The Return of Raiding and Convergences in Janthir Wilds

[Rubi Bayer.8493]

Raids are coming back! Take a look at what is to come in both 10-player and 50-player encounters.

[Luthan.5236]

A bit less pressure to play a lot, for me - it seems. I might finish the old legendary spear (so not in need for another one) - and I have already a back item from PvP. I guess that new one then will be the PvE version for players that do not want to do fractals. Armor ... I have lots of mats from SotO already.

I will check out the convergences and 50-man raid version (are those 2 differen things? read like there would be a 50-man mode of the raid and was well the separate new convergence stuff) a bit - to see if there are other rewards that are worth getting. Or maybe achievements to grind out. But not doing the 10-man instanced stuff.

Mainly interested in the plot though - so far. And maybe a lil bit homestead in the first weeks.

[Andy.5981]

Nothing against Convergences or 10 person raids and I'm glad that the people who enjoy these things get some new content, but I do not want to see map or story completion locked behind Convergences or a Raid that you must take part in. Maps and Story completion should only take place in open world or a personal instances. If this happens at some point in the future you are storing up problems as people migrate to newer content. 

Edited July 24 by Andy.5981

[Slartibartfast.5416]

So... just a rando question.  Would I be correct in assuming Research Notes will still be a thing going forward with the new stuff?  You mentioned you're carrying over essences from SotO.  Wondering if Research Notes will still be a part of things.  Not out of excitement, mind you... more out of morbid curiosity.

[Omega.6801]

12 minutes ago, Slartibartfast.5416 said:

So... just a rando question.  Would I be correct in assuming Research Notes will still be a thing going forward with the new stuff?  You mentioned you're carrying over essences from SotO.  Wondering if Research Notes will still be a part of things.  Not out of excitement, mind you... more out of morbid curiosity.

Currencies never really carry over or else players wouldn't be incentivised to played the new content apparently...it's a curse really...

Also, when I read "Rift Essences" I want to throw up.

The rest sounds good on paper, we'll see when it's released.

[Crimsonbeak.3751]

Could a little more be said about the new "rift essences"?  I read it as working similar to how green/blue shards, or coins worked where there would be 2 different types of essences for convergences, "Rift Essences" for the Janthir Wilds Convergences, with SotO Convergences continuing to give the existing essences.  But a guild member read it as the current SotO Convergence will be changed to also give the new essence types when Janthir Wilds launches.

[Toraseishin.1932]

Yea - could definitely use some clarification on:

Quote

Completing Convergences in Guild Wars 2: Janthir Wilds will award players with essences that can be used to craft legendary gear. And, yes, these essences will be compatible with the legendary Obsidian armor available in Guild Wars 2: Secrets of the Obscure, as well as the new legendary spear and legendary backpack arriving in the quarterly updates for Guild Wars 2: Janthir Wilds. Essences from Convergences will be renamed “rift essences” (with three rarities) to streamline the rewards.

It says the essences from Convergences will be "renamed", which implies that it'll be the same material - just with a new name. Adding to that the compatibility with the legendary Obsidian armor....how will it be compatible exactly?
Currently, the essences from Convergences are the same essences from Kryptis rifts. So are the SoTO Convergence essences (and therefore Krypris rift essences) just being renamed, or will it be a totally new material? And is the compatibility like...an alternate recipe for Amalgamated Kryptis Essence that uses the new rift essences instead?

This current wording makes it sound like anyone who has stocked up on Kryptis essences will have a head-start on Janthir Wilds legendaries, and I can't imagine that being the case....at least I'd hope not.

 

[Degs.5148]

Heyo, Rubi!  Just curious, with the return to raids and no new strikes, will SOTO strikes move to blue shards or stay green or something else entirely?

[Axaressa.4612]

If they're gonna continue on with essences, please please make it a wallet currency. It already should have been in the first place. No other currency in the game is overflowing like essences.

[Vidit.7108]

I guess we'll have to wait and see if this is any good.

I think though that what sounds concerning is that you have possibly too many difficulty tiers. To recap this post and previous statements this raid features 1. A story version of the encounter in the player's personal story. 2. A 50-player convergence anet is calling the "open world" version. 3. 10 player raid version 4. 10 player cm raid version. 5. 10 player legendary CM version (which i'm going to assume like Cerus is turned out of whatever failed CM version of this fight they release first).

