Will the new expac just "preach to the choir"?

[sasya neko.1985]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@robertthebard.8150 said:

@Faline.8795 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Faline.8795 said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

Let's hope it does ... because it's the 'choir' that pays the bills.

Yes, that is true. But are they paying the bills enough? Is this new expact GW2's "last chance" to lift itself before ANet gives up?

And do they really just want to keep what they have? Are they really not going to go for new blood?

I see this "new blood" referenced a lot on Pg 1 of this thread, but I'm curious: What is it that you think a new player is actually looking for from GW 2? You see, that long time established players

might

be burnt out on what's here, new players haven't experienced any of it yet. It seems to me, from the prospective of a "relatively new player", that there's a lot of projection going on; "We're going to be unhappy, but just saying that won't leverage any sympathy, so let's claim it's going to adversely affect new players, that'll give our arguments some weight".

True. My problem with this 'new player' claim is that it's a fallacy. Technically, all the

current

content qualifies as new for a new player ... but for some reason people think an expansion will bring them in? I don't get that logic.

If anything, I think the longer a game is out, the harder it will be for new players to get into it and that includes more expansions.

for a long time i got bored in WoW, legions actually won me over.what i mean by this is that, if an expansion is done right it can get even the most hard to satisfy player onboard.this is now for Anet to discover what that thing is, it will ether win ppl over or fail hard.

[Obtena.7952]

@sorudo.9054 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@robertthebard.8150 said:

@Faline.8795 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Faline.8795 said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

Let's hope it does ... because it's the 'choir' that pays the bills.

Yes, that is true. But are they paying the bills enough? Is this new expact GW2's "last chance" to lift itself before ANet gives up?

And do they really just want to keep what they have? Are they really not going to go for new blood?

I see this "new blood" referenced a lot on Pg 1 of this thread, but I'm curious: What is it that you think a new player is actually looking for from GW 2? You see, that long time established players

might

be burnt out on what's here, new players haven't experienced any of it yet. It seems to me, from the prospective of a "relatively new player", that there's a lot of projection going on; "We're going to be unhappy, but just saying that won't leverage any sympathy, so let's claim it's going to adversely affect new players, that'll give our arguments some weight".

True. My problem with this 'new player' claim is that it's a fallacy. Technically, all the

current

content qualifies as new for a new player ... but for some reason people think an expansion will bring them in? I don't get that logic.

If anything, I think the longer a game is out, the harder it will be for new players to get into it and that includes more expansions.

for a long time i got bored in WoW, legions actually won me over.what i mean by this is that, if an expansion is done right it can get even the most hard to satisfy player onboard.this is now for Anet to discover what that thing is, it will ether win ppl over or fail hard.

Sure, but in that case, you weren't new, you were just bored and came back. I'm talking about completely new players who never played GW2. 8YO game and 3 expansions in ... as a new player, you would feel so far behind.

[robertthebard.8150]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@sorudo.9054 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@robertthebard.8150 said:

@Faline.8795 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Faline.8795 said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

Let's hope it does ... because it's the 'choir' that pays the bills.

Yes, that is true. But are they paying the bills enough? Is this new expact GW2's "last chance" to lift itself before ANet gives up?

And do they really just want to keep what they have? Are they really not going to go for new blood?

I see this "new blood" referenced a lot on Pg 1 of this thread, but I'm curious: What is it that you think a new player is actually looking for from GW 2? You see, that long time established players

might

be burnt out on what's here, new players haven't experienced any of it yet. It seems to me, from the prospective of a "relatively new player", that there's a lot of projection going on; "We're going to be unhappy, but just saying that won't leverage any sympathy, so let's claim it's going to adversely affect new players, that'll give our arguments some weight".

True. My problem with this 'new player' claim is that it's a fallacy. Technically, all the

current

content qualifies as new for a new player ... but for some reason people think an expansion will bring them in? I don't get that logic.

If anything, I think the longer a game is out, the harder it will be for new players to get into it and that includes more expansions.

for a long time i got bored in WoW, legions actually won me over.what i mean by this is that, if an expansion is done right it can get even the most hard to satisfy player onboard.this is now for Anet to discover what that thing is, it will ether win ppl over or fail hard.

