Suggestion for countering permastealth thieves/dead-eyes.

[Chips.7968]

On 8/22/2021 at 4:37 PM, Ronin.4501 said:

With the new specializations recently beta-tested, Anet added a new corruption; blight. 

 

I suggest to counter perma-stealth thieves and dead-eyes, for every 2-4s (I'm open to suggestions for the duration at which blight is acquired) a thief/dead-eye is stealthed, they acquire 1 stack of blight, or another new corruption similar to stealth such as a confusion-type blight.  This would make stealth more of a risk/reward feature the way overheating affects Holosmoths and blight affects Harbingers.

 

I'm sure the thief/dead-eye crowd will hate it, but after 9 years of dealing with a broken mechanic and 5 years of dealing with a broken class (dead-eyes), I think it's time Anet did something.

 

So the most pressing issue with WvW is deadeye; the class that you're lucky to see* 1 in every 100 players running.

 

 

Erm, ok? Barely see thieves anymore, and even fewer playing dead eye (I assume because it's kitten boring). 

 

 

*insert meme invisible can't see joke.

[MaLong.2079]

The problem is how powerful other skills become when the player is invisible. A skill used from stealth becomes almost impossible to dodge. You could block, maybe if you have something like aegis, but dodge? good luck. The other problem is retargeting. I think we should retarget automatically when our opponent comes out of stealth. As simple as it may sound, retargeting is an additional step that delays the response and gives an advantage to the stealther. Also targeting provides important information about boons, conditions etc.

 

I don't think it will change though.

[Bunny.9834]

1 hour ago, MaLong.2079 said:

The problem is how powerful other skills become when the player is invisible. A skill used from stealth becomes almost impossible to dodge. You could block, maybe if you have something like aegis, but dodge? good luck. The other problem is retargeting. I think we should retarget automatically when our opponent comes out of stealth. As simple as it may sound, retargeting is an additional step that delays the response and gives an advantage to the stealther. Also targeting provides important information about boons, conditions etc.

 

I don't think it will change though.

 

Most skills such as Death's Judgement and Binding Shadow reveals you already. The only thing viable nowadays is Malicious Backstab. But even that is severely nerfed since they reworked the mechanic for deadeye's Malice and core's Lead Attacks. 

 

DE Rifle is also not that threatening anymore due to numerous nerfs to initiative and damage. Also unlike Rangers, Rifle's range is and line of sight is easier to obstruct. But speaking of Stealth... a SB ranger can one shot you from stealth from 1500 range WHILE being mobile. 

 

[Psycoprophet.8107]

On 8/22/2021 at 12:21 PM, subversiontwo.7501 said:

I don't think you need to reinvent the wheel. You just need to look at some traits and how too much of builds and specs channel into the same places. There are so many powerful things rolled into the core mechanics (stealth, dodge, init, etc.) rather than being button choices. That's what separates vanilla Thief from PoF Thief.

 

It also has a number of stacked abilities that synergizes into these traits. This may not be the best example because it isn't the most popular choice by any stretch, but I think it is a very clear cut example of my point: Look at the heal Hide in shadows. It is a big heal, a stealth, a buff and a cleanse. It can then be more heals, more stealth, more cleanse, more initative and so forth out of triggers. There are more and better examples, but I am in a rush.

 

On other classes more of those things have been nerfed. It's becomming a tired example but Warriors and stuns. There's a reason Bull's charge is no longer a port, a knock, high damage or triggers a whole slew chain reactions that makes it hit harder, knock longer, travel faster or setup more skills and traits better.

 

Synergy and building into it is good to a point. However, synergies also need to be balanced and asessed.

 

These are good points^.

