Why isnt KDR a bigger part of the war score in wvw?

[Hexinx.1872]

Game's too addictive and enjoyable to play the abstinence role. Gotta still get out there and give them some! If ya dirt nap, ya dirt nap.... but not even trying? Even in dire straights ya still gotta put your best foot forward.

[Strider Pj.2193]

@Hexinx.1872 said:Game's too addictive and enjoyable to play the abstinence role. Gotta still get out there and give them some! If ya dirt nap, ya dirt nap.... but not even trying? Even in dire straights ya still gotta put your best foot forward.

But wait, isn't that the motto of t2 and t3? To not try? Why give SBI a hard time? Mag won't 'try' on any BL other than EBG, so....

[XenesisII.1540]

@Regimentz.3471 said:

@Shagaliscious.6281 said:I say everyone goes on a EBG strike when facing Maguuma. Just let them have the entire map,I think sbi is listening to you

cept the 30 still trying to fighting between their spawn and the bridge...

[Dawdler.8521]

@"Caliburn.1845" said:What if KDR were designed with a bit more creativity and aimed to encourage certain player behavior? If you kill an enemy in your T3 SMC, you get no warscore, and it doesn't add to your server's KDR. If you kill an enemy player in an enemy T3 structure you get double the warscore and KDR.

Weight it to take into account other factors such as if they are fighting within enemy structures, and fighting outnumbered, with the intention to make megablob style less effective, and to favor groups that hunt for outnumbered fights or push enemy structures.Overcomplicated.

Everyone arguing back and forward between "fighters" and "PPTers" still knows we can literally have the cake and eat it too with how the game once worked, right?

Remove tier based PPT.

Result is less runaway PPT for servers sitting on upgraded objectives and a higher percentage of points represented by killpoints without changing the functionality of either..

[TheGrimm.5624]

PPT and PPK is in balance. To be successful a server needs to do both. If all a person wants is fighting, then you can just go PvP. PPK requires not just taking but taking and holding. Its easy to take, we had that for many years and k-training was strong, its still there but now we have a bit more reason to hold and build. We also have scoring for killing which is also good. But its also easy to zerg. The game mode lends itself already to whoever can keep the most people together wins, which is why we have PPT to counter that with giving people options to try and disperse people with larger forces.

[Hubal.8571]

Hmm,

By reading this thread comments and arguments, and mostly mentioned servers, seems like this mostly NA is involved in this discussion?Wonder what people in EU servers think on this.

[displayname.8315]

@salogel.1869 said:so much harder when a decent portion of your group has no interest in WvW beyond the loot.

Only interested in the k-train loot so true.. is there something wrong with PvE or is it just that boring? Also the skill gap can be hard to cross, you really have to play around with armor and trait builds, watch your class on youtube some ect.. it can be daunting to newcomers I 'member.

[Israel.7056]

@"TheGrimm.5624" said:To be successful a server needs to do both.

What is "successful?"

[displayname.8315]

@TheGrimm.5624 said:If all a person wants is fighting, then you can just go PvP.

I try to like PvP but then im sitting in a queue for 5 mins just to be stuck in a 10 min match with the same problem of the skill gap groups.

WvW you can solo, duo, duel, 24/7.. ZvZ.. GvG. Only real problem is the stacking by certain loot train hogs. Please rush the new WvW anet. Im almost excited for the CU beta July 7 but not really caring yet.

[TheGrimm.5624]

@Israel.7056 said:

@"TheGrimm.5624" said:To be successful a server needs to do both.

What is "successful?"

Since fun can't be measured outside of one's own mind and would be different person to person, I was referring to scoring and placement. Since it is a game I would value fun higher than score but the KDR/PPT impacts score since individuals can still have fun and be successful even if they are not winning via a scoreboard.

[TheGrimm.5624]

@displayname.8315 said:

@TheGrimm.5624 said:If all a person wants is fighting, then you can just go PvP.

I try to like PvP but then im sitting in a queue for 5 mins just to be stuck in a 10 min match with the same problem of the skill gap groups.

WvW you can solo, duo, duel, 24/7.. ZvZ.. GvG. Only real problem is the stacking by certain loot train hogs. Please rush the new WvW anet. Im almost excited for the CU beta July 7 but not really caring yet.

Agree about options in WvW. No guarantees that CU will not face similar issues though.

[shiri.4257]

Middle Fort is the true measure of wvw skill. Everything else is just icing on the cake.

[Israel.7056]

@TheGrimm.5624 said:

@Israel.7056 said:

@TheGrimm.5624 said:To be successful a server needs to do both.

What is "successful?"

Since fun can't be measured outside of one's own mind and would be different person to person, I was referring to scoring and placement. Since it is a game I would value fun higher than score but the KDR/PPT impacts score since individuals can still have fun and be successful even if they are not winning via a scoreboard.

I agree but I'd even go further and say that it's best to just ignore the scoreboard completely.

