Mystic Coin Scarcity Problem - [Merged]

[Crystal Paladin.3871]

9 minutes ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Doubt "most people buy them off black market".

maybe maybe not... if 3 months back , someone would've told me that ppl buy stuff from others apart from TP and contact thru reddit forums, i wouldn't have believed them... but reading those reddit threads totally gave me a new perspective... 🤔

[Sobx.1758]

2 hours ago, Crystal Paladin.3871 said:

maybe maybe not... if 3 months back , someone would've told me that ppl buy stuff from others apart from TP and contact thru reddit forums, i wouldn't have believed them... but reading those reddit threads totally gave me a new perspective... 🤔

It might be new perspective for you, but it isn't for many others. Judging by the threads, I still wouldn't say that majority are buying legendaries through black market. Also worth pointing  out that your doubts about people not actually crafting those by themselves should be getting smaller every time you see a gen2 weapon 😜 -and these eat twice the amount of MCs compared to gen1.

 

 

Edited July 2, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[DeanBB.4268]

1 hour ago, Eraden.8740 said:

When I found out that Legendaries are really only a side-grade to ascended gear, I lost all interest in crafting them (regretting having put points into Legendary Crafting Masteries now). My mystic coins are now just gathering dust in my bank vault. It's only a small pile, about 160 coins or so, but perhaps I should consider selling them if they will be of no use to me. Are there really a lot of people working on Legendaries? I occasionally see someone in map chat announcing a Legendary that they just made, but it really doesn't seem like it's a common occurrence.

Look up mystic coins on the wiki to see what else they are used for. There may be other things you can craft that would be of interest.

 

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mystic_Forge/Equipment

[Kitty.4806]

They shouldn't be this expensive, and it's hurting a lot of players looking forward to using the armory.

Please add coins to metas or something, that way people actually play metas more.

[JUN YANG.4328]

I dont think they will. in fact they want pricing goes up. that's why they comes up legendary armory system. they want more player to craft legendary so all the item pricing can increase so you need to find the way to get gold and  players use their real money to top up gold / gems. this how they make money. 

 

you can have few other way to get mystic coins. daily log in , fractal, leyline hunt.  and dont convert coins into clovers. you can get clover by doing wvw and pvp track. (easy clover farm). unless you done all non repeatable track. 

 

its better stock up some Mat 6 if you can. those pricing will also go up. 

 

[Veprovina.4876]

Here's the default answers from the community:

 

- I'd rather they spend their resources on something else. 

- There's nothing wrong with Mystic coin acquisition.

- You get plenty of MC just by logging in.

- 2g for 1 MC is too cheap.

- Farm gold and buy them (from TP barons that actually have 99% of MC monopoly).

- There's nothing wrong with how MC work (even though they are constantly abused).

- The price is great for new players that want to sell them and get some gold for their gear (and TP barons will gladly buy them for their out of TP trading and RMT).

 

EDIT: Additional input from other people:

  

8 hours ago, knite.1542 said:

 

You forgot, "Just buy 200 accounts. Free mystic coins."

 

 

1 hour ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

You forgot some:

- just wait, the bubble will burst anytime now,

and

- the price is stable - the curent increase is just a temporary spike.

 

 

Have fun with the community that hates itself! 😁

Edited July 13, 2021 by Veprovina.4876
Added new info to the post by other people.

[Crab Fear.1624]

Please o Please....Anet...PLEEEEEASSSE make it easier to craft LEGENDAAAAIRES......pleeeeeeeeeeeese

 

 

 

Edit: NO

Edited July 13, 2021 by Crab Fear.1624
No

[JUN YANG.4328]

1 minute ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

Please o Please....Anet...PLEEEEEASSSE make it easier to craft LEGENDAAAAIRES......pleeeeeeeeeeeese

ha.. thats funny. they already make it lot easier for 1st gen legendary.  back to 5 years ago is really hard to get a legendary. i remember i spent 4~5 month to craft my first one (sunrise)

 

no mount, world completion need to included wvw's map ( it really hard for new player to travel wvw map back to the old days)

precursor (dawn) cost around 700~800g and its really hard to farm gold

 

I spent 5~6 hours per day for doing dungeon. (live like hell)

 

Now if i want to craft a sunrise maximum 2 month from sketch for 1~2 hours play pre day. 