Sure, but in that case, you weren't new, you were just bored and came back. I'm talking about completely new players who never played GW2. 8YO game and 3 expansions in ... as a new player, you would feel so far behind.

I think that a lot of players coming in will already know they're behind. They're looking to see if they'll like the game or not, and if they do, it won't matter. They'll notice that there's no OW PvP to hinder progression, they'll discover the community nature of gathering nodes, and in general, they'll find that the in game crowd is really helpful, a lot of the time, so long as you're not camped in one of the "designated troll zones" such as Lion's Arch or Divinity's Reach. These are all considerations that occurred to me while I was leveling my first toons, a couple of years ago. It could be they find this game the same way I did, as well, through YouTube videos of the game music covers, and won't have any expectations at all about whether they're behind or not.

[Bladestrom.6425]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@robertthebard.8150 said:

@Faline.8795 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Faline.8795 said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

Let's hope it does ... because it's the 'choir' that pays the bills.

Yes, that is true. But are they paying the bills enough? Is this new expact GW2's "last chance" to lift itself before ANet gives up?

And do they really just want to keep what they have? Are they really not going to go for new blood?

I see this "new blood" referenced a lot on Pg 1 of this thread, but I'm curious: What is it that you think a new player is actually looking for from GW 2? You see, that long time established players

might

be burnt out on what's here, new players haven't experienced any of it yet. It seems to me, from the prospective of a "relatively new player", that there's a lot of projection going on; "We're going to be unhappy, but just saying that won't leverage any sympathy, so let's claim it's going to adversely affect new players, that'll give our arguments some weight".

True. My problem with this 'new player' claim is that it's a fallacy. Technically, all the

current

content qualifies as new for a new player ... but for some reason people think an expansion will bring them in? I don't get that logic.

If anything, I think the longer a game is out, the harder it will be for new players to get into it and that includes more expansions.

It geta the attention of players again certainly, raises hype and offers a deep aaa mmorpg that moving into 3rd expansion, so for someone looking for a new mmorpg experience, core plus 3 expansions is a lot of adventuring for your buck. I think people forget aaa mmorpg with huge high quality diverse living worlds are not that common - wow butchers their old zones, LOTR is big but poor gfx. Eso is another great world but hampered by a broken engine and rep.

[Obtena.7952]

@vesica tempestas.1563 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@robertthebard.8150 said:

@Faline.8795 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Faline.8795 said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

Let's hope it does ... because it's the 'choir' that pays the bills.

Yes, that is true. But are they paying the bills enough? Is this new expact GW2's "last chance" to lift itself before ANet gives up?

And do they really just want to keep what they have? Are they really not going to go for new blood?

I see this "new blood" referenced a lot on Pg 1 of this thread, but I'm curious: What is it that you think a new player is actually looking for from GW 2? You see, that long time established players

might

be burnt out on what's here, new players haven't experienced any of it yet. It seems to me, from the prospective of a "relatively new player", that there's a lot of projection going on; "We're going to be unhappy, but just saying that won't leverage any sympathy, so let's claim it's going to adversely affect new players, that'll give our arguments some weight".

True. My problem with this 'new player' claim is that it's a fallacy. Technically, all the

current

content qualifies as new for a new player ... but for some reason people think an expansion will bring them in? I don't get that logic.

If anything, I think the longer a game is out, the harder it will be for new players to get into it and that includes more expansions.

It geta the attention of players again certainly, raises hype and offers a deep aaa mmorpg that moving into 3rd expansion, so for someone looking for a new mmorpg experience, core plus 3 expansions is a lot of adventuring for your buck. I think people forget aaa mmorpg with huge high quality diverse living worlds are not that common - wow butchers their old zones, LOTR is big but poor gfx. Eso is another great world but hampered by a broken engine and rep.

I get there are reasons GW2 would pick up new people. The context here is if the volume of new people would be greater if Anet tried to appeal to them vs. reterning people if Anet gives those people what they want.

[Rukia.4802]

@Brimstone.3807 said:

@"Faline.8795" said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

The fact that it is very likely going to be Cantha themed already answers your question. This in and of itself is a safe and boring choice. Who can blame them? Entertainment media companies these days rarely do anything original anymore. Why should features be unique and genre challenging when they can't even get out of the wayback machine plotwise. Here's to the next few years of going places we've already seen in GW1, more Star Wars and Marvel, and generally no new ideas. Hooray!!

