TY for balanced patch

[Justine.6351]

@Aeolus.3615 said:besides burn i dont see other conditions to be much of a issue :\

i would say they are okish, instant 10k+ burn ticks, cleanse and receive another 5-8k tick.. i think its the only condition overperforming :\

If by instant you mean you and 4 others standing in sword of justice for 3+ seconds then sure, instant. The scary part is you cleansing and then still standing in that same aoe for another 2 seconds.

[phreeak.1023]

seems the new balance team hates power builds... About time for the New World release.

[kash.9213]

@aaron.7850 said:necros need more nerfs, and all pvp nerfs should affect wvw also

Are necros wrecking everyone in spvp? Vs both of my main thief builds it still seems like all of the necro builds are pretty hard countered by mine apart from having some buffer to nope out if they don't panic whereas before it was basically a given. Asking for a necro nerf in WvW right now feels as self serving as some lazy OP asking for thief movement nerf in this build of the game.

[Sovereign.1093]

Issue is disconnecting =/ huhu.

[VAHNeunzehnsechundsiebzig.]

engi nerf is really not enough and dragon banner is still insane.

And now we have 4 more weeks of this? At least?

[Jugglemonkey.8741]

@bluberblasen.9684 said:

• The little Guard nerf is nice

• the necro very small nerf is nice

• the engi bomb kit nerf is nice

• you missed the thief nerf ( movement nerf )

• you missed the firebrand nerf ( sustain )

• you missed the engi ( holo ) nerf ( still too much damage and too much sustain in small scale )

• you missed the weaver nerf in wvw ( just reduce all barrier gain by 50% )

• you missed the condi nerf in wvw

300 second cooldown skills still not reworked or at least change the recharge to 100 seconds....

@Vlad Morbius.1759 said:I was stoked when they revamped the balance team things were way too lopsided but they are still leaving too many meta builds untouched for too long. Thief movement is obscene and needs to be toned down / Firebrand sustain is way overpowered / Holosmith too much damage overall and condition overall has to be toned down before we revert back to 2013!

Why does thief mobility need toning down? In PvP we can't duel because we lack sustain and don't have enough damage to do more than +1, that means our role is decap, that's it. In WvW that mobility advantage is meaningless when everyone has mounts; if you die to thief before he resets it wasn't his mobility that killed you, and if the thief goes out of combat to reset just mount up and leave him to himself. In PvE, who even cares about mobility?

I mean, the old nerf excuse was that thief has top mobility so it must not be able to 1v1 and must have no sustain, so if you want mobility nerfed then what exactly is your reasoning? What are you prepared to buff on thief in return? Seriously, explain your reasoning, I'd love to hear it.

[Kovu.7560]

They're doing a solid job at pushing ranger towards condi in pvp.

~ Kovu

[ArchonWing.9480]

More like a hotfix but w/e, burn guard and bomb engi needed to be nerfed.

[Sobx.1758]

@bluberblasen.9684 said:

• The little Guard nerf is nice

• the necro very small nerf is nice

• the engi bomb kit nerf is nice

• you missed the thief nerf ( movement nerf )

• you missed the firebrand nerf ( sustain )

• you missed the engi ( holo ) nerf ( still too much damage and too much sustain in small scale )

• you missed the weaver nerf in wvw ( just reduce all barrier gain by 50% )

• you missed the condi nerf in wvw

300 second cooldown skills still not reworked or at least change the recharge to 100 seconds....

.

@Vlad Morbius.1759 said:I was stoked when they revamped the balance team things were way too lopsided but they are still leaving too many meta builds untouched for too long. Thief movement is obscene and needs to be toned down / Firebrand sustain is way overpowered / Holosmith too much damage overall and condition overall has to be toned down before we revert back to 2013!

I need both of you to show me how you play thief with no mobility. Load up your thief toon, go to wvw/pvp and make an uncut video in some consecutive encounters. Then lets talk about your opinions again :grimace:

[NotFound.7813]

@aaron.7850 said:necros need more nerfs, and all pvp nerfs should affect wvw also

Pvp and wvw balances have different purpose

[bluberblasen.9684]

@Sobx.1758 said:

I need both of you to show me how you play thief with no mobility. Load up your thief toon, go to wvw/pvp and make an uncut video in some consecutive encounters. Then lets talk about your opinions again :grimace:you can duel me every time with your thief at armistice bastion.