If there is a CM convergence as well then that is 6 versions. I don't know how you will judge or collect player feedback about which version players liked or didn't like. It seems like this is ripe for confusion from players if they talk about the new raid boss but actually mean the story version or the convergence version. Also it seems somewhat inevitable that if you can do this fight with 50 less-organized people that would probably be more popular? especially if it is over faster. I hope that's not held against the raid version and it gets a fair shot.

While there is mention here about rift essences is this only the convergences version that is giving these rewards? will magnetite shards be given in the raid version? how comparable are the rewards in rift essences if they each reward them? I'd be pretty concerned that if there were a CM convergence that it rewards too little for the amount of time it takes to form a CM convergence group.

[Furball.1236]

3 hours ago, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Raids are coming back! Take a look at what is to come in both 10-player and 50-player encounters.

The post today gives me a huge worry.

Integrating the raid instance with the main story and a convergences instance means that this new 10-man content will not have a unique story or a secret mysterious environment explore, which one of the most notable features of raids separating themselves from strikes. But I'll leave it be because this part was sadly already revealed in the previous announcement.

What's concerning in this post is that the difference between this new "raid" and convergences seems like a simple scale up/down of the same fight. These two are very different type of contents. The raid should require distinguished individual roles in general (tank, support, heal, DPS) to allow each player clearly see the impact of their unique contribution, various encounter-specific unique roles that often require utilizing profession-specific toolkits (kite, reflect, push, and many others), boss movements and attacks that respond to the players' actions instead of being scripted, unique mini-game phases that add different tastes between main boss phases, phase-specific mechanics, players' needs to deal with multiple mechanics simultaneously when they line up, generally more complicated and interactive mechanics, and other things.

If this new content will first be designed for a 50-man convergences and get scaled down to a 10-man level, that will lack any of these things that make raids what we want to play repeatedly for years despite the lack of good rewarding system, instead of a content like dragonstorm that many play only play because of the rewards and abandon them when another meta with better rewards is released. I really hope you guys are designing a new raid with fun mechanics, instead of labeling a scaled-down 10-man version of a 50-man instanced content a raid.

Edited July 24 by Furball.1236
edited because of typo

[Ashen.2907]

Will mounts be mandatory or nearly so for this content?

Edited July 25 by Ashen.2907

[Gop.8713]

I'm most concerned about the fifty-player version "requiring participation from every player", bc having played gw2 I am well aware that many players are simply not willing to participate ; p

It's bad enough having to carry them, having them tank the instance would be worse. My initial reaction is to imagine something like marionette, which is seldom done compared to a lot of other content precisely bc it requires participation from most if not all players . . .

I'm sure it will work out tho, esp at the beginning when it's new and everyone is doing it . . .

[Mistwraithe.3106]

5 hours ago, Vidit.7108 said:

I think though that what sounds concerning is that you have possibly too many difficulty tiers.

A reasonable comment but personally I think this is a good thing. I think one thing GW2 is a bit weak on is the ability to find appropriately challenging group content.

Fractals are best at that, the different tiers and quantity of the fractals (which differ a bit in difficulty between them) provide a good challenge which you can self adjust (eg if you are running with friends and there are only 3 of you tonight you can go down a fractal tier and get a good challenge still).

I would love to see more content with difficulty tiers. Even strikes - my friends/family guild maxes out at 6-7 people online so we can do the first three IBS strikes but the more difficult strikes are a challenge for our small group as are raids (even when emboldened). We'll keep working on getting better but it would be nice if GW2 10 person instanced content had more difficulty levels available for us (or maybe a way of turning on scaling by squad size for a corresponding decrease in loot or some such).

At the other end of the scale there was a lot of excitement and buzz around a couple of the recent really difficult CM strikes (now called legendary mode) where the worlds best groups of players were competing to be the first to complete them. I'm never going to be at that level (Legendary Mode) but I think it's great that the mode exists for those who are.

[AllNightPlayer.1286]

So, instead of making a raid with unique story and assets, there will be a light (story instance), medium (raid), and hard (convergence) version of the same thing? Sounds like more recycling and laziness to me.

Edited July 25 by AllNightPlayer.1286

[TexZero.7910]

The article reads really poorly. It's as if you're already finding excuses for which to underdeliver and dissapoint people with.
Whoever wrote it, whether trying to be blunt, honest, or somewhere in the middle really should have had another person read over it and tell them to omit the excuses about why you didn't/couldn't do something.