I guess you missed out on vanilla GW2 and HoT+PoF because plot twist its from GW1.

[maddoctor.2738]

@"Faline.8795" said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

The game is free, any player can try it at no cost and see if they like it or not, and that part is not going to change with the expansion. I'm not sure what kind of "new" features you expect from the expansion to attract new players

[Crab Fear.1624]

@Fueki.4753 said:The thing that connects Cantha with the current story line might be Bubbles.Bubbles also might be the enemy Jormag wants the commander to defeat.I can totally see a more of the current story within and around Cantha.

Sometimes a story come from left field.. not unlike real life.

It will work

[Fueki.4753]

@Crab Fear.1624 said:

@Fueki.4753 said:The thing that connects Cantha with the current story line might be Bubbles.Bubbles also might be the enemy Jormag wants the commander to defeat.I can totally see a more of the current story within and around Cantha.

Sometimes a story come from left field.. not unlike real life.

It will work

The left field often is better than the right field anyway.Even looking at WoW:MoP came out of nowhere and allegedly was, except for the arbitrary disgrace of Garrosh, really good.Shadowlands also comes out of nowhere and looks rather promising, compared to how Legion and BfA turned out.

FF14's Shadowbringers also came out of nowhere to me.To me, the most logical step after Stormblood would have been to go after the empire, not a completely different world.

[ProtoGunner.4953]

I am absolutely happy with Cantha. And do not forget, there are some other islands/parts in the south. For example the islands Yeh, Kim, Dayhe, Sunken Isles etc. Check out the world map:

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/a/ac/Tyria_world_fan_map.jpg

That said 250 years is quite a time and they can change some stuff. For example people complain that so many parts are human centric. Though I am pretty sure the Tengu will play a rather big part in this expansion. But let's just wait and see.

[Raven.8156]

Yes, I hope Cantha is re-created without losing it’s essence. I am skeptical sometimes if ArenaNet realizes how many people adore GW factions. I hope they can be mindful and ignore some of these new-age trends... (Intended to be ambiguous)

[Astralporing.1957]

@Hannelore.8153 said:As far as we know, Tyria had no land bridge like Earth, most life would be stuck on the same continent it evolved. Of course, this isn't the case of Orr and Elona because they're physically connected to Central Tyria, and the Humans were spread by the Gods; the same would not be true for any of the races that were native to Tyria such as the Jotun, unless they also used Mists portal magic.From what we know, Tengu managed to spread across both Central Tyria and Cantha well before humans arrived on the scene. There are also races native to other continents that do not exist on Central Tyria (like Naga and Yeti in Cantha), and other ways to travel that do not require crossing ocean (we know, for example, that both Dwarven and Asuran tunnels at some point reached from Central Tyria to Cantha, and probably to other places as well). There are also races that travel over the oceans (Kodan) or live in the water (Quaggan, Krait, Largos).Thus, there's no reason to think that other continents are not inhabited.

[VocalThought.9835]

I think the best thing they can do for this expansion is to stay on track with what they have been doing with Elite Specializations. No Dual Classes, no One Elite to suit them all. Just add an elite specialization, like they did in HOT and POF. If there was going to be a change, add 2 elites, instead of 1. Therefore people can enjoy dabbling with both.

I also think they should add two races, the Tengu and the Largos. I don't care if the use the Charr or Norn body's as a model, but have two races with racial skills and origin stories would definitely make playing worth while.

Finish adding Season 1. Now, of course this shouldn't be part of the expansion, but it definitely worth adding to the game by the time the new expansion comes out.

Since mounts are part of POF Expansion, I don't think adding more mounts should be the the mastery system, unless it's underwater mounts. I think incorporating a similar system like HOT would be fine, if it's done right and actually has great benefit.

I think if they did add a hero system, than you should be able touse your own created character if you wanted, or hire a NPC. It would also be great if your character's personality was factored into the AI on how they play. Almost like in Dragon's Dogma, without them screaming, "Harpy!"

[aspirine.6852]

I feel like the City could be multilayered like HoT was. Not sure about the rest of Cantha though.City would by now have the top rich, the middle normal people and the slums and sewers for the poor/sick/criminal.