[AliamRationem.5172]

On 8/27/2021 at 8:04 PM, Caedmon.6798 said:

in a case like that,especially when you have multiple people you make use of stealth traps and mark throw and it should be over. But its a thing i also see happening on my server where people dont use disablers while they should,dont use traps while they should etc,its on them. Just communicate with the ones trying to get the thief. A good thief knows how to perm stealth easily,a baddie as the one you described aswell will get caught out easily. Lay down the traps on places you know the thief will walk by, especially when you know he's about to port people in ,lay them on walls. You can run around on your mount with the mark throw in your hand,jump off and insta throw when you see him aswell. It cannot be dodged or be ignored in any way. A proper 30 sec reveal will make him either leave the tower or keep,or youre able to put on enough pressure that he gets down. Otherwise, a thief that doesnt wanna be seen,wont be seen. Make use of what you have available,people can also slot some reveals in this case.

 

How to catch 1 thief by coordinating an entire group of players.  Clearly, stealth is fine.

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

3 minutes ago, AliamRationem.5172 said:

 

How to catch 1 thief by coordinating an entire group of players.  Clearly, stealth is fine.

It's really easy to counter teefs!
You should simply throw Target Painters at teef and hope that it'll hit and stick to them, if it happens then you have some chances against them and their amount of evasions and mobility! But hey, they can still stealth, so you pretty much didn't change anything in the encounter, so stay positivie and fight them! If somehow you brought teef to around 40% of their hp they'll run away from fight to the nearest cave or spawn to hide from you, that means that YOU WON THE  F I G H T, gratz! Teef comes back after healing up? JUST DO SAME THING AS BEFORE! Oya? You run out of supplies? Worry not! Keep pressuring them and they'll eventually flee away to reset a fight again, but what if you actually want to kill them? Well, you just have to catch them, but nothing really can chase them in reality, so you just let them go and again YOU WON THE  F I G H T, gratz! You say you have problems with BLIND spam? Bruh, you just AA them and it'll vanish! What do you mean visual bugs and desyncs? You can't see teef even though you get hit by them? I've never encountered such thing in my entire career as ganker since 2012! Well, I never fight other teef players, since I don't see them very often on the open! Why you complain about me playing with my other teef frandz that camp stealth and try to one shot? You just need to bring frandz!
- Teef mains, probably ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

A good start would be no more stealth staking, highest amount of steath - 3 seconds. Rework skill and traits that expand stealth into something else.
Reveal triggers either if you attack or not, as soon as the 3 seconds expire you're revealed.

Edit: I play core mesmer with PU and 3 stealth skills so this would affect me as well.

Edited September 1, 2021 by Lincolnbeard.1735

[DeceiverX.8361]

17 hours ago, MaLong.2079 said:

The problem is how powerful other skills become when the player is invisible. A skill used from stealth becomes almost impossible to dodge. You could block, maybe if you have something like aegis, but dodge? good luck. The other problem is retargeting. I think we should retarget automatically when our opponent comes out of stealth. As simple as it may sound, retargeting is an additional step that delays the response and gives an advantage to the stealther. Also targeting provides important information about boons, conditions etc.

 

I don't think it will change though.

This is only because of many professions getting stealth and how it can be stacked. 

It's really easy to dodge most Stealth Attacks from thief once you're practiced, as they follow pretty much the same exact timer every time.  If stealth only lasted 3s every time, it'd be extremely easy to negate.

[kash.9213]

23 hours ago, Legendary Defender.5631 said:

Just remove stealth altogether. Its a kittenous ability and it gives absolutely no reprecussions for using such kittenous ability. it only rewards, meaning it rewards the cow ward using it. If anet had one gram of foresight this game would be 1million times better

Except I have to break stealth to hurt you, and my Stealth Attacks are something you should be able to manage. Retooling some skills and traits to phase out elongated reset fights would be great but you're being a little infantile with that request. 

17 hours ago, MaLong.2079 said:

The problem is how powerful other skills become when the player is invisible. A skill used from stealth becomes almost impossible to dodge. You could block, maybe if you have something like aegis, but dodge? good luck. The other problem is retargeting. I think we should retarget automatically when our opponent comes out of stealth. As simple as it may sound, retargeting is an additional step that delays the response and gives an advantage to the stealther. Also targeting provides important information about boons, conditions etc.

 

I don't think it will change though.

