is pretty degenerate in general tbh.

doesn't matter OP or not, this kind of gameplay should be nerfed into oblivion.

like these condi scepter tempest..

also i'm pretty sure this is an emergency axe patch, after seeing how tuesday patch did nothing, to prevent mAT in days from being a big joke, since it's gonna get streamed lol

yup there's a reason why guard has only one condition aka burning and it's not on every auto attack but every 5/3 traited

[Malus.2184]

11 hours ago, TheQuickFox.3826 said:

Or were all of them overpowered?

All of them were overpowered. Cata was just more overpowered than the others.

[Khalisto.5780]

Kill power scepter along with condi wanst needed, also they killed written in stone when they just need to remove auras and replace with another buff or even choose between all the cds increase or icd. It's kinda sad cuz this trait was never meant to pve and now it's completely useless in all game modes, scepter still good in pve but also dead in pvp and wvw.

 

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

12 hours ago, TheQuickFox.3826 said:

I'm faily meh at PvP so don't take me as benchmark but I'm just wondering after today's patch notes: If the issue in PvP is an OP Catalyst, why do Core Elementalist, Tempest and Weaver get nerfs as well?

Or were all of them overpowered?

All the things that were problematic were primarily tied to Core Ele.

So when you nerf Scepter, WIS, Auras in general, it effects the Ele specializations.

[Wayne.6253]

11 hours ago, TheQuickFox.3826 said:

I'm faily meh at PvP so don't take me as benchmark but I'm just wondering after today's patch notes: If the issue in PvP is an OP Catalyst, why do Core Elementalist, Tempest and Weaver get nerfs as well?

Or were all of them overpowered?

They nerfed all ele specs because people only know how to cry and having no hands they don't know how to use their specs.

This forum is made for 95% of ---- cryers

[Dreams.3128]

12 hours ago, Saiyan.1704 said:

Honestly, Condi Signet Cata is still pretty darn strong on 1v1 sidenoding in fact the only thing that rivals it is maybe Spellbreaker if that... They mostly nerfed their efficiency when roaming/engaging multiple people at once, which was needed. There should never be a jack-of-all-trade class and cata was exactly that.

A lot of classes need help in PvP. I would rather buff WB instead of your Ele Weaver or Tempest.....

The only classes that need help is Mesmer and Engie, the classes that ACTUALLY got gutted the same way Ele did. If you say Warrior, Rev, Necro, Guardian or Ranger needs help I would laugh in your face.

Edited July 20, 2023 by Dreams.3128

[Jski.6180]

At least the last set of nerfs did not carry over to wvw but once sword / WH hits catalyst in spvp odds are that going to be the new target for the toixe spvp forms player base. I say just cut off Catalyst in spvp till its fixed at this point. Wvw player base is a bit more forgiving about looser balancing as any one can out number you at any point and realize that the game type has some build in unbalnacing to keep things fun.

[shion.2084]

45 minutes ago, Dreams.3128 said:

The only classes that need help is Mesmer and Engie, the classes that ACTUALLY got gutted the same way Ele did. If you say Warrior, Rev, Necro, Guardian or Ranger needs help I would laugh in your face.

As an engi I got 4 nerfs in a row to the "meta" viable competition builds.  I'm still waiting for my quickness back on kinetic accelerators (you know so the trait actually accelerates).  Sniff.

[Dreams.3128]

53 minutes ago, shion.2084 said:

As an engi I got 4 nerfs in a row to the "meta" viable competition builds.  I'm still waiting for my quickness back on kinetic accelerators (you know so the trait actually accelerates).  Sniff.

I'm still pissy Engie is just a ping pong ball for classes that have spammy CC skills. Literally unplayable in a meta that supports AOE cc moves.

[asket.5674]

54 minutes ago, shion.2084 said:

As an engi I got 4 nerfs in a row to the "meta" viable competition builds.  I'm still waiting for my quickness back on kinetic accelerators (you know so the trait actually accelerates).  Sniff.

Engi nerfs were completely overtuned, true scrapper was strong af, but it was at most an annoyance and not gamebreaking as cata. 
 

their current approach on adjusting cata is a joke. Weaver is falling back even more now and tempest are nothing more than a supp kitty now. Köwhat a kit show.

[Bladestrom.6425]

im 

2 hours ago, Wayne.6253 said:

They nerfed all ele specs because people only know how to cry and having no hands they don't know how to use their specs.

This forum is made for 95% of ---- cryers

They absolutely ******* destroyed my condy tempest ive been playing for 2 years.  Not only that, its the only ranged ele build that i liked.  I'm livid at the sheer incompetency and cavalier attitude with customers content, ive basically not got a build that i want to play in PVP now.

In my opinion they should completely roll back the last 3 ele patches and start again.

[shion.2084]

51 minutes ago, Dreams.3128 said:

I'm still pissy Engie is just a ping pong ball for classes that have spammy CC skills. Literally unplayable in a meta that supports AOE cc moves.

Hell, engi is a ping pong ball for other engi's 🙂

And fights between engi's seem fair.   Basically if either of you lands the CC and burns the other guys one stun break, they win.  It's super fast, in and out, one mistake and you're done.  But that applies to both sides.

When I fight a blade sworn, it's oh I hit you 15 times, you got me once, now I'm dead.   There are classes that can out sustain/heal/block/invuln all the damage I can do on a total glass engi, and still down me in two shots in return.   My "mele" fights with them involve me running around in circles praying they won't land a hit and that I can manage to string 20 or so together. 

