Anet, The longer you stall the adjustments to DE meta the worse it will get

[Labjax.2465]

12 minutes ago, Izzy.2951 said:

 

The think is what is a crisis? for you guys a crisis is literally anything thats the problem. EoD has been out 1 week, they have updated the meta 2 times already, and they have stated they are tracking down how many ppl are getting turtle to make further changes. What do you want? its just nonsense.

I consider it a crisis when their forums are continuously blowing up since expansion release with players from different playstyles coming out to say their design is crap and that they are going to avoid it like the plague, if not play other games. I consider it deer in headlights when they essentially say "we hear you and are monitoring the situation for tweaks, but we have no intention of backing down on this fundamentally" and then go AFK.

They have the hard numbers, which is something I don't, but if the self reporting is any indication, this meta is actively hurting the game's reputation, the expansion's reputation, and retention of current players. If that's not a crisis, then what in Grenth's name qualifies as a crisis for a video game studio.

Edited March 9, 2022 by Labjax.2465

[Ruisen.9471]

Guys, its only been a week since the expansion released.   it takes time to fix bugs, then time after it goes live to track if people are still struggling with the meta after fixes/adjustments, before going back for more adjustments.      

They've made posts and multiple adjustments about the meta, saying that there's absolute silence is not being very candid.   People complained that the boss was going back and fourth too much, and the latest patches seems to have patched that (whether its completely fixed remains to be seen, but they are trying to patch it).

Edited March 9, 2022 by Ruisen.9471

[Pretty Pixie.8603]

5 hours ago, Izzy.2951 said:

Belive me after you get your mount, you will see its kinda useless or boring, and leave to play somethingelse. So making it that you dont get it instatly is good.

 

Could you please point me to the promotional material saying that the turtle is useless or boring? I missed it. I remember it being hyped up as a major feature, including a beta that gave instant access to it, and an interview in PC Gamer stating that it would be on par with getting the roller beetle.

[NumNums.7935]

10 hours ago, yoni.7015 said:

I am pretty sure they are not ignoring it and working on it. But you should give them time to do it properly. This whole meta debate really brings out the ugliness of some parts of the community. It’s funny how casuals always say that the raiding community would be so toxic and rude but reading all this from self proclaimed casuals … 

I enjoy raiding but that only requires 10 man organization, not 50+ people so I think it takes away from the argument. The closest thing to this is other large scale metas or WvW zerging. Which even WvW allows play for smaller squads, or even solo.

 

I'm not for nerfing any mechanics, I do think the hard enrage timer is a little to tight.

 

I actually think it would be cool if they implemented this large scale difficult content into instances, that could be joined by private squads. Like could u imagine this map instanced for a squad with 1 and done on (no respon at waypoint similar to strikes and raids), it would force the mindset of reviving down players. 50 man raid content 🙂

[Caitybee.3614]

22 minutes ago, Izzy.2951 said:

 

The think is what is a crisis? for you guys a crisis is literally anything thats the problem. EoD has been out 1 week, they have updated the meta 2 times already, and they have stated they are tracking down how many ppl are getting turtle to make further changes. What do you want? its just nonsense.

Correction; all they did so far was force us to complete the green/wisp phase so we couldn't skim it for extra time, and they fixed a "bug" that made Soo-Won use her bite attack too often. They didn't change anything.

[Zephire.8049]

  

25 minutes ago, Labjax.2465 said:

I consider it a crisis when their forums are continuously blowing up since expansion release with players from different playstyles coming out to say their design is crap and that they are going to avoid it like the plague, if not play other games.

Exactly. People who post on a forum care enough about a game to go to a place outside the game and write their thoughts/experiences because they're invested enough to try to get the developer to address something. And when content creators are saying they're taking a break from something because it's poorly designed, that's another red flag that something's going on as, once again, it's coming from people who are invested in the game and who may even make money off the game thus want it to do well.