[Eloc Freidon.5692]

Legendaries require sacrifice.

[knite.1542]

1 hour ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

Here's the default answers from the community:

 

- I'd rather they spend their resources on something else. 

- There's nothing wrong with Mystic coin acquisition.

- You get plenty of MC just by logging in.

- 2g for 1 MC is too cheap.

- Farm gold and buy them (from TP barons that actually have 99% of MC monopoly).

- There's nothing wrong with how MC work (even though they are constantly abused).

- The price is great for new players that want to sell them and get some gold for their gear (and TP barons will gladly buy them for their out of TP trading and RMT).

 

 

Have fun with the community that hates itself! 😁

 

You forgot, "Just buy 200 accounts. Free mystic coins."

 

Also overall this isn't a problem for me but I do agree that it is kind of rough right now.

[Cyninja.2954]

Do the currently return story achievements. They all reward additional Mystic Coins on top of those available via other methods.

 

The release of the legendary armory today does the bulk of the work to drive the price up, on nearly all materials related to legendary items. The rest is basic inflation of price, which when correcting for the spike caused by manipulation, saw MC at around 2g - 2g10s (remember when the buy walls were removed and the price did not fall to sub 2g?).

 

If you are concerned about Mystic Coins on the day that quality of life patches drop which heavily favor price increases on specific goods, well welcome to the 99% because that's all the other players like you who got on the train at the same time.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Cyninja.2954

[Veprovina.4876]

1 hour ago, knite.1542 said:

 

You forgot, "Just buy 200 accounts. Free mystic coins."

 

Also overall this isn't a problem for me but I do agree that it is kind of rough right now.

Right! How could i forget that!

 

And it's not a problem for me either kind of, I do WvW so I get an ok amount of clovers for what I need, but MC aren't just used for legendary, a lot

of skins are left just existing because no one wants to waste their MC on them. Its a shame.

 

41 minutes ago, Pacificterror.7805 said:

Gives people something to work toward, in my opinion. 2G each isn't -that- insane.....people wanted to push it up to 5G per coin at one point, while Casiano was still a main player controlling them.

Therein lies the problem no? The sheer fact that they can be controlled by one player and that they're so susceptible to manipulation. 

[Pacificterror.7805]

1 minute ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

Therein lies the problem no? The sheer fact that they can be controlled by one player and that they're so susceptible to manipulation. 

 

I'm not against adding new sources of MC if people feel there aren't enough in the market, but I personally don't feel the price in itself is an issue.

 

As an aside, even without TP barons, it's a widely used currency for trading outside the TP due to the cap on withdrawing gold from mail....plenty of "gray market" traders have stacks of coins. Remove that as a desirable currency to use and they'll fall back on the other widely used currencies like GoE, various T6 mats, etc.....I think out of all the items they use, MC is the one I care the least about being manipulated, honestly.

[Stalkingwolf.6035]

its the currency every f2p has to sell you some other currency for money. so its in the favor from anet that it is what it is.

[Seirus.8934]

Been playing for a year and a half and I have over 300 of them sitting in my bank rn, 99% of them I get from the weekly login reward. I dont really use the mystic forge much (Confuses the crap out of me) so they are like a nice juicy savings account for me.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Seirus.8934

[fatihso.7258]

1 hour ago, Pacificterror.7805 said:

Gives people something to work toward, in my opinion. 2G each isn't -that- insane.....people wanted to push it up to 5G per coin at one point, while Casiano was still a main player controlling them.

 

If that player is one of those crafting a legendary once a year or two, then yeah 2 gold is okay otherwise I have near 40 legendary pieces over 5 years (with long breaks) and in that case coin and clovers with all current means of acquisition and without gem to gold, they are expensive and does not keep up with the need and timegated. Right now I'm going for the last batch of weapons and it's ridiculous how many coins and clovers needed to craft them all at once. Gw2 is on par with grindy Korean mmos with its legendary crafting system.

[Rasimir.6239]

1 hour ago, fatihso.7258 said:

Right now I'm going for the last batch of weapons and it's ridiculous how many coins and clovers needed to craft them all at once. Gw2 is on par with grindy Korean mmos with its legendary crafting system.