Edited July 20, 2023 by shion.2084

[Kuma.1503]

Since we're on the topic of Engi. 

RIP Core Rifle engi. 

One of my favorite builds for it's surprise factor. Pumped out deceptively high damage when you could get it to land. But it ended up getting neutered as collateral damage because of Rifle Mech. 

Considering they've still yet to revert the nerfs to rifle, It's not looking too likely that anything will happen to WiS, but I'd love to be proven wrong.

 

 

Edited July 21, 2023 by Kuma.1503

[WhoWantsAHug.3186]

23 hours ago, Downstate.4697 said:

Scepter burning was op on all of them. The damage nerfs and might nerfs was overkill.

Signets are now worse than June 27th but are still carrying what is left of signet cata. You can’t really gut how much healing leaps and blasts do unless it’s game wide or you remove a weapons access to  finishers.

They kind of gutted cata for all its worth. There isn’t much else they can do to nerf it without touching other traits or weapons

Yea if they just kept the might nerfs along with scepter fire auto, churning earth, and ICD on signet aura nerfs, that might have been enough.  Kinda sad they completely gutted FA cata, as it's leagues above FA weaver in terms of fun. 

[WhoWantsAHug.3186]

6 minutes ago, Kuma.1503 said:

Since we're on the topic of Engi. 

I just love how I stuck it out on my meme core rifle engi build for years. 

It kept getting random nerfs, couldn't do anything vs projectile hate, was basically thief at home, and had to work twice as hard as everyone else to kill things. But I stuck with it because it was fun to string combos together. 

Then in comes Rifle Mech. The forums go up in flames, and Anet's response? Gut rifle into unplayability. 

Now my meme core engi build isn't just bad. It's literally unplayable. That was the day I went from playing PvP as my main form of entertainmet to playing it maybe 4-5 times a month. 

 

Why don't you just play rifle holo? It's pretty kittening good right now

[WhoWantsAHug.3186]

11 hours ago, Dreams.3128 said:

The only classes that need help is Mesmer and Engie, the classes that ACTUALLY got gutted the same way Ele did. If you say Warrior, Rev, Necro, Guardian or Ranger needs help I would laugh in your face.

Wow there bro. Condi mes needs help, power mes is king right now. Necro needs a lot of love too. 

[Sweetbread.3678]

15 hours ago, Wayne.6253 said:

They nerfed all ele specs because people only know how to cry and having no hands they don't know how to use their specs.

This forum is made for 95% of ---- cryers

Please. They only nerfed Ele specs that were crutching scepter and Written in Stone, both of which have been blatantly overtuned and brain-dead as kitten since their reworks.

Shockingly, it is actually possible to play a spec that isn't blatantly busted, degenerate, and inevitably fated to get a huge nerf; but I think that concept is probably beyond someone who unironically sits on a pvp forum crying about other people "crying".

[Bladestrom.6425]

2 hours ago, Sweetbread.3678 said:

Please. They only nerfed Ele specs that were crutching scepter and Written in Stone, both of which have been blatantly overtuned and brain-dead as kitten since their reworks.

Shockingly, it is actually possible to play a spec that isn't blatantly busted, degenerate, and inevitably fated to get a huge nerf; but I think that concept is probably beyond someone who unironically sits on a pvp forum crying about other people "crying".

I played tempest condy for 2 years, it wasn't meta, it wasnt overpowered and none complained about it.  Anet just broke not only this but a whole bunch of core condy builds and ranged builds, NONE  of which were an issue..  All of this because they didn't conduct appropriate impact analysis and buffed CATA to high heaven then tripled down with 2 series of crude broad stroked hacks that targeted every build.  I've went from a build that was challenging and fun to having to pick between melee and CATA. I tried this morning its a f***** mess, i used to play with 13.6k health, now thats out the window as well.

This is the stats ive been dropped to as  condy ranged ele with 13.6k hp

87 strike dmg auto attack, no condy

tooth 2612 condy and 500 dmg every 6  1/2 seconds

phoenix  650 explosion, 6.2k condy if it hits player on fire (and guess what no burn on auto).  And opponent has condy removal to spare.

WTF am i meant to fight with that, rabbits?

Edited July 21, 2023 by vesica tempestas.1563

[Stallic.2397]

Condi and power Scepter weaver is out the window too ever since these nerfs happened. You can do damage but not enough to kill.

So many roam specs like Rev, thief, mes, etc can now just run away when you out play them. Reset and then try again, since all your skills now on CD. Whereas, before the nerfs, you could pressure then to downstate. 

The recent patch hit ele globally. Not just cata, which was the build that was being complained about 

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

That's how ANerf rolls.
Remember Mirage was the problem? Domination/Dueling/Illusion/Chaos got nerfed to hell.

[Trevor Boyer.6524]

30 minutes ago, Stallic.2397 said:

Condi and power Scepter weaver is out the window too ever since these nerfs happened. You can do damage but not enough to kill.

So many roam specs like Rev, thief, mes, etc can now just run away when you out play them. Reset and then try again, since all your skills now on CD

This is completely normal. This is how every other class/build has to deal with revs & thiefs & mesmers.

This is what I'm talking about, about Ele desensitization. I mean no offense, but seriously guys, you gotta own up to this at some point.