They already made changes to deal with that. Again, you should be able to deal with at least Stealth Attacks, not sure about other classes. You better not get hit much by Death's Judgment at least or you're just not paying attention. 

[KrHome.1920]

22 hours ago, MaLong.2079 said:

I think we should retarget automatically when our opponent comes out of stealth. As simple as it may sound, retargeting is an additional step that delays the response and gives an advantage to the stealther.

 

This sounds like a litte mechanical change but in fact would be the biggest nerf to stealth the game has seen yet.

 

We can already retarget via the "previous target" keyboard shortcut. This is a good balance of being able to reselect your target and stealth being a distraction mechanic.

[Caedmon.6798]

On 9/1/2021 at 4:01 PM, AliamRationem.5172 said:

 

How to catch 1 thief by coordinating an entire group of players.  Clearly, stealth is fine.

One guy can do it ,but most people dont bother to counter,hence Those need to coordinate.

[solemn.9608]

I finally got sick of dying to them and I've been playing shadow arts daredevil unironically all morning and it's even easier and effective than I had imagined. Dagger mainhand brrrrrts like an A-10 warthog, all the while teef mains cry "stop nerfing our autoattack/class it doesn't do any damage anymore!" whilst everything teef does provides insane DPS, even dagger mainhand autoattack which was """"nerfed"""", let's just give them 1500 range while you're at it; oh wait, ya did, deadeye.

 

I don't know what to do about it, I just know anything involving shadow arts traitline is broken and a lot of other builds without shadow arts are squishy/vulnerable to CC spam (though being able to 1 or 3 hit from stealth even without SA is annoying and unengaging as well, because teef just does too much dmg in general). So I almost can't blame teefs for running SA. Except I can, because it requires less facerolling/skilled gameplay than scourge bombs.

Maybe just delete the thief class?

 

edit: ele main who has no reveals and even if I did I wouldn't use them because I'm locked into running certain traits/utilities for any of my builds to be reasonably good. Running a reveal, if I had one, would just screw me up vs a non-sa build, why bother when it's lose/lose.

 

edit2: it's worth mentioning that teef isn't the only problems in WvW roaming. It's just one of the bigger problems. Soulbeast in general, engi nade spam/flamethrower, sw/f boring fire weaver, core necro, condi mirage, me-press-one-button-to-win-whilst-evading sword revenant, endless warrior cc spam (although warrior could use a few buffs in general), 1-trap-to-win DH. All these builds could be fine, if they were just tuned down a little bit.

Edited September 7, 2021 by solemn.9608

[Telgum.6071]

1 hour ago, solemn.9608 said:

I finally got sick of dying to them and I've been playing shadow arts daredevil unironically all morning and it's even easier and effective than I had imagined. Dagger mainhand brrrrrts like an A-10 warthog, all the while teef mains cry "stop nerfing our autoattack/class it doesn't do any damage anymore!" whilst everything teef does provides insane DPS, even dagger mainhand autoattack which was """"nerfed"""", let's just give them 1500 range while you're at it; oh wait, ya did, deadeye.

 

I don't know what to do about it, I just know anything involving shadow arts traitline is broken and a lot of other builds without shadow arts are squishy/vulnerable to CC spam (though being able to 1 or 3 hit from stealth even without SA is annoying and unengaging as well, because teef just does too much dmg in general). So I almost can't blame teefs for running SA. Except I can, because it requires less facerolling/skilled gameplay than scourge bombs.

Maybe just delete the thief class?

 

edit: ele main who has no reveals and even if I did I wouldn't use them because I'm locked into running certain traits/utilities for any of my builds to be reasonably good. Running a reveal, if I had one, would just screw me up vs a non-sa build, why bother when it's lose/lose.

 

edit2: it's worth mentioning that teef isn't the only problems in WvW roaming. It's just one of the bigger problems. Soulbeast in general, engi nade spam/flamethrower, sw/f boring fire weaver, core necro, condi mirage, me-press-one-button-to-win-whilst-evading sword revenant, endless warrior cc spam (although warrior could use a few buffs in general), 1-trap-to-win DH. All these builds could be fine, if they were just tuned down a little bit.