[Sovereign.1093]

Why armistice bastion though? That place isn't free to go. @.@

[Aeolus.3615]

@Justine.6351 said:

@Aeolus.3615 said:besides burn i dont see other conditions to be much of a issue :\

i would say they are okish, instant 10k+ burn ticks, cleanse and receive another 5-8k tick.. i think its the only condition overperforming :\

If by instant you mean you and 4 others standing in sword of justice for 3+ seconds then sure, instant. The scary part is you cleansing and then still standing in that same aoe for another 2 seconds.

i know that skill way to much and the changes over time been using it on my guardian since the betas (my pve guard is and always was a SW caster)>_>, never had more 1 or 2 hit(unless downwed state from) while ur moving its most probably u will get the SoJ from some one targeting the ally in front of u than u get hits from some one targeting u with it.,SoJ should never used as primary source unless target is KD/KB or rooted.

3-4k burn ticks sare sustainable(they can put some pressure but its somewhat manageble) the instant 8k plus burn ticks dont come from SoJ, alitle bit of ignore soj and keep moving or straff to the sides will make SoJ casting bit useless, its like a mark with animation.

Note: Sometimes one die to lag and desync, u use skills and they dont do nothing...

[Turkeyspit.3965]

@Aeolus.3615 said:SoJ should never used as primary source unless target is KD/KB or rooted.

In 1v1, I agree completely. Against a squad? Different story. The comedy is that SoJ, like Meteor Shower (used to be), is a great zerg buster. A proper squad will stack up, which creates the ideal circumstances for SoJ to deal maximum damage. Now, against an organized squad who have supports who pay attention, you can cast 2-3 SoJs into the middle of their blob and achieve nothing but numbers on your screen and Arc. Against a disorganized group, or one with little support? It's a massacre.

So the takeaway is that SoJ does its maximum carnage against disorganized squads. So what's the problem then?

Look at the nerf ANET gave to Permeating Wrath. Have you seen the differences between the WvW version, the PvE version and the PvP version? I know that it isn't tied exclusively to SoJ, but it shows that ANET is fully aware that in a 1v1 situation, which is commonplace in PvP, SoJ + Wrath is hardly the boogie-man of abilities. It only really hits its stride against a large group of enemy standing close together.

The other day I was with a pug group assaulting Bay. We breached outer and built catas on the cliff. The walls went down and most of the squad jumped down to the water. The enemy group decided to stack and push the dock, to kill us as we swam up. I guess they didn't realize that SoJ can be cast while the player is under water, and it manifests on the dock itself. 15 players, all nicely stacked on a narrow platform, focused on hazing the edge of the dock, and not paying attention to what was happening. To me that isn't evidence that SoJ or burn guards in general are broken or too powerful - those players misplayed and deserved to be routed.

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

@Justine.6351 said:

@Aeolus.3615 said:besides burn i dont see other conditions to be much of a issue :\

i would say they are okish, instant 10k+ burn ticks, cleanse and receive another 5-8k tick.. i think its the only condition overperforming :\

If by instant you mean you and 4 others standing in sword of justice for 3+ seconds then sure, instant. The scary part is you cleansing and then still standing in that same aoe for another 2 seconds.

Its more of SoJ plus two symbols, but yeah its their fault for staying in the AoE rather than getting out then cleansing.

[Stand The Wall.6987]

@Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

@"Justine.6351" said:If by instant you mean you and 4 others standing in sword of justice for 3+ seconds then sure, instant. The scary part is you cleansing and then still standing in that same aoe for another 2 seconds.

Its more of SoJ plus two symbols, but yeah its their fault for staying in the AoE rather than getting out then cleansing.

its soj plus scepter 2, or spread out if they're cleansing it too fast. you can't expect people to spend dodges on low cd skills, and yes you would have to dodge this and not just walk out since the burns stack too fast. burn guard has always been broken in wvw it just took people a long time to figure it out for some reason. all the dumdums still clinging to the idea of "just cleanse". its hilarious. yeah thanks bro cleansing is totally possible every 6 seconds. i'll use my cleansing on this one burn guard instead of the enemy zerg prostrats omegalevel bigbrainthink.

[Lord of the Fire.6870]

The way the meta is right now I'm for more sustain especially condi clean and stabi + stun break , heal can be a tick more .

[phreeak.1023]

@ArchonWing.9480 said:More like a hotfix but w/e, burn guard and bomb engi needed to be nerfed.

Dont see the problem with engis. Its a risky playstyle because u have to go deep and push the enemy. If u play against people who know how to handle it, they can easily counter it. The problem is: most people/commander can't and crying for more nerfs. Try to push WSR KILL/Lays with it. You are dead. For example..

Think the Bomb 1 nerf is more than enough.

[Enduronex.4865]

@bluberblasen.9684 said:

• The little Guard nerf is nice

• the necro very small nerf is nice

• the engi bomb kit nerf is nice

• you missed the thief nerf ( movement nerf )

• you missed the firebrand nerf ( sustain )

• you missed the engi ( holo ) nerf ( still too much damage and too much sustain in small scale )

• you missed the weaver nerf in wvw ( just reduce all barrier gain by 50% )

• you missed the condi nerf in wvw

300 second cooldown skills still not reworked or at least change the recharge to 100 seconds....

