[Spoilers] Terrible story

[sorudo.9054]

it's amazing you didn't see this coming, it was so obvious you didn't even need any spoiler tags to see this miles ahead.

[De Bourgogne.9642]

@sorudo.9054 said:it's amazing you didn't see this coming, it was so obvious you didn't even need any spoiler tags to see this miles ahead.

@McPero.3287 said:

@Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

@"zealex.9410" said:Sounds disappointing. All that talk of "character death" only to bring her back the nexr episode lul.

thought it was pretty obvious with eating jako.

It was an option they had, but does that mean they have to go with it?

@McPero.3287 said:

@Knuckle Joe.7408 said:Ifd you didn't see it coming you're dumb, dragons absorb magic, and Aurene absorbed an immortal lich's magic. You're missing out on what is probably the best living world episode anet has ever done.

And you missed a gigantic plot hole. Everytime Kralk would kill a magical being he would absorb their energy. So either he absorbs Aurenes magic which stupidly includes Jokos ability to be immortal or he would realise Aurene is not dead and would keep trying to kill her, maybe eat her like she eats Joko. He can definitely sense her magic. There is no explanation to why he would just leave her alive inside the crystals.

[witcher.3197]

@Skynet.7201 said:As far as the immediate resurrection, I disagree. I feel that the gap between episodes gave plenty of time to warrant this to happen.

It's not going to age well at all. Anyone starting the game now will have a 2 minute gap between her dramatic death and random resurrection (and it'd be less if Anet didn't make as walk). Her death had 0 efect on the story, we didn't do anything in that small gap between her death and resurrection.

[Paradoxoglanis.1904]

Ive pretty much always thought the story was mediocre at best. Compared to other mmos like wow, ffxiv, even swtor, the lore, plot, and characters have always felt shallow and boring. The main reason why gw2 has been a good game is because of the combat.

[Gambino.2109]

@Eekasqueak.7850 said:My only complaint about the story is how quick they brought her back, but overall I thought this was a perfect end to this season.

I mean.. considering you had to wrap up the fight with the dragon.. I don't think they had room to squeeze aside some way to bring her back with time invested heavily on it.

The only disappointment was that it was predictable.. but I mean that also makes people feel clever =p

[Aridon.8362]

@McPero.3287 said:When I saw Aurene get resurected in first instance I just Alt+F4 the game. If you are gonna bring her back at least don't do it immediately, what was the point of her dying if she is instantly back. Terrible story telling. You kill a quality villain in the first fight (Joko) and bring back a mute dragon (which yes speaks now) that had no character to it but was just liked by people because it looked cute and shinned. Not sure if I'll even play this episode now maybe if Taimi dies I will. Does she?

Harry Potter was resurrected instantly and people applauded it. The commander was resurrected instantly and nobody said anything. Trahearne was boring and nobody said anything. Scarlett and the entirety of living story season 2 was both cringey and boring and nobody said anything until Lions Arch was destroyed.

But Aurene gets resurrected and people alt+f4? You have to understand that Aurene is like the Guilds Child, it's different because if you actually even bothered to finish the whole story through, you'd see some foreshadowing that she will probably try to kill the ones she loves at some point.

Also if you bothered to play the other stories, Aurene was called the scion for a specific reason, and not appreciated simply because she was cute. The story telling fits perfectly, there are no plot holes like the ones prior to season 4, and you are therefore wrong.

Also Joko a quality villain? Are you serious? The guy had cheesy punchlines and there wasn't a single moment I could take him seriously as a villain.

[Eekasqueak.7850]

@Gambino.2109 said:

@Eekasqueak.7850 said:My only complaint about the story is how quick they brought her back, but overall I thought this was a perfect end to this season.

I mean.. considering you had to wrap up the fight with the dragon.. I don't think they had room to squeeze aside some way to bring her back with time invested heavily on it.

The only disappointment was that it was predictable.. but I mean that also makes people feel clever =p

You're not wrong, they kind of wrote themselves into a corner with having her 'die' in the first place. Maybe it was just for the Jesus parallel though.

[Mickey Frogeater.1470]

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"saye.9304" said:they had to finish the elder dragon story arc after 7 years, although i agree with you they did it, in a lazy way, bringing back aurene fast and finishing crystal dragon in one episode so they can move on to other stuff, it was kinda lazy and bad story telling, but on the other hand i am glad the elder dragon story is basically finished and we might get something new and more interesting in the future, i hope they learn from their mistakes and we get better story telling in the future.Yes, "finishing up loose ends" was the name of the game of the late storytelling at Anet. They managed to write out of the story Lazarus (and the Mursaat in general), Gleam, human gods, Joko, and now are on their way towards sweeping out the dragons. And i did notice how sneakily they've just written out all the god realms people kept asking about (Melandru's realm? Fissure of woe? underworld? It's all empty! Kralky's already eaten everything in those!).

It's like they have a beef with their lore and would rather start a new game...

The only loose end now left after Eternal War is the one that has been exposed by Eternal War: Menzies. His armies are still active in the chunk of the Fissure of Woe(the eastern half it seems) that was turned into a part of the new Elonian island Dragonfall which means he is still active despite Balthazar reclaiming his Eternals. Dhuum is dealt with for good and the Hall of Judgement is secure even if the normal part of the Underworld(which is everything but the Ice Wastes) has been turned into part of a new Elonian island(Dragonfall).

ArenaNet had a big plot concerning Cantha(involving Usoku and Ecclesiate Xun Rao who is called the biggest threat to Cantha) and I'm certain they want to get straight to that big plot as soon as possible! Now that Balthazar and Kralkatorrik is out of the way who better to lead into Cantha than Menzies the Mad? Hopefully Menzies and Ecclesiate Xun Rao/Emperor Usoku are one and the same!

