High Elves

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Tom Hsiao.9705 said:Well one man trash is another man's treasure... so I hope ANet see this as a treasure not trash.Also what makes you think introducing the elves won't make sense?? Do you have the info for the upcoming content or story-line? Otherwise never say ever. We have not seen all the elder dragons yet.

I remember when GW2 first launched

ANet was very firm about not having mounts

because they believed the WP system can replace mounts. But guess what??!!!

We got mounts now!!

Do you think all the mounts that was introduced make sense? Not really. So I'm not quite sure what you mean by art, quality and lore. It sounds more like an excuse to prevent something you don't want to be implemented to the game simply because you think it's trash.

To the best of my knowledge ANet never said anything about mounts, one way or another. If you have a quote you can put it down but otherwise it was the players making that argument.

And no to Elves. They don’t fit the game.

That you will have to google it on your own but I remember specifically when I first played gw2 and there was no mount and my spouse refuse to play the game simply because there was no mount. So I had to do some digging on why there were no mounts in GW2. I found out ANet refuse to have mount in gw2 because they believe WP is good enough and we never had mount in GW1 either. However that was years ago so Im not gonna spend hrs tracking some articles just to prof my point. If you wanna believe it so be it if not that’s fine by me, I did found something on reddit about people requesting mounts and asking why there were no mount and the response from the community were just as negative as they are with elf right now. You can see it for yourself but since mounts has been introduced I don’t see anyone who have the expansion choose to walk instead of hopping on their mounts. So I’m not sure why people are arguing for the sake of arguing and say stuff like “nah we are good” if that’s truely the case those players should not have the option to get any mount because they don’t deserve it.

Here is the link from Reddit you can see it for yourself:

https://reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/3op6bk/why_are_there_no_mounts_on_gw2/

While it’s possible that they said that the game doesn’t need mounts because of waypoints I have rarely seen them say they absolutely no to some feature so without a quote I’m going to say you misremembered it and turned “not needed” into “never”

Players saying never, no matter how many threads you pull up, are irrelevant to this conversation.

Ya it is irrelevant when we are trying to talk about elf but you insist on nip picking an example I pull up about mounts and request for me to find something that was posted years ago. If you want to know it that bad search it yourself instead of denying the fact.

You can not pull up something that doesn’t exist. However I did research it. All that I found was not now and not needed. I did not find never. Since never was your claim that’s your job to back up.

Since you can’t back up your claim then that’s that for this conversation.

[Cirian.8917]

@"Khisanth.2948" said:They left the world on their horses ;)

!

That might explain why there are fairground horses in Tyria, but no actual horse in Tyria. Perhaps Tyria is in deep post-elf territory and they've been completely forgotten. And since Tyria is part of a many-worlds universe, maybe they did go into the mists...

Ah, now some folks were saying the sylvari are like elves but really the sylvari are more fairy-like tree-folk like you had in Dark Age of Camelot, the sylvan, who co-exist with actual elves in that game. The closest thing to elves in Guild Wars 2 are of course the aquatic largos, man-sized creatures with blue skin and pointy ears similar to frost elves, night elves, moon elves and so on.

The more I think about the largos and the possible confrontation with the Deep Sea Dragon, the more I think the OP might get something close to their wish. Maybe we'll find more about the Concordat of the Tethyos Houses? The "Tethyos Houses" do sound a bit elven don't they? Ah! Before you know it we'll have "elven assassins" everywhere.

[Cirian.8917]

I was trying to edit my last post but the forum software hates me apparently. Ok here we go, I figured out my image issue. Right, so like a few posters have mentioned (I totally missed this thread's other 2 pages somehow), probably the most elfy race in Guild Wars 2 are the largos, definitely a fan favourite to see more of, probably when we confront the Deep Sea Dragon like I was saying earlier.

Check these out from the Largos Gallery:

[particlepinata.9865]

Sylvari are sort of our young forest elves ;) Im glad they did not do the generic fantasy races, but created their own unique ones (Charr, Sylvari, Asura).

[DarcShriek.5829]

High Elves? I'm not sure how adding a race of dope smokers adds anything to the game.