[Vayne.8563]

@Brimstone.3807 said:

@"Faline.8795" said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

The fact that it is very likely going to be Cantha themed already answers your question. This in and of itself is a safe and boring choice. Who can blame them? Entertainment media companies these days rarely do anything original anymore. Why should features be unique and genre challenging when they can't even get out of the wayback machine plotwise. Here's to the next few years of going places we've already seen in GW1, more Star Wars and Marvel, and generally no new ideas. Hooray!!

PLayer base: You never listen to us.Anet: WE're doing an expansion. WE're going to Cantha just as so many of you asked for.Playerbase: Cantha is boring why can't we go somewhere new.

You might be bored with Cantha but plenty of people want to see what Cantha's like 250 years after the Ministry of Purity kicked out all the non-human races.

[kharmin.7683]

@Vayne.8563 said:

@Brimstone.3807 said:

@"Faline.8795" said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

The fact that it is very likely going to be Cantha themed already answers your question. This in and of itself is a safe and boring choice. Who can blame them? Entertainment media companies these days rarely do anything original anymore. Why should features be unique and genre challenging when they can't even get out of the wayback machine plotwise. Here's to the next few years of going places we've already seen in GW1, more Star Wars and Marvel, and generally no new ideas. Hooray!!

PLayer base: You never listen to us.Anet: WE're doing an expansion. WE're going to Cantha just as so many of you asked for.Playerbase: Cantha is boring why can't we go somewhere new.

You might be bored with Cantha but plenty of people want to see what Cantha's like 250 years after the Ministry of Purity kicked out all the non-human races.

To be fair, the entire playerbase did NOT want to see Cantha. There were plenty of posts in the forums about wanting to go somewhere else.

[Vayne.8563]

@kharmin.7683 said:

@Vayne.8563 said:

@Brimstone.3807 said:

@"Faline.8795" said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

The fact that it is very likely going to be Cantha themed already answers your question. This in and of itself is a safe and boring choice. Who can blame them? Entertainment media companies these days rarely do anything original anymore. Why should features be unique and genre challenging when they can't even get out of the wayback machine plotwise. Here's to the next few years of going places we've already seen in GW1, more Star Wars and Marvel, and generally no new ideas. Hooray!!

PLayer base: You never listen to us.Anet: WE're doing an expansion. WE're going to Cantha just as so many of you asked for.Playerbase: Cantha is boring why can't we go somewhere new.

You might be bored with Cantha but plenty of people want to see what Cantha's like 250 years after the Ministry of Purity kicked out all the non-human races.

To be fair, the entire playerbase did NOT want to see Cantha. There were plenty of posts in the forums about wanting to go somewhere else.

By percentage, though, there are far more threads asking for Cantha. There was a Cantha thread that lasted for years. Sure I've seen some posts asking to go somewhere esle, but the percentage was always for Cantha. That's being fair.

[kharmin.7683]

More threads, perhaps, but I wonder the ratio of posts in those threads? You are probably closer to accuracy in your point, though. Still, it would be interesting to discover ... but not interesting enough for either of us to pour through all of the Cantha threads and count posts!

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Vayne.8563 said:

@Brimstone.3807 said:

@"Faline.8795" said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

The fact that it is very likely going to be Cantha themed already answers your question. This in and of itself is a safe and boring choice. Who can blame them? Entertainment media companies these days rarely do anything original anymore. Why should features be unique and genre challenging when they can't even get out of the wayback machine plotwise. Here's to the next few years of going places we've already seen in GW1, more Star Wars and Marvel, and generally no new ideas. Hooray!!

PLayer base: You never listen to us.Anet: WE're doing an expansion. WE're going to Cantha just as so many of you asked for.Playerbase: Cantha is boring why can't we go somewhere new.

You might be bored with Cantha but plenty of people want to see what Cantha's like 250 years after the Ministry of Purity kicked out all the non-human races.

Funny enough, I remember the same arguments made about Pandaria for WoW. Then Mist of Pandaria was announced, and then it was released. How things can change.

[Luthan.5236]

They need to satisfy the existing players and try to get back (even if it is only for some time) players that liked the game ... that left cause of "not enough content to satisfy my huge amount of free time to play this game, I'm finishing everything too fast".

