Please make more content like Chalice of Tears

[Danikat.8537]

They do make puzzles like this periodically, but I imagine it's not an easy thing to do and needs a chunk of the map devoted to it.

 

One of my favourites is Retrospective Runaround in the Silverwastes. It's similar to Chalice of Tears in that it's a long puzzle where the main challenge is finding the right path but it's a bit more forgiving of individual mistakes. Every time I do it I'm impressed with the way it's woven in around everything else in Silverwastes. Pretty much everything you might think is empty space is actually part of this puzzle (except the surface level in the top left corner) and I like the parts where you emerge from a cave and find yourself on the cliffs above a new area. That's lost a bit of it's impact now mounts make it easier to get above the normally playable areas but I still find it fun to see where you come out.

 

Searing Ascent in Draconis Mons is a similar format in that it's a big puzzle and the main challenge is finding where to go (there are hints but they're very subtle) and is also fairly unique in that it's more of a gliding puzzle than a jumping one. There's also Trolls Revenge in Lion's Arch which is another long puzzle where finding the route is the main challenge, and it makes really good use of the terrain (although the permanent speed boost from masteries makes that one more annoying than it should be, so I don't do it as much now).

 

It's not a jumping puzzle but I think the most recent similar content is the Mystery of the Hidden Tower puzzle in Bjora Marches, which is also part of a series of puzzles (the rest are shorter and easier to find) throughout the map.

 

I really like that Anet put things like this into the game because exploring the map is probably my favourite activity in any game, and while I'll do it even when it's not intended it's so much more fun when there are things to find beyond the marked points and a few collectable items like crafting nodes. So many times I've thought I was just wasting my time scrambling up the back wall of a cave or poking around the edges of the map and then found myself on the path through a jumping puzzle or mini dungeon and it was really exciting to realise not only had I found something I didn't even know to look for but that the developers had recognised people like me would go to places like that and included things for us to find. 🙂

[Astralporing.1957]

8 hours ago, Ultramex.1506 said:

they did, its called Abbadon's Ascent, which ain't easy but you can tell where you need to jump and no crappy unidentifiable slippery slope 

Abaddon's Ascent is very much not like Chalice of Tears. It's not something based on texture glitching and guessing which of the identical looking spots is good and which is bad. The "but" you mentioned is exactly what differentiates good design from a bad one.

[Yggranya.5201]

13 hours ago, Crystal Paladin.3871 said:

okay.. clickbaity post detected.... theres almost 3-5 similar post regarding this jp.. cmon fill this thread with 10 pages of comments...

 

this jp became so famous:

within 24 hrs

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/97673-making-chalice-of-tears-a-requirement-for-completion-is-a-horrible-horrible-thing-to-do-to-players-with-disabilities

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/96947-few-years-ago-after-crafted-aurora-i-thought-i-wont-come-back-to-embers-bay-and-draconis-mons-jps

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/97766-please-make-more-content-like-chalice-of-tears

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/97753-please-remove-ember-bay-jp-from-returning-champion-achievements

https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/topic/97734-a-little-trick-for-chalice-of-tear-easy-to-reach-check-point-4-with-a-mesmer

The difference? All those threads tell how terrible it, so it was only a matter of time till someone came in and made a thread about how much they love it.

 

6 hours ago, Gladiotor.7561 said:

No we should hand out the precursor and the legendary amulet by harvest only 1 tree on every map. Oh scratch that. Make it a log-in reward. 

 

I agree with OP. This is good content. GW2 open world is hardly a challenge. With just spamming autoattack you can complete most events and world completion. Having a hard jp is refreshing. And yes it should be tied to an achievement. If anything, they should nerf the mesmer portals on it.

 

But the portals are there. GW2 taco exists. The prototype position rewinder. Hell people could play mesmer themselves and make a port at every jump in case they fall. You can group up with some friends or guildies and help each other through. So many tools and yet so many people whine over the slightest challenge. 

Ah, just like clockwork, the "challenge" mooks crawl out of the woodworks like they always do. *sigh*

[Crystal Paladin.3871]

8 minutes ago, Yggranya.5201 said:

The difference? All those threads tell how terrible it, so it was only a matter of time till someone came in and made a thread about how much they love it.