[Ardid.7203]

@"Cirian.8917" said:

While the art itself is superb, all I see here are humans with drow-style armor and masks, and a backpack you can just buy at the gemstore. Nothing here show anything new or interesting from the "new species" PoV. Maybe the ears can count. But a pair of ears are not reason for a whole new playable race, IMO.

[Rauderi.8706]

@"Ardid.7203" said:While the art itself is superb, all I see here are humans with drow-style armor and masks, and a backpack you can just buy at the gemstore. Nothing here show anything new or interesting from the "new species" PoV. Maybe the ears can count. But a pair of ears are not reason for a whole new playable race, IMO.

Also, their lore is terrible.I can just hear the nerdy "I'm an athathin" trope bleeding off of them. (Like, really, I've had a friend do this in a tabletop. Never took him seriously after that...)A "race" of hired killers? Unsustainable.And look at their targets in the story: Kodan and Sylvari. Innocents. Good people. They're not worth indulging.

[Jski.6180]

I though elves where just a different type of human in gw2.

[LucianDK.8615]

Elves are pretty much human+ perfect 'humans'. So boring. Salads are far more unique and interesting.

[zeronatras.3280]

You have Void Elves in WoW, better High Elves!

[DarcShriek.5829]

@LucianDK.8615 said:Elves are pretty much human+ perfect 'humans'. So boring. Salads are far more unique and interesting.

They're perfect for smoking pork too!

[Zalani.9827]

They actually talked about this near release, they specifically made Sylvari unique and redid the design once because they didn't want them to be a generic elf race.

You can still find images of the original version around.

[Bunny.9834]

No horses, no elves, no LOTR BS.

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@"Zalani.9827" said:They actually talked about this near release, they specifically made Sylvari unique and redid the design once because they didn't want them to be a generic elf race.

You can still find images of the original version around.

That’s correct. The original prelaunch design was elf like with a plant theme. The design was reconsidered and the sylvari were remade into plants. In essence, they’ve already considered and rejected elves for the game for a unique race.

[Zalani.9827]

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@"Zalani.9827" said:They actually talked about this near release, they specifically made Sylvari unique and redid the design once because they didn't want them to be a generic elf race.

You can still find images of the original version around.

That’s correct. The original prelaunch design was elf like with a plant theme. The design was reconsidered and the sylvari were remade into plants. In essence, they’ve already considered and rejected elves for the game for a unique race.

Yeah it's pretty interesting to think about how Sylvari would have looked if not redesigned. I also liked the fact they were changed since I really enjoy the idea of plant people that aren't just humans wearing plant clothing.

We can even go further back to Gw1 where the early concept art had them looking even more elfish:

And here's the link I was looking for earlier, it's a galley of the old looks:https://imgur.com/a/hnYge

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Zalani.9827 said:

@Just a flesh wound.3589 said:

@Zalani.9827 said:They actually talked about this near release, they specifically made Sylvari unique and redid the design once because they didn't want them to be a generic elf race.

You can still find images of the original version around.

That’s correct. The original prelaunch design was elf like with a plant theme. The design was reconsidered and the sylvari were remade into plants. In essence, they’ve already considered and rejected elves for the game for a unique race.

Yeah it's pretty interesting to think about how Sylvari would have looked if not redesigned. I also liked the fact they were changed since I really enjoy the idea of plant people that aren't just humans wearing plant clothing.

We can even go further back to Gw1 where the early concept art had them looking even more elfish:

And here's the link I was looking for earlier, it's a galley of the old looks:

https://imgur.com/a/hnYge

Very nice. Good find.

For some reason when I look at the picture of the sylvari with white hair I think it’s Caithe. If it is here is a comparison picture of what she looks like now. https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/3/3e/Caithe.jpg

Much better than a generic elf.

[Cirian.8917]

@Rauderi.8706 said:

@"Ardid.7203" said:While the art itself is superb, all I see here are humans with drow-style armor and masks, and a backpack you can just buy at the gemstore. Nothing here show anything new or interesting from the "new species" PoV. Maybe the ears can count. But a pair of ears are not reason for a whole new playable race, IMO.

Also, their lore is terrible.I can just hear the nerdy "I'm an athathin" trope bleeding off of them. (Like, really, I've had a friend do this in a tabletop. Never took him seriously after that...)A "race" of hired killers? Unsustainable.And look at their targets in the story: Kodan and Sylvari. Innocents. Good people. They're not worth indulging.

