Delete Shadow Arts.

[Exile.8160]

As tittle says.

[Zizekent.2398]

Most of thieves are so used to that traitline that they don't know what to do outside of SA 👀

[Sahne.6950]

 

10 minutes ago, Zizekent.2398 said:

Most of thieves are so used to that traitline that they don't know what to do outside of SA 👀

kitten? 😛   whaat? why does it turn DeadArts into kitten?!!?   if you only type the short for of deadlyarts same as you do with SA it will turn it into kitten 😄

Edited January 28, 2022 by Sahne.6950

[Genesis.5169]

14 hours ago, Exile.8160 said:

As tittle says.

What thief killed you at home?

Tell me so i tell him not to kill you anymore so people like you can some coming to the forums to try to ruin classes, like you guys ruined mesmers.

[Terrorhuz.4695]

Sooner or later people realize thief is totally kittening broken even without SA. The permastealth is still there, the permablind is still there, the permadodge is still there.
We could all realize, right now, that 3 dodges are busted and need to go, but we would still be 7 years too late.

[Azure The Heartless.3261]

6 hours ago, Zizekent.2398 said:

Most of thieves are so used to that traitline that they don't know what to do outside of SA 👀

> slot Deadly Arts , replace smoke screen with Assassin Signet.

> literally nothing changes except now we only drop on you for deaths instead of memes and don't hang around points where you aren't. 

> +frustration for both parties in the interaction.

Edited January 28, 2022 by Azure The Heartless.3261
lel executioner

[Bazsi.2734]

Nice constructive thread. Do your taxes!

[Keitaro Dragonheart.9047]

Show us on the doll where the thief hurt you.

[Keitaro Dragonheart.9047]

If we're going to delete traitlines willy nilly, then lets also delete Zeal from Guardian, or Soul Reaping from Necromancer. Maybe we can axe Retriubtion from Revenant or Fire Magic from Elementalist while we're at it.

"Nerf everything I don't like"~Forum Community since 2012

[Rodzynald.5897]

12 hours ago, Keitaro Dragonheart.9047 said:

If we're going to delete traitlines willy nilly, then lets also delete Zeal from Guardian, or Soul Reaping from Necromancer. Maybe we can axe Retriubtion from Revenant or Fire Magic from Elementalist while we're at it.

"Nerf everything I don't like"~Forum Community since 2012

I mean... yeah. We could use a lot of de-powercreep. 

Jokes aside, the issue with thief happened the moment GW2 first got released. The core idea of short mobility and invisibility cooldowns - the ease of application and no drawbacks. Isn't GW2 the only game with no drawbacks to invisibility? You can literally stroll through a WvW zerg without being noticed, even if something hits you it doesn't break stealth nor does it affect your mobility. 

 

And not only thief is guilty of this busted mechanic.

Edited January 29, 2022 by Rodzynald.5897

[Khalisto.5780]

this traitline doesn't affect stealth from blasts so i dunno, not might get what you want

 

[Sylvia.4870]

On 1/28/2022 at 8:01 AM, Exile.8160 said:

As tittle says.

      lol It has been years since the first year of the Specialization System. Later, It was already reworked and nerfed. Now, you ask for its disappearance? Jeez.

 

Edited January 30, 2022 by Sylvia.4870

[Sylvia.4870]

On 1/29/2022 at 6:06 AM, Keitaro Dragonheart.9047 said:

If we're going to delete traitlines willy nilly, then lets also delete Zeal from Guardian, or Soul Reaping from Necromancer. Maybe we can axe Retriubtion from Revenant or Fire Magic from Elementalist while we're at it.

"Nerf everything I don't like"~Forum Community since 2012

  Nerf everything I don't like? I don't know. It looks like a childish idea from a person who has hatred toward something but has no idea what consequeneces will come after an action is done.

[Crab Fear.1624]

On 1/28/2022 at 10:32 AM, Terrorhuz.4695 said:

Sooner or later people realize thief is totally kittening broken even without SA. The permastealth is still there, the permablind is still there, the permadodge is still there.
We could all realize, right now, that 3 dodges are busted and need to go, but we would still be 7 years too late.

Shroud is and always has been the most busted mechanic in game, and it's given to a class with the highest health.

Guess the game is full of busted things.