[Zephire.8049]

32 minutes ago, Ruisen.9471 said:

Guys, its only been a week since the expansion released.   it takes time to fix bugs, then time after it goes live to track if people are still struggling with the meta after fixes/adjustments, before going back for more adjustments.      

Yes it takes time to change encounters but it does not take 4+ days to write a post saying devs are working on changes that are expected to be out by X date. Or even just to say they're tracking what's going on and ask people on both sides to chill while they figure things out.

Anet's silence since Friday is the biggest issue at this point, in my opinion, and is only exacerbating the situation, and that doesn't require dev time to bug fix.

[Drarnor Kunoram.5180]

47 minutes ago, Caitybee.3614 said:

Correction; all they did so far was force us to complete the green/wisp phase so we couldn't skim it for extra time, and they fixed a "bug" that made Soo-Won use her bite attack too often. They didn't change anything.

They also reduced the max time of the green/wisp phase to, in a worst-case scenario, give us an additional minute and a half of actually being able to hit the boss.  That is a very significant change, given how tight the timer is.

Edited March 9, 2022 by Drarnor Kunoram.5180

[Friday.7864]

I mean, they did so much work on the expansion. The hype was real.
Then they go ahead and ruin everything by frustrating a huge part of the playerbase. 

Do they expect people to just throw money at them after doing that?
I already skipped out on the supply drop and home instance contracts - and I don't plan on getting anything non essential after this fiasco. It's not just the meta failures that got to me, I'm fed up with people arguing in guild and basically everywhere else...

[Erise.5614]

9 hours ago, Cyninja.2954 said:

GW2efficiency stats for Dragon Pacifier (achievement granted upon successfully completing the final meta the first time): 13,352 of 354,896 (3.762%) completed.

 

Up by around 500 since checking 4 hours ago (12,779 back then, 3.6%).

 

So in the last 2 meta cycles, around 10 maps finished successfully (if we assume around 50 players per map meta). More in fact if we assume that some are repeat players which will NOT unlock the achievement again given it is already unlocked.

 

Seems players are successful in completing the meta after all.

These statistics are so much worse than you imagine.

First of all. 350k is about a third of daily players before the expansion. Assuming all 350k play every single day, that's already a minority. They use a third party tool on a website they first need to know about, then sign up, then generate an API key and only then will they be listed. So it's skewed towards more hardcore players.

But much worse than that. In the last 9 hours, the number didn't change at all. And it won't in the next 10 hours. Because gw2efficiency updates most accounts once per day. You saw how many people finished it in an entire day. There is more streamed runs by hardcore guilds than that. 

As mentioned above. gw2efficiency doesn't portray the general player base. So I'm sure there is a few regular runs that succeed too. But really, what it shows us is not how it's completed regularly but just how insanely often it fails. I sometimes see 10 runs in lfg at a time. Going by these statistics. Most likely, all of them fail. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Erise.5614

[Izzy.2951]

3 minutes ago, Erise.5614 said:

These statistics are so much worse than you imagine.

First of all. 350k is about a third of daily players before the expansion. Assuming all 350k play every single day, that's already a minority. They use a third party tool on a website they first need to know about, then sign up, then generate an API key and only then will they be listed. So it's skewed towards more hardcore players.

But much worse than that. In the last 9 hours, the number didn't change at all. And it won't in the next 10 hours. Because gw2efficiency updates most accounts once per day. You saw how many people finished it in an entire day. There is more streamed runs by hardcore guilds than that. 

As mentioned above. gw2efficiency doesn't portray the general player base. So I'm sure there is a few regular runs that succeed too. But really, what it shows us is not how it's completed regularly but just how insanely often it fails. I sometimes see 10 runs in lfg at a time. Going by these statistics. Most likely, all of them fail. 

Yes and how do u know 350k players are 1/3 of the daily players? so you assume theres 1million daily players? maybe but literally no source.

Edited March 9, 2022 by Izzy.2951

[Erise.5614]

41 minutes ago, Izzy.2951 said:

Yes and how do u know 350k players are 1/3 of the daily players? so you assume theres 1million daily players? maybe but literally no source.