You want everyone indulged to be good guys? Dull! Drow are popular for a reason: people, all people, have a dark side that needs to get out and stretch every once in a while. It's why anti-heroes get a following. It's why TV shows with those tropes get a following: Dexter, Breaking Bad, Sopranos etc. People love roleplaying bad guys or anti-heroes. Why does everyone love Canach? The guy started out as a terrorist in Southsun remember. He gets to be edgy. Dark. It's fun to indulge that side in a game. Think about the popularity of Grand Theft Auto. Players don't exactly play a saint do they. "They're not worth indulging." You have no idea how much people want that stuff indulged. There's a thirst for darkness and the possibility of redemption.

If the largos remind me of anything it's drow and their type of cutthroat society. Reminds me a bit of the houses in Morrowind too. And maybe the vampire clans from the same game. Goodie two-shoes societies are boring. There's no journey to be had! Way more interesting for things to be screwed up so people can fantasize about how to fix it or how to survive until the next sunrise. I'd love to see the largos society and see how it hasn't somehow imploded into a bloodbath. Maybe it'll be a society like the one from Elric of Melniboné. And yes, there is a striking resemblence to a certain other White Wolf, a certain Geralt of Rivia... Elric is his spiritual forebear from many decades earlier.

Funnily enough the charr were originally villains in Guild Wars but now they've lost that completely. They're fluffy kittens now. Boring! Does anyone get nervous going to the Black Citadel? It's not edgy. No awe.

I want something that feels like it's on the periphery between safety and danger in a fantasy world. That's why I like characters like Palawa Joko, and heck I like his empire too. I get annoyed when the writers put words into the player's mouth all the time, cursing Joko. Look at the "heroes". The sunspears lead short, barbaric lives. Brainwashed religious fanatics. Kormir's followers are deluded and abandonned. "Praise Kormir!" Er, why? How about "no". Joko actually gives a damn about his living citizens precisely because they're the future of his undead army. He needs them to flourish and have a decent first life, gain as much knowledge and power as possible, so they can carry that over into awakening, a second life defending their decendants from all the world's terrors. It's just funny to see the discrimination against Joko because he's a lich, oh and a lich couldn't possibly be a good guy. Why? It's just mindless bigotry against liches! :P Of course you can say Joko is a wolf guarding a flock of sheep, but then, that's almost any "hierarchy + citizens" if you think about it: there's a bunch of folks with power and then there's a flock of drones drifting through life. There is no communist utopia of zero hierarchy and perfect equity.

Anyway, I suppose what I'm really exploring is "what do people want out of the next racial spotlight?", because if it's just pointy ears then that's a pretty low bar. The sylvari have been a lot of fun as "dragon minions redeemed". Humans are "the dying race", that common elven trope. Norn are just drunk. I think they've been forgotten. Charr are fluffy kittens now. Asura are all narcissistic psychopaths, so there's that. Yes, ALL of them. What are we missing? Murderous blue people with fins? Eh, I'm game.

[Rauderi.8706]

In case the tone of the game was missed, it's about heroes. Not "anti" heroes or other edgy nonsense. The closest thing we have to that is Braham trying to go off half-cocked in grief, and the player reaction to that emo was so aggressive, the writing is already starting to turn it around.

I don't love Canach. He's little more than an annoying quip machine who won't admit what's actually on his mind. He wants to go save the world, but he has to pretend it's for some selfish or put-upon reason. That's not anti-hero. That's whining.

Water-drow. That's really all that needs to be said about the Largos. A society that cut-throat would cannibalize itself and never become prominent enough to be more than a little player among the five allied races. Skritt have a better chance of being more civilized. To insist otherwise is beyond boring, it's eye-rolling.As for the evil part, the only real reason the Drow are featured is to be a foil for D'ribbles or D'irigibles or whatever his name is, so he can defy them to be the good character born of his edgy, tragic-backstory race.

Funnily enough, a large chunk of time has passed, and some factions of the various societies decided "hey, there's a global threat in the dragons, maybe we should cease-fire." It didn't take the US half that amount of time to go from Nukes to Anime. Step away from the RP in Divinity's Reach and it's easy to see the tensions still lingering. There isn't even a truce, and humans could be obliterated at any moment, but the leadership is mostly wise and focused on the larger threats.