Of course it had to be an elementalist player. Seems like after spamming 100 skills + permanent protection + permanent regeneration + stability + full condition cleanse + two invulnerabilities + trailblazer/celestial abuse by default + projectile hate one gets bored after some time and has to try other classes.

Yeah buddy, Revenant, Dragonhunter and Soulbeast are OP too, tell me more. /s

PS. I don't know why you write """""nerfed"""""". Check the notes, tell me what you see. Lotus Strike is the only chain skill that can be considered better now that on release.

Double Strike - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Wild Strike - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Lotus Strike - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Backstab - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Edited September 7, 2021 by Telgum.6071

[Exzen.2976]

2 hours ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Of course it had to be an elementalist player. Seems like after spamming 100 skills + permanent protection + permanent regeneration + stability + full condition cleanse + two invulnerabilities + trailblazer/celestial abuse by default + projectile hate one gets bored after some time and has to try other classes.

Yeah buddy, Revenant, Dragonhunter and Soulbeast are OP too, tell me more. /s

PS. I don't know why you write """""nerfed"""""". Check the notes, tell me what you see. Lotus Strike is the only chain skill that can be considered better now that on release.

Double Strike - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Wild Strike - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Lotus Strike - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

Backstab - Guild Wars 2 Wiki (GW2W)

I'll echo Solemn's comments as another ele main - who doesn't play with permanent protection, regeneration, stab, full condition cleanse, only 1 invuln, mara/valk/zerk but I do use projectile hate since its pretty much mandatory for roaming on ele. The lack of reveals on ele definitely hurts.

 

I also find playing thief much easier/more effective and find stealth in general completely op. I have videos of killing people 1vX with just an offhand dagger, no mainhand or second weapon set. Says a lot about the strength of the class that you don't even need stealth attacks or even auto attacks.

 

I don't think anyone (well most people) wants thief to be unplayable, but it would be good if they were fun to fight and balanced. I.e. not having to fight near a tower or sentry/not having to use an item to reveal/using reveal skills (if they are even available to the class, rip ele). I am also aware that other classes have access to stealth - engi can be a problem with grenades etc, but really the main culprit is thief due to the easy access.

 

I also think the reveal from sentries and towers etc is really bad design and should never have been introduced. 

 

I'm not sure blight is the answer, but a full stealth rework would be much healthier for the game - as long as this also involved reworking and balancing classes like thief that rely heavily on stealth. 

Edited September 7, 2021 by Exzen.2976

[KrHome.1920]

1 hour ago, Exzen.2976 said:

I also find playing thief much easier/more effective and find stealth in general completely op. I have videos of killing people 1vX with just an offhand dagger, no mainhand or second weapon set. Says a lot about the strength of the class that you don't even need stealth attacks or even auto attacks.

 

Killing players with of cloak and dagger alone does only say something about the player killed.

 

At some point you have to blame stupidity, but not OP'ness.

[Twilight Tempest.7584]

5 hours ago, Exzen.2976 said:

I have videos of killing people 1vX with just an offhand dagger, no mainhand or second weapon set.

 

Link?

[Telgum.6071]

8 hours ago, Exzen.2976 said:

I'll echo Solemn's comments as another ele main - who doesn't play with permanent protection, regeneration, stab, full condition cleanse, only 1 invuln, mara/valk/zerk but I do use projectile hate since its pretty much mandatory for roaming on ele. The lack of reveals on ele definitely hurts.

 

I also find playing thief much easier/more effective and find stealth in general completely op. I have videos of killing people 1vX with just an offhand dagger, no mainhand or second weapon set. Says a lot about the strength of the class that you don't even need stealth attacks or even auto attacks.

 

I don't think anyone (well most people) wants thief to be unplayable, but it would be good if they were fun to fight and balanced. I.e. not having to fight near a tower or sentry/not having to use an item to reveal/using reveal skills (if they are even available to the class, rip ele). I am also aware that other classes have access to stealth - engi can be a problem with grenades etc, but really the main culprit is thief due to the easy access.