I would've felt relieved/ happy if this thread was titled "please make more jp like abbadon's ascent , searing ascent, not so secret jp" but idk why the OP chose to pick CoT... Guess he likes more vertical slanting slope 1pixel invisible footing spaces.... Which in no way improves your thinking/adventuring/mountain climbing skills in this mmo.... 😒

[Yggranya.5201]

1 minute ago, Crystal Paladin.3871 said:

I would've felt relieved/ happy if this thread was titled "please make more jp like abbadon's ascent , searing ascent, not so secret jp" but idk why the OP chose to pick CoT... Guess he likes more vertical slanting slope 1pixel invisible footing spaces.... Which in no way improves your thinking/adventuring/mountain climbing skills in this mmo.... 😒

Everyone else is telling how bad it is so the OP felt like going against the stream just for the sake of it.

[Sobx.1758]

2 hours ago, Yggranya.5201 said:

Ah, just like clockwork, the "challenge" mooks crawl out of the woodworks like they always do. *sigh*

Ah just like clockwork, the moment you have to do anything more than chopping 30 trees for a reward, mooks (whatever it is?) crawl out of the woodworks and start crying, because they deserve the rewards for logging in 🙃  

 

1 hour ago, Yggranya.5201 said:

Everyone else is telling how bad it is so the OP felt like going against the stream just for the sake of it.

Or, you know, people like it, but pretty obviously most of the feedback on the forum (about ANYTHING) is negative, so when they saw some of these threads, they made sure anet hears people also DO like that type of content? 😱 Not everyone is complaining all the time -shocking, I know.

 

 

Edited July 9, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[Blude.6812]

3 hours ago, Crystal Paladin.3871 said:

I would've felt relieved/ happy if this thread was titled "please make more jp like abbadon's ascent , searing ascent, not so secret jp" but idk why the OP chose to pick CoT... Guess he likes more vertical slanting slope 1pixel invisible footing spaces.... Which in no way improves your thinking/adventuring/mountain climbing skills in this mmo.... 😒

Yep, finding one pixel to land on is nothing short of bad design.

[Brandon Uzumaki.1524]

Yeah, did a lot of Jumping Puzzles without a guide, but this one is just a nightmare, Abaddon's one in Siren's is my favorite in the game, it's a perfect mix of JP and a adventure, "oh, look at this misterious, menacing tower, i wonder what's up there", and of course all the jumps are normal and doable to do.

Chalice on the other hand, all these "hitbox jumps" are terrible, having to figure out were the invisible hitbox you have to jump is, so dumb lol, and it does not help that, since i have to play the game on the lowest settings, some of these rocks are just a black shape without any sort of detail, just terrible all around.
Dunno if ping makes any difference on a JP, but i have 140 so it might be another hindrance.
It and the Draconis one are the only JP i haven't completed yet, but Draconis one is mostly because it's super long and i'm chasing other achievements for now.

[HappyHubris.1096]

I wonder what % of the playerbase completed this jumping puzzle?

...without ports?

...or add-on assistance?

 

It probably doesn't make a ton of sense to craft content for a tiny % of the playerbase.

[Crystal Paladin.3871]

1 hour ago, HappyHubris.1096 said:

I wonder what % of the playerbase completed this jumping puzzle?

...without ports?

...or add-on assistance?

 

It probably doesn't make a ton of sense to craft content for a tiny % of the playerbase.

playerbase doesnt stay the same.. the game developers expect the players to get better in the game and enjoy all aspects as and when they improve..  some might struggle in jp when they are new to the game and when they spend enough time in the game, it becomes second nature to them... well almost.. similar content like raids, fractals, strikes and such are designed for everyone its just ppl shd try them out and they'll get interested in them and get comfortable in doing those content

[Astralporing.1957]

2 hours ago, HappyHubris.1096 said:

I wonder what % of the playerbase completed this jumping puzzle?

...without ports?

...or add-on assistance?

 

It probably doesn't make a ton of sense to craft content for a tiny % of the playerbase.

Consider this: the first players that have done it did not do it alone. There was a large group of people trying everything and guessing the paths, helping each other out and exchanging information. All the players that have done it later have done it by using taco, guides, have been shown the way by friends, or just used mesmer portals. As such, i doubt anyone has ever done that JP completely on their own.

 

Consider also this: i saw yesterday a single mesmer portalling up a whole, full squad of people. Then staying to portal some more players. As such, i think that saying that only 1 in 10 of the players that did it did it by their own effort (even if we allow rewinders, self-portalling and guides) may still be underestimating the amount of people that got helped. By a lot.

[Ayrilana.1396]

1 hour ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

All the players that have done it later have done it by using taco, guides, have been shown the way by friends, or just used mesmer portals.