[Exile.8160]

8 hours ago, Sylvia.4870 said:

  Nerf everything I don't like? I don't know. It looks like a childish idea from a person who has hatred toward something but has no idea what consequeneces will come after an action is done.

I guess ROM, helseth amd Teapot are childish too then hahaha

[Ashgar.3024]

Just put a giant exclamation mark over every players head in the area whenever a Thief stealths just like when they babified Rengar's ult in LoL.

 

Can even play the Metal Gear Solid sound effect as well just to make sure the Necro/Guard players hands are properly held.

 

https://youtu.be/8yGfQak-q9M

Edited January 30, 2022 by Ashgar.3024

[agrippastrilemma.8741]

People are misdiagnosing Shadow Arts a bit. Sure, it is annoying, but Daredevil - particularly Daredevil dash - is what makes thief super strong. Ask yourself why Shadow Arts thief wasn't considered overpowered back in core. Stealth on Steal has been a thing since launch.

Edited January 30, 2022 by agrippastrilemma.8741

[Crab Fear.1624]

12 minutes ago, agrippastrilemma.8741 said:

People are misdiagnosing Shadow Arts a bit. Sure, it is annoying, but Daredevil - particularly Daredevil dash - is what makes thief super strong. Ask yourself why Shadow Arts thief wasn't considered overpowered back in core. Stealth on Steal has been a thing since launch.

 

Nah it's not dash lol.

Look in the first series for traits, the minors.

[agrippastrilemma.8741]

11 minutes ago, Crab Fear.1624 said:

 

Nah it's not dash lol.

Look in the first series for traits, the minors.

It definitely is. It's not just the mobility, it's also the immob removal. The counter to a high mobility class is supposed to be immobilize, that's literally the whole point of the condition.

Edited January 30, 2022 by agrippastrilemma.8741

[CutesySylveon.8290]

33 minutes ago, agrippastrilemma.8741 said:

People are misdiagnosing Shadow Arts a bit. Sure, it is annoying, but Daredevil - particularly Daredevil dash - is what makes thief super strong. Ask yourself why Shadow Arts thief wasn't considered overpowered back in core. Stealth on Steal has been a thing since launch.

SA wasn't always how it is now, and Thief also died the moment they made a mistake because damage was much higher. The skill floor for the class has dropped significantly with the lower damage by itself. 

[Svarty.8019]

On 1/28/2022 at 1:01 AM, Exile.8160 said:

Delete Shadow Arts.

Seconded. 

Unlock.

 

[Curennos.9307]

23 minutes ago, agrippastrilemma.8741 said:

People are misdiagnosing Shadow Arts a bit. Sure, it is annoying, but Daredevil - particularly Daredevil dash - is what makes thief super strong. Ask yourself why Shadow Arts thief wasn't considered overpowered back in core. Stealth on Steal has been a thing since launch.

 

Just now, agrippastrilemma.8741 said:

It definitely is. It's not just the mobility, it's also the immob removal. The counter to a high mobility class is literally to immobilize, that's supposed to be the whole point of the condition.

It was OP before, but now it completely negates endurance regen for 2, 3, and 4 sec respectively for cripple, chill, and immob. It's not too hard to find some source of movement impairment then force the thief to dodge. Personally, I would much rather they remove the movement impairment cleanse feature - I find the -100% end regen hurts more than anything else when I need to dodge something but I really don't want to bother cleansing some cripple or chill that's going to be gone soon anyway. I've also found players treat immobed thieves the same way they would treat other classes, and are somehow surprised when the thief dodges anyway. The game is no longer to prevent the enemy from dodging, but you're fighting against their endurance bar - not denying them its use. 

 

Also, a side note - the point of immob is to deny a dodge. This applies to EVERY class. They cannot use their base dodge while immobed, with the exception of...y'know, mirage. And thief with its trait. Thieves can still use other evades while immobed. And up until DrD, thieves had two dodges just like everyone else, though they may have regenerated them faster due to vigor, traits, acro, etc, while the rest of their mitigation was stored in weapon skill evades, steal, stealth. By all accounts immob never prevented thief from using its mobility, so what you're saying falls apart. I can still steal, shortbow 5, shadow shot, any port I please plus any weapon-based evades. This is also consistent across other classes, who can still port and use weapon/utility evades.

