What GW2 really lacks to me (in comparison to WoW)

[michixlol.9340]

I know, GW2 is a totally different style of MMO. And it does a lot of things differently from WoW, some you could like, some you don't. And I also don't intend to form this game into something I like and all of you don't. But I know quite a few people that have loved this game for some time and then suddenly stopped playing. For me it was like this since 2016 too. I started, stopped. After some years I started again, loved it, but stopped. And to me it is an aspect of the game that I would call..... it's a little bit too sandbox.

 

Take this with a grain of salt, sandbox is great! Really great. In Tyria you can do pretty much everything and get something for yourself. That's super! In some way... because, I think what the problem is, especially, if you don't have other people to play with, that you don't get those.. long-term goals. It's nice to just log in, do a little bit of roaming, do a few hearts, events, listen to the very awesome world, maybe do an arena or if you've got a bit more time, do a dungeon or something... it's very nice, if you have just some time and ya.. just want to do anything. But I personally figured out for myself, after some time I just don't know what my aim is. 
 

In WoW you have goals.

1. First goal is to get to max level, in GW2, there is much less effort to do this. But I like to level, because I always have something to focus on and to do the things for I do. 
2. Then you know, when you do dungeons in WoW you get better loot and some kind of tokens to get even better loot. In GW2 you get some stuff, but.. what for? I mean, sure it's something. But do you need it in an aim for anything else? To get stronger? Not really. Mats? You can get somewhere else too. So you can have an achievement if you gather them? Hm maybe yes, that's a point. But is it enough? 
3. In WoW you want to get stronger and stronger and you feel it, you feel, some raids or dungeons or whatever just die more easily or you don't die as easily. In PvP you can feel if your armor is better. In GW2, when you have exotic armor, there isn't that much in view to get. In WoW you know, you have to go there and do this to get better armor, in PvP and as well in PvE. And you feel the new armor. At least it was like that previously. 

 

Now in GW2, where do I get these long term goals?

The living story is nice, I love story and lore! And listen to everything precisely. But the things you get for completing parts is.. meh. It's just not necessary to do it. I could literally just walk around and gather and do hearts and get .. maybe even better stuff in the same time. I didn't recognize I'd get a special skin, a mini, a mount, some stronger armor than I have.. just something to store and sell and dismantle. The story is at least a goal I can always follow. But besides this...

 

I can do anything all the time. But I can't get myself a goal. Something big. Something like becoming stronger, or to become the best or some motivation to find myself a team and guild to accomplish something, because why accomplish it? I'd really want to have something to .. do something for. The long-term goal. The aim I do everything I do for. Or to do something specific for. I just feel lost in this game. Over and over again. And I am not a twinker. I want to play my main and to develop him. To experience with him. And to work for a greater goal.

But I think this game makes it pretty difficult. 

 

 

I just needed to get this out. I really like this game. It has a lot of really special things. And the lore is awesome. But everything seems so.. worthless. 

[Einsof.1457]

It's almost as if you never opened your achievement menu. 

[Rogue.8235]

A full legendary armory may be the goal you're looking for.  It might be extreme for you, so not sure.  

You seem to like quantifiable, vertical progression, which is why I suggested legendaries.  It's the top stats, like ascended gear, with the added bonus of being able to use any stat combination.  

Personally, I prefer open-ended content where I can be spontaneous.  I can understand the desire for quantifiable goals, though.  Do you have full ascended for every character, and every build on every character?  That could be an interim goal before a full legendary armory.

I'm also assuming you have every mount unlocked.  That's a measurable goal taht is definitely felt in gameplay.

As for vertical progression in the game, the vertical progression of GW2 is actually the skill of the players, themselves.  I understand that player skill is far more abstract and harder to measure than stats, but if there's a way to quantify it for you that may help.  I know some will suggest DPS meters, but that is only a fraction of player skill. 