The game is what you make of it. If your goal is to short-cut a crafting process that was meant to take months per item, then that's your choice, but don't complain about a grindy goal you've chosen yourself.

On the topic of mystic coins, I personally am ok with both price and modes of aquisiton. Fortunately the things I look for in my MMO are not prestige items. I actually have several legendary items, mostly from playing for many years and occasionally finding enough resources in my storage to craft something nice, but I don't see any reason to grind for them.

All of my characters have equipment (some ascended, some exotic) that does the job and enables me to enjoy playing them. This is probably not the best MMO to play if your main focus is on aquiring prestige/top tier items, but for the rest of us the price of mystic coins isn't a problem.

[Danikat.8537]

There already are events which give mystic coins, as well as Fractal dailies and challenge modes, PvP tournaments and some achievements. Maybe Anet thinks not enough people are doing the activities which reward mystic coins already and either they're not an effective incentive or they don't want to spread that population out more.

 

Or maybe they think the current price and supply is ok. Legendaries have always been expensive. The exact price and which parts are the most expensive changes over time but they've never been cheap to make and that's almost certainly intended (for example when precursor crafting was introduced they deliberately made it include thousands of high tier materials).

 

Maybe Anet think the current situation is great because new or casual players with no intention of making legendaries can sell their mystic coins for easy gold, which makes other goals seem more achievable for them, and players who are making legendaries either have to space it out to wait for legendaries from login rewards (which keeps them logging in daily) or play more to farm coins or gold.

 

I don't know, but given players have been complaining about the price of mystic coins for a very long time (pretty much since HoT released and the price of precursors ceased to be the big barrier in making a legendary) and Anet have done relatively little to add to their availability it wouldn't surprise me if they're ok with the current price.

 

I'm not disagreeing that they're expensive BTW, especially if you're trying to make multiple legendaries in a short space of time, but presenting it as a problem which needs to be fixed assumes that's not supposed to be the case, whereas all of Anet's actions on the matter seem to imply that they want mystic coins to be expensive and/or slow to obtain as part of the cost of making a legendary and the other items they're used for.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Danikat.8537

[Astralporing.1957]

8 hours ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

Here's the default answers from the community:

 

- I'd rather they spend their resources on something else. 

- There's nothing wrong with Mystic coin acquisition.

- You get plenty of MC just by logging in.

- 2g for 1 MC is too cheap.

- Farm gold and buy them (from TP barons that actually have 99% of MC monopoly).

- There's nothing wrong with how MC work (even though they are constantly abused).

- The price is great for new players that want to sell them and get some gold for their gear (and TP barons will gladly buy them for their out of TP trading and RMT).

 

You forgot some:

- just wait, the bubble will burst anytime now,

and

- the price is stable - the curent increase is just a temporary spike.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Astralporing.1957

[Omega.6801]

Has been brought up many times and, according to ANet, there is no problem, everything is fine.

[Veprovina.4876]

53 minutes ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

You forgot some:

- just wait, the bubble will burst anytime now,

and

- the price is stable - the curent increase is just a temporary spike.

You're right! I'll edit yours and knite's into my post. 😄

6 hours ago, Stalkingwolf.6035 said:

its the currency every f2p has to sell you some other currency for money. so its in the favor from anet that it is what it is.

F2p accounts don't get mystic coins or any login rewards.Unless you count the ones they might get from other sources, but then it defeats the purpose anyway...

6 hours ago, Pacificterror.7805 said:

 

I'm not against adding new sources of MC if people feel there aren't enough in the market, but I personally don't feel the price in itself is an issue.

 

As an aside, even without TP barons, it's a widely used currency for trading outside the TP due to the cap on withdrawing gold from mail....plenty of "gray market" traders have stacks of coins. Remove that as a desirable currency to use and they'll fall back on the other widely used currencies like GoE, various T6 mats, etc.....I think out of all the items they use, MC is the one I care the least about being manipulated, honestly.

That's exactly the problem. Since they're used for out of TP trading, they need to keep a steady price because if it fluctuates too much, it's useless for trading. And since they're a somewhat finite resource, one of the few (if not only) timegated item that can be sold directly on TP, they're the easiest to manipulate.