[displayname.8315]

@TheGrimm.5624 said:

@"displayname.8315" said:WvW you can solo, duo, duel, 24/7.. ZvZ.. GvG. Only real problem is the stacking by certain loot train hogs. Please rush the new WvW anet. Im almost excited for the CU beta July 7 but not really caring yet.

Agree about options in WvW. No guarantees that CU will not face similar issues though.

Having it be a fully RvR game even in the economy and other aspects sounds pretty great tho. Not sure what their idea of the realms will be and july 7 still a ways away for the beta.

So many changes anet could have made but it was clear they didn't want to do much with the WvW "offshoot" of the game.

[Eremes Guile.1480]

*tagged up in ebg to have some fun with mag open field... just when the fight gets even.. mag pulls to smc for siege support. kek.

[TheGrimm.5624]

@displayname.8315 said:

@TheGrimm.5624 said:

@displayname.8315 said:WvW you can solo, duo, duel, 24/7.. ZvZ.. GvG. Only real problem is the stacking by certain loot train hogs. Please rush the new WvW anet. Im almost excited for the CU beta July 7 but not really caring yet.

Agree about options in WvW. No guarantees that CU will not face similar issues though.

Having it be a fully RvR game even in the economy and other aspects sounds pretty great tho. Not sure what their idea of the realms will be and july 7 still a ways away for the beta.

So many changes anet could have made but it was clear they didn't want to do much with the WvW "offshoot" of the game.

Did beta for GW2 but then went away, came back to GW2 when WAR finally shutdown and have been a backer of CU since then. Having played various MMOs I don't mind games using concepts from other games if it enhances the game play. I actually see GW2's idea of alliances as a test run for Ashes of Creation take on servers since it will be similar in nature in the aspect that players can move about as they wish with some limits. Also why I could see it working outside of the coverage wars issue, but I don't think I have seen any game completely address that yet, especially if they split their servers by world geography. GW2's strength is in its pricing logic, but WvW is endgame content and love spent on it is a good investment since it is the sandbox that changes daily based on player actions.

[LetoII.3782]

KDR isn't a goal, it's a result.

[Turkeyspit.3965]

As a player on Anvil Rock, my thanks to Mag for giving me a train to follow. I will be sad come end of April

[Meviken.2054]

@"DeadlySynz.3471" said:Players want fights, they don't want to cap empty towers, but they also don't to bang their head against the wall trying to flip something that's T3 when players just hide inside. Often stuff is attacked to just to draw people out to fight with no intention of taking the structure. Perhaps Anet's better off just removing the upgrades all together and leaving everything "paper". There certainly would be a lot more stuff attacked and flipped.

Of course players want fights. But most of them seem to only want fights where they win. This is rather like all the people being above average; it just doesn't happen -- unless they zerg up, mandate certain builds, and only choose fights when outnumbering the enemy 50 to 5.

In terms of leaving everything paper... just get rid of all the buildings on the maps and make everything into camps.

[ChronosCosmos.9450]

@"Chaba.5410" said:LOL. No, I'm not on Maguuma. You are ignoring what people are telling you. Mag does the same thing in T1 and nobody there wants to deal with it either. Your "solution" of rewarding that with higher warscore would encourage more servers to play like that.

You say that but BG always takes Mag's precious SM lol.

[aspirine.6852]

If it was a bigger part Vabbi would be absolute King of WvW in EU right now.Perhaps it should be a bit bigger than it is right now. But in the end it's objectives like SM or keep that keep the fights going

[Dayra.7405]

The answer is simple, isn't it: Coverage! 20 of 24 hours there aren't people to fight so nearly no PPK, but PPT ticks 24/24. That's why it is around 6 times as high.

[Gop.8713]

Isn't it as simple as the fact that increasing the value of kdr would do more to discourage even or outnumbered fights, which we already have enough trouble encouraging . . ?

[Dawdler.8521]

@Dayra.7405 said:The answer is simple, isn't it: Coverage! 20 of 24 hours there aren't people to fight so nearly no PPK, but PPT ticks 24/24. That's why it is around 6 times as high.

No its even simpler. After the skirmish implementation (5m version), we had decent enough ppt/ppk score ratios.

Then a couple of months in Anet - only Anet - decided that ppt need to higher, especially during low activity times when objectives go uncontested or when strong servers are already strong, so they added absolutely ridiculous exponential gains from tier based points.

Its that simple.

We had it and we lost it.

[Sylosi.6503]

If the game mode was well designed you wouldn't need PPK at all.

PPK was a simply a band aid they slapped on that fails to address the real issue that due to the poor map design / multiple maps / scoring system, fights are not forced enough. PPK actually made fights worse in some respects in that certain servers (at least on EU) literally ran / waypointed on sight / committed mass suicide off cliffs / not bother to defend objectives once the inner is down, to avoid giving PPK points, much more than they previously did, so you actually got less fights.