 

I also think the reveal from sentries and towers etc is really bad design and should never have been introduced. 

 

I'm not sure blight is the answer, but a full stealth rework would be much healthier for the game - as long as this also involved reworking and balancing classes like thief that rely heavily on stealth. 

Why do want reveal on ele when you can just full AoE fire around you while also spamming infinite sustain and barrier? Thief has none of that, just mobility and stealth. And stealth is partially useless around towers with watcher tactics and target painters.

Fortunately, the thing is about how OP characters are, not easy. That's why I find fun that Elementalist players come here to complain about thieves. 

By the way, I would like to see those videos, but I really doubt is going to be worth as I already expect below Bronze rank and bad players, that's the only explanation of being able to win with only Dagger #4 and #5.

[Exzen.2976]

4 hours ago, Twilight Tempest.7584 said:

 

Link?

https://youtu.be/kG4Dv7rjvvE

[Exzen.2976]

1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Why do want reveal on ele when you can just full AoE fire around you while also spamming infinite sustain and barrier? Thief has none of that, just mobility and stealth. And stealth is partially useless around towers with watcher tactics and target painters.

Fortunately, the thing is about how OP characters are, not easy. That's why I find fun that Elementalist players come here to complain about thieves. 

By the way, I would like to see those videos, but I really doubt is going to be worth as I already expect below Bronze rank and bad players, that's the only explanation of being able to win with only Dagger #4 and #5.

Wow, is this even a serious question?? Because, surprising as it may be to you, not every elementalist wants to play that one condi build. I like to play power- fresh air, so basically no barrier (apart from like 265 on dual skill use lol) and not much sustain. I also have very limited aoes, which are very much telegraphed by red circles (which are small anyway) and pretty much all other skills require a target - so RIP if something is abusing really high stealth uptime. So in order to make power ele viable for roaming, it would be nice to have a reveal.

 

I also agreed above that sentries and towers was a bad thing to introduce and think it should be removed alongside a stealth balance. But let's also be realistic, a good thief that relies on stealth will just not fight near a sentry or a tower if they don't feel they can win the fight.

 

See link above. I love how people like to assume everyone is crap if they die to it "must be bronze or below" or "stupidity". Lol. Some were probably bad, sure. But not all of them. 

Edited September 8, 2021 by Exzen.2976

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

1 hour ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Why do want reveal on ele when you can just full AoE fire around you while also spamming infinite sustain and barrier? Thief has none of that, just mobility and stealth. And stealth is partially useless around towers with watcher tactics and target painters.

Fortunately, the thing is about how OP characters are, not easy. That's why I find fun that Elementalist players come here to complain about thieves. 

By the way, I would like to see those videos, but I really doubt is going to be worth as I already expect below Bronze rank and bad players, that's the only explanation of being able to win with only Dagger #4 and #5.

I assume that you must be new to the game then, since Teef eats alive any Ele as breakfast if it comes down to the same skill level for both players.
If teef have few braincells he'll wait out AoE fire around Eles, for it to actually hurt anyone you must pin them down and let it tick, which you seem to not know such basic thing. Same goes for all other AoE Ele posses, it's not constant and I've also seen teef being able to sneak in and out between Lava Font ticks, so yea, pretty useless argument. I think you mistook Eles with Engi with that infinite sustain and barrier there. We do have sustain, but most of the time it's just "enough".
Another thing, teef have access to teleports, dazes, blind, stealth, poison and mobility, let's not forget that damage isn't something you can ignore.
The purpose of Marked from Towers/Sentries/Traps have completely different from some petty "Teef Repelant", it simply happened to be byproduct of it.