[Tyncale.1629]

I am happy to read that the Convergences will give currency that can be used for the Obsidian Armor. 👍

[Darkk.3018]

I am looking forward to the new new raid, but I'd echo what has been said already.

I'm not sure how I feel about the raid being part of the story. I've loved that they were previously side stories with unique lore, but I appreciate Anet being honest that their new approach to raid is due to practical and costs reasons.

As I understand it, the raid will be tiered for personal story, 50-man convergence and 10 man raids. That's quite a lot of value that Anet will get out of it. I really hope for unique enemies and rewards between the convergence and raid versions, like unique ascended weapons etc. This will hugely affect my motivation for doing either. 

Fingers crossed that this works well. 

[Palador.2170]

As long as nothing like story or map exploration is locked behind the raid/convergence (See: Victory or Death/The Ruined City of Arah) , I'm good with this.

Yes, this means that the raid will hold no big plot surprises for the raiders, but I see this as an acceptable compromise. It lowers the cost and problems associated with making a new raid. And it doesn't rule out unexpected surprises, they just won't be relevant to the overall plot. 

[Astralporing.1957]

The article reads like you are basically saying (again) that raids just aren't popular enough. And then indirectly admitting that the idea of "bridging content" failed, and didn't really create any visible impact - that the people that wanted to play raids, want to play raids, and the people that didn't want to play raids before still do not want to play them nowadays.

And then you go on saying that regardless of that you will try (once again) to push raid content forward, hoping this time it will somehow turn out different than in all previous cases. Also, you want to increase Convergence difficulty across the board completely ignoring the lessons you should have learned from the previously mentioned failure of the "bridging content".

I think there's something to say about learning valuable lessons from the past, and then immediately discarding them because you happen to dislike them.

[Rubi Bayer.8493]

22 hours ago, Toraseishin.1932 said:

Yea - could definitely use some clarification on:

It says the essences from Convergences will be "renamed", which implies that it'll be the same material - just with a new name. Adding to that the compatibility with the legendary Obsidian armor....how will it be compatible exactly?
Currently, the essences from Convergences are the same essences from Kryptis rifts. So are the SoTO Convergence essences (and therefore Krypris rift essences) just being renamed, or will it be a totally new material? And is the compatibility like...an alternate recipe for Amalgamated Kryptis Essence that uses the new rift essences instead?

This current wording makes it sound like anyone who has stocked up on Kryptis essences will have a head-start on Janthir Wilds legendaries, and I can't imagine that being the case....at least I'd hope not.

 

I've seen this question here and there so you're definitely not alone in wondering–I can help clarify! 

There won't be an additional currency or essence type. Kryptis Essences (Essences of Despair, Greed, and Triumph) that are in the game now will be renamed "Rift Essences". They can be used for the legendary Obsidian armor in SotO as well as the legendary spear and legendary backpack coming in Janthir Wilds. 

Like legendary Obsidian armor, there will be additional materials required to craft the legendary spear and backpack, but the Kryptis essence you're earning now will carry over to Janthir Wilds as rift essence. 

 

[Linken.6345]

43 minutes ago, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

I've seen this question here and there so you're definitely not alone in wondering–I can help clarify! 

There won't be an additional currency or essence type. Kryptis Essences (Essences of Despair, Greed, and Triumph) that are in the game now will be renamed "Rift Essences". They can be used for the legendary Obsidian armor in SotO as well as the legendary spear and legendary backpack coming in Janthir Wilds. 

Like legendary Obsidian armor, there will be additional materials required to craft the legendary spear and backpack, but the Kryptis essence you're earning now will carry over to Janthir Wilds as rift essence. 

 

Will they go into the wallet?

[Parasite.5389]

33 minutes ago, Linken.6345 said:

Will they go into the wallet?

as a crafting item, no

[Linken.6345]

21 minutes ago, Parasite.5389 said:

as a crafting item, no

They could if you can buy the crafting item from a vendor when needed.

Because going from 2500 for each of the 3 types into a 1 generic type make it alot worse then it already was.

Edit

Looks like I missed were it said the new one will be 3 types too.

Edited July 25 by Linken.6345

[Randulf.7614]

Just now, Linken.6345 said:

They could if you can buy the crafting item from a vendor when needed.

Because going from 2500 for each of the 3 types into a 1 generic type make it alot worse then it already was.

It says three rarities so that indicates it won’t be one generic type. All they are doing is renaming them to a generic title that is appropriate to both expacs