 

tl;dr All I can think to suggest for now is a full legendary armory.  That's all 3 legendary armor weights, full legendary trinkets, at least one of every legendary weapon, and full sets of legendary runes and legendary sigils.

 

[Debesyla.7102]

Come back after you get full legendary gear.

[michixlol.9340]

Thank you for the answers! I think legendary armor will be the way to go then. Achievements are neat, but also very chaotic in a way. The game really wants you to make your own goals. Anyways, thank you, especially Rogue.8235 for the long text!

[The Greyhawk.9107]

I feel like I've seen everything now.  GW2 is too much of a sandbox MMO? 

 

Edited December 9, 2022 by The Greyhawk.9107

[michixlol.9340]

Just now, The Greyhawk.9107 said:

I feel like I've seen everything now.  GW2 is too much of a sandbox MMO? 

 

 

The problem isn't the options, the problem is more of the reward.

[Bladestrom.6425]

'

I spent 10k hours as a raider in WOW, 3-5 nights week.

1. First goal is to get to max level, in GW2, there is much less effort to do this. But I like to level, because I always have something to focus on and to do the things for I do. 
   
   A: Everyone races through the new expansion content to get back on to the hamster wheel, get +x on your power numbers.  PVP is a car crash because of the power curve.
    
2. Then you know, when you do dungeons in WoW you get better loot and some kind of tokens to get even better loot. In GW2 you get some stuff, but.. what for? I mean, sure it's something. But do you need it in an aim for anything else? To get stronger? Not really. Mats? You can get somewhere else too. So you can have an achievement if you gather them? Hm maybe yes, that's a point. But is it enough? 
   
   A yep see point 1. Ofc in WOW now its well known for being a cesspit of behaviour, gear checking, drama all about loot and dps and how fast you can rush past the content.
    
3. In WoW you want to get stronger and stronger and you feel it, you feel, some raids or dungeons or whatever just die more easily or you don't die as easily. In PvP you can feel if your armor is better. In GW2, when you have exotic armor, there isn't that much in view to get. In WoW you know, you have to go there and do this to get better armor, in PvP and as well in PvE. And you feel the new armor. At least it was like that previously. '

        its an illusion, the gear cogs behind the hamster wheel, you don't get more powerful, you memorise the next set of boss           encounters and get +x on your gear. its a number change on a damage meter ultimately.  

its all about the +x numbers and having better meter readings than joe blog next to you, that's the end game and its as shallow as it gets, unless you are addicted to the 'I must be number 1 drug'.

 

 

 

Edited December 9, 2022 by vesica tempestas.1563

[Erich.1783]

I would say the difference between GW2 and most any other MMO I have played is that in GW2 you need to set your own goals, instead of having the game do it for you, if you want the game to or not (looking at you gear grind in the other games).

 

Yes, that does take some getting use to, but for some at least, it is a much more enjoyable style of game.

[Bladestrom.6425]

Now end game in GW2?

 

achievements

Legendary weapons

Legendary gear

Acended Gear

Gear sets and loadouts

Playing with builds (not just the build that gives the biggest dps/tank/heal)

skins

getting rich

converting gold to gems, buying what you want.

Completing all story lines

Get all mounts.

Be awesome at PVP

Be Awesome at PVE

Be Awesome at WVW

 

 

most importantly, all at your own speed

 

 

 

[mungozen.2379]

1 hour ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

 

I just needed to get this out. I really like this game. It has a lot of really special things. And the lore is awesome. But everything seems so.. worthless. 

I played WoW for years, all those Vanilla, TBC and WotLK items I got are long gone and forgotten. I leveled, I geared, I did all the things and then poof, gone because new expansions and new levels rendering all my hard earned gear garbage.

Seems to me that worthless may be relative to the player experience. One could argue virtual items you don’t own (aka game characters and items) are worthless as well. We may ascribe value as we invest time and energy into gaining these items and expanding our character, but ultimately we don’t own them and we don’t control our access to them.