First of all, thanks for ignoring the point and just attacking the entire thing in the most lazy way. 

And secondly:

https://playercounter.com/guild-wars-2/

https://activeplayer.io/guild-wars-2/

Obviously it's all approximations. But GW2 has (and had estimated) 200k-250k at most times of day. At peak time the concurrent player count approaches 600k-800k alone, taking the more conservative estimates. It's approximations, sure. But knowing the real numbers behind a different game tracked by these tools, these counts are off by single to low double digit percent. Not an order of magnitude. 

It's fairly safe to assume GW2 has quite a bit over 1 million DAU. 

But even that isn't the point. It's that gw2efficiency represents a smaller subset of players. Even one third is generous. Active players on gw2efficiency probably make up 10% or less of active players in general. Enough to get a rough idea but enough and not diverse enough to qualify as representative. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Erise.5614

[LucianDK.8615]

Nothing but a storm in a glass of water. What happened to patience? The world is not ending because you arent succeeding just yet. Sure -you- may know the mechanics, but others does not and needs coaching.  Dragons stand took a while for people to learn it too.

 

Its just impatience for a semiuseless mount that is driving this.

[Doghouse.1562]

15 hours ago, MechanicalMind.9126 said:

 

And by then it will be too late. I dont think they understand how many casuals vs raiders they actually have.. and how many of those casuals just simply come on for the little time they do have, do some open world stuff, pay some money to get cool stuff on the shop.. then come back next time they can play. 

 

Honestly as many have said, its a simple fix. Move the flipping turtle to something else much easier and give the meta more rewards for those wanting to do that kind of thing. Im not even asking for it to get nerfed. Just want a turtle and ill never freaking touch whatever gives a turtle again.

Yes - but no. As Anet have acknowledged, this isn't just some random raid, this is the climax of the entire 10-year campaign to date. Sure, make it feel epic - but after nearly 10 years of playing, anyone and everyone who has played through the content and story, and made their way successfully to DE, deserves the right to a chance at success, however casual a player they may be or however limited their time. If some  people want it to need raid-level gear, builds, skill, organisation and so on, I'm fine with that - but make it an actual raid, and give the rest of us an open world equivalent. Otherwise, it's manifestly unfair to a significant portion of the player base (and like first-version Zhaitan, and Mordremoth and Kralkatorrik before it, this is going to be yet another piece of end-of-story content that half the player base simply gives up on and walks away from - and, in some cases, away from the game entirely).

Edited March 9, 2022 by Doghouse.1562

[Ashantara.8731]

16 hours ago, InvaGir.9158 said:

Currently the people who are doing this are getting burned and more frustrated.

While I agree that the RNG aspect of it can be annoying, it is still doable with enough time left if you play with people who know their stuff.

We finished yesterday with approximately 3 minutes left on the timer while having quite a few annoying side-switches and whirlpools. It was a well organized run with an experienced Commander, and everyone filled the roles required, i.e. raid-structured 5-player subgroups, which currently is the only viable option to make it - no idea if this is exactly what ANet had in mind for this encounter, but it sure looks that way.

Edited March 9, 2022 by Ashantara.8731

[difens.1326]

19 minutes ago, Ashantara.8731 said:

While I agree that the RNG aspect of it can be annoying, it is still doable with enough time left if you play with people who know their stuff.

We finished yesterday with approximately 3 minutes left on the timer while having quite a few annoying side-switches and whirlpools. It was a well organized run with an experienced Commander, and everyone filled the roles required, i.e. raid-structured 5-player subgroups, which currently is the only viable option to make it - no idea if this is exactly what ANet had in mind for this encounter, but it sure looks that way.

So it's still RNG - this time affecting group composition

[JPUlisses.8756]

Raiders: Ask for harder content
Anet: Gives harder content

Raiders: too hard pls stop

On serious note, it is not even that difficult content, as always the hardest part is just getting a group and as all team games it is frustrating when you do everything right and your team does not. Either make all content soloable, or leave as it is.