 

It's easy for a few barons with tens of millions of gold to fill the first 100 slots of buy orders full of 2g, 1,99g, 1,98g etc., buy orders and always "refresh" those orders if it comes too low. And it will never drop too low because of the time gate, so they don't have to check the price daily. There's nothing "genuine" about the current MC price, especially since a baron can keep the price up by just filling buy orders - they have the money, normal players don't. And that's what's happening. I bet the first page of orders for MC are all from various barons to keep them from going too low.

 

The community always says "there's an abundance of MC". Well why are they 2 gold then? If there's an abundance of something on the TP then the price usually drops to almost nothign. Either there's not enough MC, or the majority (or the abundance) of MC are in the posession of a few people, while normal people don't have enough.

 

This would never happen with T6 mats since they're farmable, and all the AFK necros are doing god's work by buying volatile magic and Trophy shipments to fill the TP with mats. That's why T6 mats will never be used for off TP trading.

 

What's more, off TP trading leaves gold in circulation that would otherwise be eaten up by the TP fees. Meaning inflation, and stuff costing more gold or silver than it usually would had that gold been sunk into TP. And this affects everyone, but starts with MC being traded out of TP.

 

In the end - if 3 people have 95% of a resource, the market will always "stabilize" to the price they dictate. And all the people who go "well i can just sell mine for 2 gold a piece" - you're selling them to TP barons who then gain more power to manipulate the price by hoarding MC.

 

Of course - Anet will never do anything about this because it basically prints money for them. TP barons trade out of TP with MC and leave more gold in circulation as a result, normal players need to buy gems to convert to gold in order to keep up - Anet gains money from gem sales.

 

They can easily put a vendor in the game that sells MC for 20 silver a piece, or even less if they really want to destroy every TP baron out there, but who will buy gold then?

[Cyninja.2954]

23 minutes ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

It's easy for a few barons with tens of millions of gold to fill the first 100 slots of buy orders full of 2g, 1,99g, 1,98g etc., buy orders and always "refresh" those orders if it comes too low. And it will never drop too low because of the time gate, so they don't have to check the price daily. There's nothing "genuine" about the current MC price, especially since a baron can keep the price up by just filling buy orders - they have the money, normal players don't. And that's what's happening. I bet the first page of orders for MC are all from various barons to keep them from going too low.

First off, the maximum any account can hold in Coin is 200,000 gold. That's the cap.

 

Second, most barons don't buy MC to manipulate the market. If you did any trading at all, you would understand why. The fringe case of Casiano was because he was using gold made from duped items to finance his MC manipulation. He literally wasted gold, of which he had enough through illegitimate means, to fund his project. (also notice that the Mystic Coin price returned to expected price levels after the illegitimately funded price walls were removed. Aka if you looked at a chart and traced where the MC price would have been if the price growth continued organically. Not an indicator of manipulation but rather an inflation loss proof commodity, but I'm sure you were one of the people who assumed once those walls were removed prices would drop to 2017 levels again.).

 

There are some good videos of MightyTeapot where he interviews some of the biggest traders in GW2. Nothing you said even remotely applies to what they do. In fact some "barons" even actively are against a high Mystic Coin price and are arguing it's to high (based on what they expect where the price should be to be healthy or reasonable).

 

Take off your tinfoil hat please.

 

Quote

The community always says "there's an abundance of MC". Well why are they 2 gold then? If there's an abundance of something on the TP then the price usually drops to almost nothign. Either there's not enough MC, or the majority (or the abundance) of MC are in the posession of a few people, while normal people don't have enough.

Something being in abundance does not automatically mean it has to be cheap.

 

You also do not seem to understand basic economic principles. Something "not being enough" has nothing to do with it being expensive. If it was not enough, it's price would move towards infinite. That does not apply here. The only thing which applies here is you being unhappy with the price.

 

Quote

This would never happen with T6 mats since they're farmable, and all the AFK necros are doing god's work by buying volatile magic and Trophy shipments to fill the TP with mats. That's why T6 mats will never be used for off TP trading.