[Rogue.8235]

1 hour ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

Thank you for the answers! I think legendary armor will be the way to go then. Achievements are neat, but also very chaotic in a way. The game really wants you to make your own goals. Anyways, thank you, especially Rogue.8235 for the long text!

 

no problem

Another note, you can probably break down legendary crafting into bite sized chunks.  I use the wiki exclusively, but other player's will probably suggest other tools to organize and chart your long-term journey of getting a full legendary armory.

The first one that should be easiest to get is the legendary amulet for completing the Living World Return meta achievement. 

Personally, I find the PvP legendaries easier to get.  There's also WvW legendaries as well.

Good luck, have fun!

 

[Zephire.8049]

The end goal: Doing what you find fun.

For some it's the story, some it's fashion. Others want to raid while others focus on legendary armour. There's fishing, there's collecting mini pets, there's roleplaying, there's achievement hunting, there's PvP, there's WvW, there's fractals, there's building wealth. And so much more.

Compared to other MMOs that push you hard on vertical progression, GW2 can feel uncomfortably open-ended, but it's not so much that it's up to you to make your own fun but rather the game provides you multiple ways to have fun and it's not detrimental to stray from the push of chasing better gear and higher numbers.

Doing fractals and raids while also working on getting legendary gear is about as close as you'll get to standard MMO vertical progression, however, so that's probably where you'll feel most comfortable. Especially if you approach fractals as a challenge to build up your agony resistance organically rather than buying it from the trading post and jumping to max AR.

[Swagger.1459]

4 hours ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

I know, GW2 is a totally different style of MMO. And it does a lot of things differently from WoW, some you could like, some you don't. And I also don't intend to form this game into something I like and all of you don't. But I know quite a few people that have loved this game for some time and then suddenly stopped playing. For me it was like this since 2016 too. I started, stopped. After some years I started again, loved it, but stopped. And to me it is an aspect of the game that I would call..... it's a little bit too sandbox.

 

Take this with a grain of salt, sandbox is great! Really great. In Tyria you can do pretty much everything and get something for yourself. That's super! In some way... because, I think what the problem is, especially, if you don't have other people to play with, that you don't get those.. long-term goals. It's nice to just log in, do a little bit of roaming, do a few hearts, events, listen to the very awesome world, maybe do an arena or if you've got a bit more time, do a dungeon or something... it's very nice, if you have just some time and ya.. just want to do anything. But I personally figured out for myself, after some time I just don't know what my aim is. 
 

In WoW you have goals.

1. First goal is to get to max level, in GW2, there is much less effort to do this. But I like to level, because I always have something to focus on and to do the things for I do. 
2. Then you know, when you do dungeons in WoW you get better loot and some kind of tokens to get even better loot. In GW2 you get some stuff, but.. what for? I mean, sure it's something. But do you need it in an aim for anything else? To get stronger? Not really. Mats? You can get somewhere else too. So you can have an achievement if you gather them? Hm maybe yes, that's a point. But is it enough? 
3. In WoW you want to get stronger and stronger and you feel it, you feel, some raids or dungeons or whatever just die more easily or you don't die as easily. In PvP you can feel if your armor is better. In GW2, when you have exotic armor, there isn't that much in view to get. In WoW you know, you have to go there and do this to get better armor, in PvP and as well in PvE. And you feel the new armor. At least it was like that previously. 

 

Now in GW2, where do I get these long term goals?

The living story is nice, I love story and lore! And listen to everything precisely. But the things you get for completing parts is.. meh. It's just not necessary to do it. I could literally just walk around and gather and do hearts and get .. maybe even better stuff in the same time. I didn't recognize I'd get a special skin, a mini, a mount, some stronger armor than I have.. just something to store and sell and dismantle. The story is at least a goal I can always follow. But besides this...