How can you still be complaining about engi after all the nerfs it has received?

[Sobx.1758]

@bluberblasen.9684 said:

@"Sobx.1758" said:

I need both of you to show me how you play thief with no mobility. Load up your thief toon, go to wvw/pvp and make an uncut video in some consecutive encounters. Then lets talk about your opinions again :grimace:you can duel me every time with your thief at armistice bastion.

Um... Did you understand what I wrote? Or are you suggesting a "thief vs thief", which actually shows nothing in this context? :p

[Lan Deathrider.5910]

@Stand The Wall.6987 said:

@Lan Deathrider.5910 said:

@"Justine.6351" said:If by instant you mean you and 4 others standing in sword of justice for 3+ seconds then sure, instant. The scary part is you cleansing and then still standing in that same aoe for another 2 seconds.

Its more of SoJ plus two symbols, but yeah its their fault for staying in the AoE rather than getting out then cleansing.

its soj plus scepter 2, or spread out if they're cleansing it too fast. you can't expect people to spend dodges on low cd skills, and yes you would have to dodge this and not just walk out since the burns stack too fast. burn guard has always been broken in wvw it just took people a long time to figure it out for some reason. all the dumdums still clinging to the idea of "just cleanse". its hilarious. yeah thanks bro cleansing is totally possible every 6 seconds. i'll use my cleansing on this one burn guard instead of the enemy zerg prostrats omegalevel bigbrainthink.

Oh I ran my burn DH post patch. I had to stop, the shear OP brokenness of it was too shameful to play. I ran Shield of the Avenger along with it. That weakness is deadly, and if you place them right you can shutdown projectile based builds the entire time. Lot of fun fights south of Bay killing noobs running out of the keep.

[bluberblasen.9684]

@memausz.7264 said:

How can you still be complaining about engi after all the nerfs it has received?

my duo roam partner is playing holo engi and he is on S tier with his holo. My core ele skill level is S tier too.He win 80 / 20 against me so Holo needs more nerf :) ( and yes i win against 99% other holos... )

I have 5000 hours on my ele and can duel + win against all classes apart from

S Tier holos ( its 50 / 50 cant tank their burst )S tier power revs ( its 70 / 30 for the rev ...cant tank their burst )S tier Spellbreakers ( 50 / 50 cant tank their burst )26th-100th place core thiefs ( cant reach them with their insane mobility - but they can chase me after i used my stun breakers, when they go under 25 % life they port away and reset )

I know that iam the underdog with my core ele but .. i have fun with it :-P

[DemonSeed.3528]

One of the problems I've been having with SoJ is that it hasn't been rendering for me. I don't know how long ago it started but it's been few weeks at least. It could do with some tweaking but I don't mind that it exists, just like engi bomb even if it could be annoying in zergs I think it's fine. I don't really want to see any available build variety get nuked on any class.

[Widmo.3186]

@Jugglemonkey.8741 said:

@bluberblasen.9684 said:

• The little Guard nerf is nice

• the necro very small nerf is nice

• the engi bomb kit nerf is nice

• you missed the thief nerf ( movement nerf )

• you missed the firebrand nerf ( sustain )

• you missed the engi ( holo ) nerf ( still too much damage and too much sustain in small scale )

• you missed the weaver nerf in wvw ( just reduce all barrier gain by 50% )

• you missed the condi nerf in wvw

300 second cooldown skills still not reworked or at least change the recharge to 100 seconds....

@"Vlad Morbius.1759" said:I was stoked when they revamped the balance team things were way too lopsided but they are still leaving too many meta builds untouched for too long.

Thief movement is obscene

and needs to be toned down / Firebrand sustain is way overpowered / Holosmith too much damage overall and condition overall has to be toned down before we revert back to 2013!

Why does thief mobility need toning down? In PvP we can't duel because we lack sustain and don't have enough damage to do more than +1, that means our role is decap, that's it. In WvW that mobility advantage is meaningless when everyone has mounts; if you die to thief before he resets it wasn't his mobility that killed you, and if the thief goes out of combat to reset just mount up and leave him to himself. In PvE, who even cares about mobility?

I mean, the old nerf excuse was that thief has top mobility so it must not be able to 1v1 and must have no sustain, so if you want mobility nerfed then what exactly is your reasoning? What are you prepared to buff on thief in return? Seriously, explain your reasoning, I'd love to hear it.

Daily reminder

[L A T I O N.8923]

Wanna Fox soj? 1 burn stack on cast, not hit, make charge cooldown 25s and castcooldown 15s..

While you at IT make IT trigger. that Carry trait once(its been bullshit for years i AM surprised people only noticed now)