[Mik.3401]

That’s stupid, what blight has to do with stealth? If anything they should just extend the revealed time and/or give reveal skills to other classes. I know they aim for all classes have as dull and single purpose utilities as possible by nerfing them all time, but maybe that would be a good idea

Edited September 8, 2021 by Mik.3401

[Telgum.6071]

2 hours ago, Exzen.2976 said:

Wow, is this even a serious question?? Because, surprising as it may be to you, not every elementalist wants to play that one condi build. I like to play power- fresh air, so basically no barrier (apart from like 265 on dual skill use lol) and not much sustain. I also have very limited aoes, which are very much telegraphed by red circles (which are small anyway) and pretty much all other skills require a target - so RIP if something is abusing really high stealth uptime. So in order to make power ele viable for roaming, it would be nice to have a reveal.

 

Aaaand the same goes for thieves who are not in need to use the tactics that you are talking about, including permanent or recurrent stealth. Are we talking about overpowered classes or personal preferences and experiences? Because I can't recall the last time I saw a power roaming elementalist like the one you are talking about, while I see trailblazer/celestial abusers every day.

1 hour ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

I assume that you must be new to the game then, since Teef eats alive any Ele as breakfast if it comes down to the same skill level for both players.
If teef have few braincells he'll wait out AoE fire around Eles, for it to actually hurt anyone you must pin them down and let it tick, which you seem to not know such basic thing. Same goes for all other AoE Ele posses, it's not constant and I've also seen teef being able to sneak in and out between Lava Font ticks, so yea, pretty useless argument. I think you mistook Eles with Engi with that infinite sustain and barrier there. We do have sustain, but most of the time it's just "enough".
Another thing, teef have access to teleports, dazes, blind, stealth, poison and mobility, let's not forget that damage isn't something you can ignore.
The purpose of Marked from Towers/Sentries/Traps have completely different from some petty "Teef Repelant", it simply happened to be byproduct of it.

Poor elementalist, the AoE fires will dissapear. Is not like there is a full set of defensive and healing skills to back it up while the (short) CDs of the fire element finish. Is not like you can negate the shortbow and pistol pressure by choosing projectile block OR projectile reflection, whatever you prefer. Is not like you can rely on knockbacks, knockdowns, blocks and barriers when he jumps on you. You know, all those things that thief lacks and have like thrice impact in WvW apart from one specific time that a thief player wrecked you. 

Yeah, thief has damage just like any other class in this game. I've seen dozens of good oneshots from mesmers, elementalists, dragonhunters, engiiners and even revenants.

When a thief gets around a tower, a sentry ot hit by a marker, it gets marked regardless if it was made to intentionally counter it or not. I don't see the point of saying that "bruh it wasn't made with that purpuse". You weren't supposed to exploit build swapping either and guess what, people abused that for years.

Edited September 8, 2021 by Telgum.6071

[TrollingDemigod.3041]

16 minutes ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Aaaand the same goes for thieves who are not in need to use the tactics that you are talking about, including permanent or recurrent stealth. Are we talking about overpowered classes or personal preferences and experiences? Because I can't recall the last time I saw a power roaming elementalist like the one you are talking about, while I see trailblazer/celestial abusers every day.

Poor elementalist, the AoE fires will dissapear. Is not like there is a full set of defensive and healing skills to back it up while the (short) CDs of the fire element finish. Is not like you can negate the shortbow and pistol pressure by choosing projectile block OR projectile reflection, whatever you prefer. Is not like you can rely on knockbacks, knockdowns, blocks and barriers when he jumps on you. You know, all those things that thief lacks and have like thrice impact in WvW apart from one specific time that a thief player wrecked you. 

Yeah, thief has damage just like any other class in this game. I've seen dozens of good oneshots from mesmers, elementalists, dragonhunters, engiiners and even revenants.

When a thief gets around a tower, a sentry ot hit by a marker, it gets marked regardless if it was made to intentionally counter it or not. I don't see the point of saying that "bruh it wasn't made with that purpuse". You weren't supposed to exploit build swapping either and guess what, people abused that for years.