 

I can do anything all the time. But I can't get myself a goal. Something big. Something like becoming stronger, or to become the best or some motivation to find myself a team and guild to accomplish something, because why accomplish it? I'd really want to have something to .. do something for. The long-term goal. The aim I do everything I do for. Or to do something specific for. I just feel lost in this game. Over and over again. And I am not a twinker. I want to play my main and to develop him. To experience with him. And to work for a greater goal.

But I think this game makes it pretty difficult. 

 

 

I just needed to get this out. I really like this game. It has a lot of really special things. And the lore is awesome. But everything seems so.. worthless. 

GW2 was sold as a game that didn't have the eternal gear treadmill, and that's the way many of us like it. I'm pretty sure many players (myself included) were also tired of gear grinds from level to level every time a game company released an expansion and upped the max level. Pretty unimaginative and it forced players to constantly grind for gear to stay relevant. No thanks on having that crud in GW2. 

 

I'm glad someone told you about legendary gear. Have fun grinding those out. However, be aware that all legendary gear carries ascended gear stats, which is only one gear step up from exotic gear stats. And the stat increase difference between ascended and exotic is a small percentage, like 5-10% difference, whatever. 

 

We don't need anything from wow. Let wow be wow and gw2 be gw2.   

 

GL! 

[SuavePuppy.2809]

Kinda just sounds like you prefer more of the gear treadmill style of design, which is fine, but just isn't how GW2 is or is likely going to be in the future. 

When it comes to trying to chase that feeling of becoming more powerful, my preference is to gear up new classes / specs, try to learn several builds for them, and try to take on more specialized roles in instanced PvE content.

Also, cosmetics that are exclusive to certain fights and game modes don't add power but are a nice goal because lookin' good is the real endgame.

Edited December 9, 2022 by SuavePuppy.2809

[Urud.4925]

As @Swagger.1459 said, GW2 has been sold as game for casual players, a different MMO (actually labelled as COORPG). ArenaNet would probably gain more players if they started to copy WoW, but they would also lose many others (that would probably struggle to find an alternative to GW2). I think at this point the game has its own personality and it would be a change too risky to do (they promised to never increase the level cap for example). Maybe GW3 will be more similar to WoW/FFXIV, but let GW2 stay what it is now. I find good when the market offers more options, rather than just copy the games that sell the most, like in the WoW-clones era.

[The Boz.2038]

Craft a legendary weapon.
Then craft a legendary backpiece.
After that, craft a legendary armor set.

[Antycypator.9874]

The best thing about GW2 is that your gear is good today, and it will be good in 5 years. In many games everything you've worked on hard, might be garbage now, because there is BETTER gear to obtain.

WoW system is outdated and unfair — because it's not YOU who is really strong. It's just your gear. You are nothing without it. In GW2 everything is achieved by YOU. You can get even blue gear and still beat every content.

[DanAlcedo.3281]

Ahhh yes. Bring infinite gear grind to gw2. 

That like saying Vegan Food needs meat in it. 

 

[Danikat.8537]

I agree that legendary crafting is a good choice if you want a long-term goal (making a full set is a very long-term goal with a lot of intermediate goals along the way) and if you want to go that route I recommend starting with Ad Infinitum. Firstly because backpacks are universal so any character you make will be able to use it, but also because it's earned in Fractals which is one of the few areas of the game with a clear progression system (including requiring better gear to access higher tiers), but you don't actually have to go through them strictly in order so it might work as a bit of a transition from what you're used to into how GW2 does things.

If you go that route I strongly recommend taking your time. There's no time limit on making legendaries (or any other item) and you will never lose progress because you didn't progress it frequently enough so if you don't have time or you're bored and want to do something else, either within GW2 or outside of it you should do that. It's a game, ultimately the only goal is to have fun playing it so if it's not fun there's no need to do it.
 

9 hours ago, The Greyhawk.9107 said:

I feel like I've seen everything now.  GW2 is too much of a sandbox MMO? 