Edited March 9, 2022 by JPUlisses.8756

[Obtena.7952]

7 hours ago, Izzy.2951 said:

And whats the fun of doing an event or random thing clicking 1 that you cant fail, and getting a useless mount?

It's not fun ... but that's an absurd thing to ask me and an absurd point to make since NO ONE is asking for that. That's terrible deflection from the REASONABLE scope of the discussion here and I'm calling you out for it. My point still stands. NO ONE was asking for anything to be free, despite your claim otherwise. The complaint about turtle mount behind DE is NOT based on people wanting things 'for free' or 'clicking 1'. Don't be absurd. 

Edited March 9, 2022 by Obtena.7952

[JPUlisses.8756]

If they nerf it, they should give an achivement/mount for everyone who did it before the nerf.

[Eldrake.1543]

It's not even a difficult meta. The mechanics are super simple and you just need DPS.

Success is just all about luck, based on the RNG and the likelihood that the other 49 players can't do the DPS part correctly.

Edited March 9, 2022 by Eldrake.1543

[Zok.4956]

8 hours ago, InvaGir.9158 said:

I don't know if people who beat it are serious or just trolling

Nothing to be proud of that your instance got the lucky one with Soo-Won being less of a dipshit

Pathetic that some of you feel superior for being lucky and think you have the right to lash out on other people

I have had several failed attempts with organized, experienced groups that had good dps, cc and did the mechanics well. After I was in a map were we finally beat Soon-Won it did not felt like an achievement, it felt like I just won the "RNG lottery".

Later I did a PUG run in the new strike mission for the turtle and we failed a lot. The group was unexperienced and needed to learn the fight. And there were probably several that were not "raid ready" from how they played. But we stayed together and tried it again and again and we had progress. Each try we wiped (a little bit) later in the fight until we succeeded. That felt good and like an achievement.

[Shadows Creed.3902]

Just my opinion but feels pretty clear at this point this meta is a fail of sorts. 

 

When was the last time we had this many threads posts about a meta, serpents ire?  And that is barely done now.

 

Why not stop overall timer during green phase, would add tike to overall meta and prob make most groups clear. Make it how teq works.

 

Also and unpopular view maybe but meta isn't that interesting...certainly not the 10 year build up anet claimed it to be.   Kaineng was a most interesting meta that required multiple groups and moving around more.

[Peterson.5172]

1 hour ago, JPUlisses.8756 said:

If they nerf it, they should give an achivement/mount for everyone who did it before the nerf.

seeing as half the arguments for not nerfing is "the meta isn't hard", why do you need a special achieve to show you've done a "not hard" meta? (i've done the meta already btw, and this sounds like gatekeeping...)

[Ruisen.9471]

8 hours ago, Zephire.8049 said:

Yes it takes time to change encounters but it does not take 4+ days to write a post saying devs are working on changes that are expected to be out by X date. Or even just to say they're tracking what's going on and ask people on both sides to chill while they figure things out.

Anet's silence since Friday is the biggest issue at this point, in my opinion, and is only exacerbating the situation, and that doesn't require dev time to bug fix.

Its not like it was Friday like 4 weeks ago or something.   It was literally just last friday that Rubi posted their proposed solutions, that's 2 working days before you made this post.  

If 2 Days is a deafening silence I don't think anything they could have done would have satisfied you.

People are reporting on reddit that the latest patch seems to have fixed the boss jumping back and fourth repeatedly, so hopefully that should finally put an end to the RNG.   

Edited March 9, 2022 by Ruisen.9471

[NumNums.7935]

4 hours ago, LucianDK.8615 said:

Its just impatience for a semiuseless mount that is driving this.

The mount brings me happiness, so yeah not useless to me. Its fun to run around in a flying turtle with a friend in the back annoying monsters. Sometimes  fun is greater than optimal or even viable.