 

That isn't to say anet should never revisit any of these things or re-examine the function of immobilization - rather, that you're just wrong about 'the whole point of the condition'. The GM dodge trait just gives thief more flexibility in resources - it could cleanse the immob then dodge, or use a weapon skill, etc. It just also happens to have the option of dodging anyway and taking an extra big hit to its dodge resource. Further, the 'counter' to high mobility has been in the drawbacks built into the class, such as thief's innate lack of defensive boons, health, healing, and other damage reductions that don't help when evading something but do help when actually hit. Anet has been steadily adding more options to those areas, though, which has been nice

TLDR you're mistaking the counter to DODGE as a counter to high mobility overall, and it's very much not at the moment. Though I think it'd be hilarious if immob also prevented ports. It would suck, but also be very funny.

[FarmBotXD.1430]

most people dont realize how busted dash on DD is.
1 dodge from thief and every single melee class has to use a gap closer or the interaction is over, any mobility used is followed with another dash and again, interaction is over. THIS is why thief is impossible to hit with anything.
you are either 
1 ranged, they teleport on top of you and stand in your model, you cant hit them with anything, or 
2 you are melee, and after every single dash ( they have at least 3, along with steal giving endurance, vigor and energy sigil ) you have to expand a mobility skill, meaning no class in the game can actually pressure them.
And this kitten is coupled with vomit of blinds and stealth.

[agrippastrilemma.8741]

3 hours ago, Curennos.9307 said:

 

It was OP before, but now it completely negates endurance regen for 2, 3, and 4 sec respectively for cripple, chill, and immob. It's not too hard to find some source of movement impairment then force the thief to dodge. Personally, I would much rather they remove the movement impairment cleanse feature - I find the -100% end regen hurts more than anything else when I need to dodge something but I really don't want to bother cleansing some cripple or chill that's going to be gone soon anyway. I've also found players treat immobed thieves the same way they would treat other classes, and are somehow surprised when the thief dodges anyway. The game is no longer to prevent the enemy from dodging, but you're fighting against their endurance bar - not denying them its use. 

 

Also, a side note - the point of immob is to deny a dodge. This applies to EVERY class. They cannot use their base dodge while immobed, with the exception of...y'know, mirage. And thief with its trait. Thieves can still use other evades while immobed. And up until DrD, thieves had two dodges just like everyone else, though they may have regenerated them faster due to vigor, traits, acro, etc, while the rest of their mitigation was stored in weapon skill evades, steal, stealth. By all accounts immob never prevented thief from using its mobility, so what you're saying falls apart. I can still steal, shortbow 5, shadow shot, any port I please plus any weapon-based evades. This is also consistent across other classes, who can still port and use weapon/utility evades.

 

That isn't to say anet should never revisit any of these things or re-examine the function of immobilization - rather, that you're just wrong about 'the whole point of the condition'. The GM dodge trait just gives thief more flexibility in resources - it could cleanse the immob then dodge, or use a weapon skill, etc. It just also happens to have the option of dodging anyway and taking an extra big hit to its dodge resource. Further, the 'counter' to high mobility has been in the drawbacks built into the class, such as thief's innate lack of defensive boons, health, healing, and other damage reductions that don't help when evading something but do help when actually hit. Anet has been steadily adding more options to those areas, though, which has been nice

TLDR you're mistaking the counter to DODGE as a counter to high mobility overall, and it's very much not at the moment. Though I think it'd be hilarious if immob also prevented ports. It would suck, but also be very funny.

"TLDR you're mistaking the counter to DODGE as a counter to high mobility overall"

Lmao then it's even worse considering they can still dodge during it. And yes, Mirage shouldn't be able to dodge in immob either. And they should remove exhaustion (which was added as a bandaid when they should have just removed the immob cleansing).

Edited January 30, 2022 by agrippastrilemma.8741

[Crab Fear.1624]

20 minutes ago, agrippastrilemma.8741 said:

"TLDR you're mistaking the counter to DODGE as a counter to high mobility overall"

Lmao then it's even worse considering they can still dodge during it. And yes, Mirage shouldn't be able to dodge in immob either. And they should remove exhaustion (which was added as a bandaid when they should have just removed the immob cleansing).

I mean make sure we go after things like 

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Aggressive_Agility

 

And 

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Warrior's_Sprint

 

There are more, and aren't those just majors?

 

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Crystal_Configuration:_Zephyr

Edited January 30, 2022 by Crab Fear.1624