It's definitely not a sandbox game in the conventional sense, but it is more open-ended than a lot of MMOs, especially once you get to level 80.

I'd say GW2 is a true 'theme park' MMO, except that term is normally used to describe games with clear linear progression (like WoW), which is weird to me because theme parks don't work that way. There's no required route through them, no one's going to say "sorry you can't get on Super Death Coaster 5000, you just arrived, go ride the bumper cars and work your way up to the big rides". Instead you've got lots of seperate rides and attractions and it's entirely up to you which ones you do first, which you save for later and which you skip entirely. A lot of people will spend all day in there and won't do all the rides, while going on others multiple times.

GW2 is the same. As soon as you get out of the tutorial you can go to any of the 5 starter maps, and if you know where to go or it's not your first character you can go straight into PvP and WvW (if it is your first character the menu is hidden until level 18 for WvW and 22 for PvP). You will be prompted to do the personal story and dungeons when they're available but can ignore both. Once you're level 80 you can go anywhere in the game and play everything in any order you like. Within some areas there's some linearity, for example you can't do The Only One (the EoD final boss fight story) without doing the rest of the EoD story but you can start the EoD story right away without having to do any of the earlier storylines.

That's great if you like that freedom to choose, but it can also be a bit overwhelming if you're new to it or don't know what's available or how to decide what to focus on first.

[Hotride.2187]

I'm farming gold and mats for 3 years now (often a few hours every day for months) to get full legendary. And even after that I'll have other  goals.

GW2 has many times better goal system than WoW and nothing deletes your progression every N months cause Blizzard needs more $$$ but didn't figure out a better way to keep players occupied.

I have like 5k hours in GW2, I have 10k+ hours in WoW (prolly way more but I don't remember anymore). I'm never ever returning to WoW and its asinine "gear progression".

What you want to play pvp in GW2? There you go, you download the client and you are good to go. No idiot farming, just nada. What you want to jump into raids? Just get like 100g, buy exotics and you're good to go. What you want 5 player content that is worth your time? Here you go, fractals. What, you want to actually play in all those zones you like? Here you go, open world metas; the zone is not obsolete just because you already finished lvling in it.

To say nothing of GW2 pvp just being decades ahead of WoW (and I've played a lot of pvp in WoW).

IMO raids are the only reason to play WoW over GW2, but how much elitist drama are you willing to cope with? As you pay  the monthly subscription.

GW2 is in no way without flaws, but compared to WoW its holy kitten better.

Edited December 9, 2022 by Hotride.2187

[michixlol.9340]

Maybe I'm just a bit overwhelmed 🙂 thank you for all the answers! I'll consider every one of them. 

[The Boz.2038]

11 minutes ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

Maybe I'm just a bit overwhelmed 🙂 thank you for all the answers! I'll consider every one of them. 

What classes/builds do you play?

[Gehenna.3625]

12 hours ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

I know, GW2 is a totally different style of MMO. And it does a lot of things differently from WoW, some you could like, some you don't. And I also don't intend to form this game into something I like and all of you don't. But I know quite a few people that have loved this game for some time and then suddenly stopped playing. For me it was like this since 2016 too. I started, stopped. After some years I started again, loved it, but stopped. And to me it is an aspect of the game that I would call..... it's a little bit too sandbox.

A lot of WoW players are like that. They play for a while. Then they stop and come back when the next expansion hits. 

12 hours ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

Take this with a grain of salt, sandbox is great! Really great. In Tyria you can do pretty much everything and get something for yourself. That's super! In some way... because, I think what the problem is, especially, if you don't have other people to play with, that you don't get those.. long-term goals. It's nice to just log in, do a little bit of roaming, do a few hearts, events, listen to the very awesome world, maybe do an arena or if you've got a bit more time, do a dungeon or something... it's very nice, if you have just some time and ya.. just want to do anything. But I personally figured out for myself, after some time I just don't know what my aim is. 