It's just funny to see the discrimination against Joko because he's a lichNo. omg no. He's a villain because he abuses power and promotes lies to strip people of their freedom and oppress his lessers. I can't even...Not to say he's not a good villain character. He's got power, he has the demented will, and a kingdom of brainwashed living and undead just waiting for his return. Stepping into Vabbi was a real "ew" feeling because of how similar it was to real-world dictatorships, and it's great. That Joko's empire uses (usually) willing undead is a fascinating spin on necromancy, and I love it.But he's still a villain and I look forward to destroying him and his army.

"what do people want out of the next racial spotlight?"Fair question!Murderous blue people with fins?Miss me with that Mary Sue tuna boat.

So we ask again, what do people want out of the next racial spotlight?

Cantha.

I guess that means Tengu.And their ears are pointed too. <3

[Magek.4718]

Have you heard of the high elves?

Gah! Argh! Aaagh...

[Ardid.7203]

IMO, while the game is clearly oriented to "heroics", IMO it is much more oriented to Fashion Wars. This includes the imagined personality of your own main character. So you can make a feisty silvary, a gloomy asura, a menacing human or a suave charr. Or whatever combination you want. If you want a shining paladin, you can make it with any of the races. If you want a gray anti-hero, you can make it with any of the races.

That is the main problem with Largos, Drows or any group that is, by default, forced into a single stereotype. Put a Largos on land, and you lose half what makes them interesting. Change them into a frilly robe, and you lose another 25%. Now make such robe chick yellow, and bam, you've lost 95% of what makes a Largos a Largos.Go back to the beggining. Put your Largos in water, with its black leather on and its dangerous voice. Now take that mask off. You have now a wet human with a funny backpack and cool clothes. Bye bye 100% of Largosness in just one stroke.

Stereotypes doesn't make good characters, but they are even worse for making races.

[Doggie.3184]

Make a tall Sylvari and make his ears pointy. Not every game needs 6 different races with Elf in the name.

[DarcShriek.5829]

What we really need, instead of High Elves, are Prootwaddles. Woot!

[Astralporing.1957]

@"Ardid.7203" said:While the art itself is superb, all I see here are humans with drow-style armor and masks, and a backpack you can just buy at the gemstore. Nothing here show anything new or interesting from the "new species" PoV. Maybe the ears can count. But a pair of ears are not reason for a whole new playable race, IMO.Well, pretty much it's the ears the people ask for. There's no real other reason for elves in GW2 after all. All their concept space has already been given away to other races.Although i do agree, that the ears alone are a bad reason to add a new race.

[Ashabhi.1365]

If there were "high elves" already in existence as a non-playable race, then I would say yes, but because they would literally be foreign to this game, I say no. If the developers were to entertain the idea of adding another playable race, it would most likely be:

1. Tengu
2. Jotun
3. Hylek
4. Hirathi (Centaur archtype)

At least that would be the order in which I would try to make another race.

[derd.6413]

@"Ardid.7203" said:IMO, while the game is clearly oriented to "heroics", IMO it is much more oriented to Fashion Wars. This includes the imagined personality of your own main character. So you can make a feisty silvary, a gloomy asura, a menacing human or a suave charr. Or whatever combination you want. If you want a shining paladin, you can make it with any of the races. If you want a gray anti-hero, you can make it with any of the races.

That is the main problem with Largos, Drows or any group that is, by default, forced into a single stereotype. Put a Largos on land, and you lose half what makes them interesting. Change them into a frilly robe, and you lose another 25%. Now make such robe chick yellow, and bam, you've lost 95% of what makes a Largos a Largos.Go back to the beggining. Put your Largos in water, with its black leather on and its dangerous voice. Now take that mask off. You have now a wet human with a funny backpack and cool clothes. Bye bye 100% of Largosness in just one stroke.

Stereotypes doesn't make good characters, but they are even worse for making races.

Every race has a stereotype. You just need to allow individuals of that race subvert it. The problem with largos specificly is that alot of their alure is in the mystery surrounding them and allowing us to play them would mean loosing that alure.

While anet could reveal that what's under the mask is also very interesting, largos would still loose something and we can only say if the price was worth it in hindsight.