That’s a rather big assumption. 

[Ayrilana.1396]

1 hour ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

As such, i doubt anyone has ever done that JP completely on their own

 

1 hour ago, Astralporing.1957 said:

i think that saying that only 1 in 10 of the players that did it did it by their own effort

 

Sound logic.

[MarkoGold.7126]

people say how horrible it is meanwhile i did it in 30 minutes on my memer after not doing it since ember bay released. 

[kenny.7236]

3 hours ago, MarkoGold.7126 said:

people say how horrible it is meanwhile i did it in 30 minutes on my memer after not doing it since ember bay released. 

All 5 fingers on my hand are of different length.

[Cuks.8241]

11 hours ago, HappyHubris.1096 said:

I wonder what % of the playerbase completed this jumping puzzle?

...without ports?

...or add-on assistance?

 

It probably doesn't make a ton of sense to craft content for a tiny % of the playerbase.

But that's the point of this JP. It's a group effort. At least I think that was the intention.

[Konrad Curze.5130]

hard JPs are great...in games with engines that support them

 

even Anet devs  themselves admited GW2 engine is awful for JPs

Edited July 10, 2021 by Konrad Curze.5130

[Astralporing.1957]

11 hours ago, Ayrilana.1396 said:

That’s a rather big assumption. 

Not really. I just happen to remember how it was originally "solved". If people that were really good at it were unable to solve this puzzle individually then, i doubt the situation has changed since (especially since the knowledge on how to solve the puzzle is already present). There might potentially be some individual exceptions, but even if they are (and in this case it would actually surprise me if there were any), there won't be a significant number of them.

 

It's really simple - the path you need to take is not something that can be logically reasoned out. It has been found only by trial and error of many, many people. It is theoretically possible someone could have tried to do it individually, but the JP area is quite huge, and you would need to spend a really massive amount of time on it. And i don't mean hours.

Edited July 10, 2021 by Astralporing.1957

[phokus.8934]

I hope the next jumping puzzle they add contains the mistlock instability Social Awkwardness.

[Astralporing.1957]

1 hour ago, phokus.8934 said:

I hope the next jumping puzzle they add contains the mistlock instability Social Awkwardness.

And several chokepoints where we will be able to park our characters to kill everyone passing through

[Mitakuye Oyasin.6159]

I hope you are being ironic, not only this JP is horribly poorly designed but also it's practically impossible to complete without help as Taco, guides and mesmers, and even harder to complete for those like me that have a modest PC and in some parts we get low fps and get a bit laggy, I remain convinced that Anet made a serious mistake including it in the Achievements and nothing will make change my mind about that.

[Firebeard.1746]

On 7/8/2021 at 2:46 PM, Teratus.2859 said:

In concept maybe but no more slippy screw you jumps.

CoT was full of dodgy terrain that just pushed you off and screwed you over.
I enjoy a good JP but that one was hellishly frustrating because of that issue.

This is basically my issue with alot of JPs, is the "how can we make the playesr rage when they try to go from point A to point B" design aspect. It's not fun.

[wolfsblut.9435]

2 hours ago, Firebeard.1746 said:

This is basically my issue with alot of JPs, is the "how can we make the playesr rage when they try to go from point A to point B" design aspect. It's not fun.

Try and get used to use the position rewinder - it transforms you simply into a better mesmer for your own. Needs some practice like portals in general (timing, concentration) in the beginning, but once mastered you will ask yourself why you ever even had any issues with JPs in the first place.

[Vilin.8056]

I find it very rewarding to follow a lengthy Youtube video step by step down to every precise pixel just for a proper landing point that I won't slip off the cliff, on a JP that's purely guesswork instead of platforming skill.

 

... while staring at these beautiful scenery of bright blazing lava that certainly won't strain my eyes after 5 minutes.

 

Honesty, I've also done this JP multiple times in the past for collection and achievements, it isn't challenging anymore, just another Youtube/TACO fest with very robotic pixel alignment work and a lot of annoyance that is nowhere to be fun.

Edited July 11, 2021 by Vilin.8056

[Firebeard.1746]

1 hour ago, wolfsblut.9435 said:

Try and get used to use the position rewinder - it transforms you simply into a better mesmer for your own. Needs some practice like portals in general (timing, concentration) in the beginning, but once mastered you will ask yourself why you ever even had any issues with JPs in the first place.

It's a useful suggestion for sure, but I don't think that should have to be the solution.