You don't have your hand held as much as in WoW perhaps. But there's lots to do, it's just that you get to make the decision yourself.

12 hours ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

In WoW you have goals.

1. First goal is to get to max level, in GW2, there is much less effort to do this. But I like to level, because I always have something to focus on and to do the things for I do. 
2. Then you know, when you do dungeons in WoW you get better loot and some kind of tokens to get even better loot. In GW2 you get some stuff, but.. what for? I mean, sure it's something. But do you need it in an aim for anything else? To get stronger? Not really. Mats? You can get somewhere else too. So you can have an achievement if you gather them? Hm maybe yes, that's a point. But is it enough? 
3. In WoW you want to get stronger and stronger and you feel it, you feel, some raids or dungeons or whatever just die more easily or you don't die as easily. In PvP you can feel if your armor is better. In GW2, when you have exotic armor, there isn't that much in view to get. In WoW you know, you have to go there and do this to get better armor, in PvP and as well in PvE. And you feel the new armor. At least it was like that previously. 

Though the leveing may be easier here (I'll have to take your word for that), there is the mastery system that follows and keeps you busy for quite a while.

Better loot in this game means cosmetics and you get more powerful here by mastering the combat system. That makes quite a difference when you do this. There is no gear treadmill with the illusion of getting more powerful.

There is very little vertical progression in GW2 and much more horizontal progression. I get that that's not for everybody though.

12 hours ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

Now in GW2, where do I get these long term goals?

The living story is nice, I love story and lore! And listen to everything precisely. But the things you get for completing parts is.. meh. It's just not necessary to do it. I could literally just walk around and gather and do hearts and get .. maybe even better stuff in the same time. I didn't recognize I'd get a special skin, a mini, a mount, some stronger armor than I have.. just something to store and sell and dismantle. The story is at least a goal I can always follow. But besides this...

Well, like I said, you're used to a game holding your hand and guiding you. This game doesn't do that as much but that doesn't mean the goals aren't there. As someone mentioned just look at the achievements. Also because there are many rewards for completing them.

12 hours ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

I can do anything all the time. But I can't get myself a goal. Something big. Something like becoming stronger, or to become the best or some motivation to find myself a team and guild to accomplish something, because why accomplish it? I'd really want to have something to .. do something for. The long-term goal. The aim I do everything I do for. Or to do something specific for. I just feel lost in this game. Over and over again. And I am not a twinker. I want to play my main and to develop him. To experience with him. And to work for a greater goal.

But I think this game makes it pretty difficult. 

For me the long-term goals are two-fold. First of all get a complete set of legendaries. Not all legendaries but get one set of legendary trinkets, armors and weapons that I use. 

Secondly the aim for me is to get "perfect" looks for all of my characters (I have 18 currently). Some of the skins are hard to get and that makes them long-term goals. One of the skins I want to get is the Radiant Backguard which you can get at 39K achievement points. So yeah, definitely a long-term goal.

12 hours ago, VanDBellen.4913 said:

I just needed to get this out. I really like this game. It has a lot of really special things. And the lore is awesome. But everything seems so.. worthless. 

It depends on what you want, but I think that the eternal gear treadmill with ever higher levels and new gear tiers is an illusion of power that you happen to believe in because you are used to it. But all it is, is an illusion. It works as long as you believe it, but once you see through it, it loses its value. At least it did to me.

 

[Bladestrom.6425]

Op if you want to get some objectives, this is what i do (may or may not help)  go to the achievements panel and search with a random 3 letters, then look at the achievements and rewards and see if anything appeals to you, rinse and repeat.  If any do appeal, then click on it so it becomes a sticky on your objectives view in game. Objective sweety shop 🙂

You can obviously do same for your target legendary etc.  I run with about 15 on the go at any one time and regulary shuffle the order to being my current favourite to the top of the list. (click on achievement on game screen takes you to summary view, you can then drag order around in there

Edited December 9, 2022 by vesica tempestas.1563