Yes, T6 materials are farm-able and their price has been on a steady decline for years, with a short spike now due to a drastic increase in demand.

 

T6 materials are being used in off TP trading. They are being sold in bulk for X amount of gold to circumvent the TP tax for both buyer and seller. What they are not being used for is currency.

Quote

What's more, off TP trading leaves gold in circulation that would otherwise be eaten up by the TP fees. Meaning inflation, and stuff costing more gold or silver than it usually would had that gold been sunk into TP. And this affects everyone, but starts with MC being traded out of TP.

Everything being traded outside of the TP. So your beef is with the gray market next to the TP. Sounds good. Make an educated post about that and don't single out 1 specific commodity.

Quote

In the end - if 3 people have 95% of a resource, the market will always "stabilize" to the price they dictate. And all the people who go "well i can just sell mine for 2 gold a piece" - you're selling them to TP barons who then gain more power to manipulate the price by hoarding MC.

That does not apply here. Rest assured, if there was this big an oligopoly, the devs would have intervened. You are just making things up to feed your hyperbole.

Quote

Of course - Anet will never do anything about this because it basically prints money for them. TP barons trade out of TP with MC and leave more gold in circulation as a result, normal players need to buy gems to convert to gold in order to keep up - Anet gains money from gem sales.

No one is forced to buy gold or buy gems to convert to gold in order to purchase things on the TP.

 

People do, well because they do. Congratulations, you have successfully shown one source of demand which keeps and allows the price of MC to rise.

 

Edited July 13, 2021 by Cyninja.2954

[Veprovina.4876]

4 minutes ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

First off, the maximum any account can hold in Coin is 200,000 gold. That's the cap.

 

Second, most barons don't buy MC to manipulate the market. If you did any trading at all, you would understand why. The fringe case of Casiano was because he was using gold made from duped items to finance his MC manipulation. He literally wasted gold, of which he had enough through illegitimate means, to fund his project. (also notice that the Mystic Coin price returned to expected prices after the illegitimately funded price walls were removed. Aka if you looked at a chart, where the MC price would have been if the price growth continued. Not an indicator of manipulation but rather an inflation value loss proof commodity, but I'm sure you were one of the people who assumed once those walls were removed prices would drop to 2017 levels again.).

 

There are some good videos of MightyTeapot where he interviews some of the biggest traders in GW2. Nothing you said even remotely applies to what they do. In fact some "barons" even actively are against a high Mystic Coin price and are arguing it's to high (based on what they expect where the price should be to be healthy or reasonable).

 

Take off your tinfoil hat please.

 

Something being in abundance does not automatically mean it has to be cheap.

 

You also do not seem to understand basic economic principles. Something "not being enough" has nothing to do with it being expensive. If it was not enough, it's price would move towards infinite. That does not apply here. The only thing which applies here is you being unhappy with the price.

 

Yes, T6 materials are farm-able and their price has been on a steady decline for years, with a short spike now due to a drastic increase in demand.

 

T6 materials are being used in off TP trading. They are being sold in bulk for X amount of gold to circumvent the TP tax for both buyer and seller. What they are not being used for is currency.

Everything being traded outside of the TP. So your beef is with the gray market next to the TP. Sounds good. Make an educated post about that and don't single out 1 specific commodity.

That does not apply here. Rest assured, if there was this big an oligopoly, the devs would have intervened. You are just making things up to feed your hyperbole.

No one is forced to buy gold or buy gems to convert to gold in order to purchase things on the TP.

 

People do, well because they do. Congratulations, you have successfully shown one source of demand which keeps and allows the price of MC to rise.

 

And this is why we can't have nice things. 🙂

[Cyninja.2954]

2 minutes ago, Veprovina.4876 said:

And this is why we can't have nice things. 🙂

Except for all the players who can sell their Mystic Coins because they have no need for them, right? Still by far the vast majority in this game.

Edited July 13, 2021 by Cyninja.2954

[Veprovina.4876]

5 minutes ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

Except for all the players who can sell their Mystic Coins because they have no need for them, right? Still by far the vast majority in this game.

I already wrote what i think about that and how it affects things, i don't want to repeat myself.

In short - poor players selling MC just feeds the rich and the problem remains the same.