Trying to cater towards a new and totally different playerbase could scare away the old players. Too much of a risk. (Especially if they'd try to compete with other cames by going to be similar to them to attract their players. Other game just might be stronger so GW2 would not get more players and the old players wold not like the different style.)

[Vayne.8563]

@kharmin.7683 said:More threads, perhaps, but I wonder the ratio of posts in those threads? You are probably closer to accuracy in your point, though. Still, it would be interesting to discover ... but not interesting enough for either of us to pour through all of the Cantha threads and count posts!

If it was all people saying no it would have went the way of most mount threads. That thread lasted forever and though there were a few nos in it, it didn't last that long based on resistence. A lot of it was people saying it won't happen because of politics more than them saying they didn't want it.

Leave aside the fact that there are so many people who like asian themes stuff because of anime among other things, leave aside the fact that Factions was a massively popular Guild Wars game in it's own right, it's also from a lore perspective, almost a black hole. We know nothing about what's going on there after the Winds of Change content.

Sure I like the idea of going to new places. But I don't like the idea of going to new players more than finding out what happened in the 250 years since we've been cut off from Cantha. For all practical purposes it'll be a new location.

[sasya neko.1985]

@Obtena.7952 said:

@sorudo.9054 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@robertthebard.8150 said:

@Faline.8795 said:

@Obtena.7952 said:

@Faline.8795 said:So with the new expac, are they going to be doing something different, or will it be "more of the same", thus not really bring attractive to new players?

Let's hope it does ... because it's the 'choir' that pays the bills.

Yes, that is true. But are they paying the bills enough? Is this new expact GW2's "last chance" to lift itself before ANet gives up?

And do they really just want to keep what they have? Are they really not going to go for new blood?

I see this "new blood" referenced a lot on Pg 1 of this thread, but I'm curious: What is it that you think a new player is actually looking for from GW 2? You see, that long time established players

might

be burnt out on what's here, new players haven't experienced any of it yet. It seems to me, from the prospective of a "relatively new player", that there's a lot of projection going on; "We're going to be unhappy, but just saying that won't leverage any sympathy, so let's claim it's going to adversely affect new players, that'll give our arguments some weight".

True. My problem with this 'new player' claim is that it's a fallacy. Technically, all the

current

content qualifies as new for a new player ... but for some reason people think an expansion will bring them in? I don't get that logic.

If anything, I think the longer a game is out, the harder it will be for new players to get into it and that includes more expansions.

for a long time i got bored in WoW, legions actually won me over.what i mean by this is that, if an expansion is done right it can get even the most hard to satisfy player onboard.this is now for Anet to discover what that thing is, it will ether win ppl over or fail hard.

Sure, but in that case, you weren't new, you were just bored and came back. I'm talking about completely new players who never played GW2. 8YO game and 3 expansions in ... as a new player, you would feel so far behind.

I came back from since vanilla, you cant see that as just comming back when i left after BC was released and tried it on a private server.So in a way i was really new.

[TheGrimm.5624]

@Fueki.4753 said:The thing that connects Cantha with the current story line might be Bubbles.Bubbles also might be the enemy Jormag wants the commander to defeat.I can totally see a more of the current story within and around Cantha.

Had the same thought running, solid state vs liquid state. Makes sense there would be some conflict here.

[Fueki.4753]

@TheGrimm.5624 said:

@Fueki.4753 said:The thing that connects Cantha with the current story line might be Bubbles.Bubbles also might be the enemy Jormag wants the commander to defeat.I can totally see a more of the current story within and around Cantha.

Had the same thought running, solid state vs liquid state. Makes sense there would be some conflict here.

We don't even know if Water is one of Bubbles' domains.

[Kodama.6453]

@Fueki.4753 said:

@TheGrimm.5624 said:

@Fueki.4753 said:The thing that connects Cantha with the current story line might be Bubbles.Bubbles also might be the enemy Jormag wants the commander to defeat.I can totally see a more of the current story within and around Cantha.

Had the same thought running, solid state vs liquid state. Makes sense there would be some conflict here.

We don't even know if Water is one of Bubbles' domains.

Taimi directly calls this one "The Water Dragon".Has been called "Deep Sea Dragon" before names like Bubbles or Steve have shown up.Their minions are described as beings made out of water.

I think it is a pretty safe bet that water is supposed to be one of Bubbles' domains.