😄
The lack of knowledge in this one is gold.
Ele cd are one of the highest one in the entire game man, staph embarassing yourself. Yes, projectile block/reflection works great, if it wasn't for the fact that Teef have built-in unblockables in some skills or even can be used in a way that'll not interact with Eles reflects and still deal damage to them. No, I can't rely on CCs since they require to hit enemy or one that can be targetted, so stealth already says no to few skills in Ele kit from get-go, let's not forget some of them are short range which also means that lag or desync will also decrease their usability by a lot. Arcane Shield is pepe though and can be bypassed by a teef easily, the one from traits is on 300s cd. Barriers are the only thing that make that build barely usable, the heals from comboing skills won't be enough because of 4s cd on attument swap. The problem with teefs damage is that it is often if not always combined with high mobility, evasion, stealth or teleports.
Weird, last time I've passed close to the tower with Watchtower I was marked as well, so either it is supposed to show all enemies or just be a counter to stealth, if it's the latter then A-net need to fix it since I don't use classes with stealth, must be a bug.
A-net also said that E-speces were supposed to provide new play styles that weren't supposed to be straight upgrades to core classes, yet here we are with powercreep circus. Your point?

[Exzen.2976]

37 minutes ago, Telgum.6071 said:

Aaaand the same goes for thieves who are not in need to use the tactics that you are talking about, including permanent or recurrent stealth. Are we talking about overpowered classes or personal preferences and experiences? Because I can't recall the last time I saw a power roaming elementalist like the one you are talking about, while I see trailblazer/celestial abusers every day.

Poor elementalist, the AoE fires will dissapear. Is not like there is a full set of defensive and healing skills to back it up while the (short) CDs of the fire element finish. Is not like you can negate the shortbow and pistol pressure by choosing projectile block OR projectile reflection, whatever you prefer. Is not like you can rely on knockbacks, knockdowns, blocks and barriers when he jumps on you. You know, all those things that thief lacks and have like thrice impact in WvW apart from one specific time that a thief player wrecked you. 

Yeah, thief has damage just like any other class in this game. I've seen dozens of good oneshots from mesmers, elementalists, dragonhunters, engiiners and even revenants.

When a thief gets around a tower, a sentry ot hit by a marker, it gets marked regardless if it was made to intentionally counter it or not. I don't see the point of saying that "bruh it wasn't made with that purpuse". You weren't supposed to exploit build swapping either and guess what, people abused that for years.

You are literally commenting on a thread about permastealth thieves, bringing other builds into it is completely irrelevant... 

 

Also your comments about ele really show your complete lack of knowledge of the class and different builds. And why do you think you don't see any power eles?! Could it perhaps be because of the fact they are hardcountered so much by stealth abusers that it makes roaming extremely difficult? Facepalm moment. You are literally just backing up the argument for ele needing a reveal and also for SA thieves being op.

[Telgum.6071]

37 minutes ago, Exzen.2976 said:

You are literally commenting on a thread about permastealth thieves, bringing other builds into it is completely irrelevant... 

 

Also your comments about ele really show your complete lack of knowledge of the class and different builds. And why do you think you don't see any power eles?! Could it perhaps be because of the fact they are hardcountered so much by stealth abusers that it makes roaming extremely difficult? Facepalm moment. You are literally just backing up the argument for ele needing a reveal and also for SA thieves being op.

I literally called out an elementalist player and you and your boyfriend jumped on me to say "no ele is completely fine!" so here we are arguing about that 😄

Yeah of course, elementalist players don't play power builds because they are scared of thieves. They all turned out into trailblazer and celestial abusers because thieves. Tell me more.

44 minutes ago, TrollingDemigod.3041 said:

The problem with teefs damage is that it is often if not always combined with high mobility, evasion, stealth or teleports.

The problem with elementalist damage if that it is often if not always combined with high condi pressure, evasion through defensive boons and skills spam, CC and burning burst.

Kinda funny mentioning the """long""" elementalist CD who can just swap elements.

kitten, so according to the people to come to complain about classes being overpowered, the same ones who made Thief and Warrior balance a meme due to constant complains accross the years while also refusing to address Elementalist and Guardian are saying that I embarass myself. That's it, is the average forum user and their "you know nothing, I do!"