[LucianDK.8615]

I was pretty satisfied by the story, gave fine closure and finally allowing Guild Wars 2 to move past the dragons at long last.

[Poormany.4507]

@Mickey Frogeater.1470 said:

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@"saye.9304" said:they had to finish the elder dragon story arc after 7 years, although i agree with you they did it, in a lazy way, bringing back aurene fast and finishing crystal dragon in one episode so they can move on to other stuff, it was kinda lazy and bad story telling, but on the other hand i am glad the elder dragon story is basically finished and we might get something new and more interesting in the future, i hope they learn from their mistakes and we get better story telling in the future.Yes, "finishing up loose ends" was the name of the game of the late storytelling at Anet. They managed to write out of the story Lazarus (and the Mursaat in general), Gleam, human gods, Joko, and now are on their way towards sweeping out the dragons. And i did notice how sneakily they've just written out all the god realms people kept asking about (Melandru's realm? Fissure of woe? underworld? It's all empty! Kralky's already eaten everything in those!).

It's like they have a beef with their lore and would rather start a new game...

The only loose end now left after Eternal War is the one that has been exposed by Eternal War: Menzies. His armies are still active in the chunk of the Fissure of Woe(the eastern half it seems) that was turned into a part of the new Elonian island Dragonfall which means he is still active despite Balthazar reclaiming his Eternals. Dhuum is dealt with for good and the Hall of Judgement is secure even if the normal part of the Underworld(which is everything but the Ice Wastes) has been turned into part of a new Elonian island(Dragonfall).

Highly doubt Menzies will be a thing in GW2 at this point since he was not mentioned during the entirety of PoF, or if he is he'll just get the Lazarus treatment and be killed off within a few minutes of being introduced. Also hardly anyone knows who Menzies is, so if they wanted to introduce him, they probably would have had him mentioned somewhere in the GW1 or GW2 main storylines.

[Randulf.7614]

@Aridon.8362 said:

@McPero.3287 said:When I saw Aurene get resurected in first instance I just Alt+F4 the game. If you are gonna bring her back at least don't do it immediately, what was the point of her dying if she is instantly back. Terrible story telling. You kill a quality villain in the first fight (Joko) and bring back a mute dragon (which yes speaks now) that had no character to it but was just liked by people because it looked cute and shinned. Not sure if I'll even play this episode now maybe if Taimi dies I will. Does she?

Harry Potter was resurrected instantly and people applauded it. The commander was resurrected instantly and nobody said anything. Trahearne was boring and nobody said anything. Scarlett and the entirety of living story season 2 was both cringey and boring and nobody said anything until Lions Arch was destroyed.

But Aurene gets resurrected and people alt+f4? You have to understand that Aurene is like the Guilds Child, it's different because if you actually even bothered to finish the whole story through, you'd see some foreshadowing that she will probably try to kill the ones she loves at some point.

Also if you bothered to play the other stories, Aurene was called the scion for a specific reason, and not appreciated simply because she was cute. The story telling fits perfectly, there are no plot holes like the ones prior to season 4, and you are therefore wrong.

Also Joko a quality villain? Are you serious? The guy had cheesy punchlines and there wasn't a single moment I could take him seriously as a villain.

Just gonna single out that trahearne and scarlet were complained about pretty much from their beginnings and en masse. Scarlet was esp hated long before the la battle.

[Fremtid.3528]

For me the best part was when Braham said Praise Joko!! A+++

[PirateSpice.8735]

@hugo.4705 said:WASN'T IT STATED TO AVOID KILLING DRAGONS?People keep saying this. You're forgetting that Aurene is the solution to this. Killing Elder Dragons is bad because their power just goes to other Elder Dragons, making them stronger. But the Pact learned that Aurene could absorb Kralk's magic instead. That's why everyone was preparing for the end of the world when they thought she was dead.

[Tiviana.2650]

@Blocki.4931 said:

@Kylden Ar.3724 said:

@McPero.3287 said:

@MMOStein.3872 said:The point was

she never actually died,

that's why they didn't drag out her death waiting for some Ex machina to bring her back.Death to mortals like the commander is a big deal, because it seems like the end. But to a dragon,

it's the end of the beginning.

Death nothing to be afraid of Aurene And Kralk literally say this in the final instance.

Also she ate Joko, what the heck did people actually expect????? This isn't Death Note, not every story has to have some super uber mega plot twist that makes you question your own existence, nor does every story needs to be that convoluted to be good writing. Sometimes people go overboard with speculation when the answer is literally right in front of you. Stop overthinking things. If you want some mind-shattering plot, go read a book, watch a film, or play SP games.

Just because it is a MMO doesn't means bad story telling is acceptable. No reason to encourage mediocrity. They have so far been putting most of their effort into Living Story Episodes, that is why WvW and PvP and such a bad state. I expect at least story to be good if that is their main focus.

Oh and I expected Joko to rip out of Aurenes stomack, since he is immortal and even if cut into pieces he reforms back into full state.

EXACTLY!

If Joko's magic brought her back from THAT kind of damage all fine, then where the kitten is Joko

who pretty much invented that magic!?

Sorry, but what? Joko's body is immortal because of his magic. Dragon eats magic, absorbs that power. Why is her bodily damage too much to revive from? You said it yourself. If Aurene was cut into pieces she would come back from that too.

I think players dont understand that dragons absorb that magic, Joko was drained of it the second she swallowed him.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

Wait wait wait. Hold on. You mean to say you lot have actually paid attention to the shlock they called a story in this game ever since Destiny's Edge and their High-School angst were introduced? Welcome to reality I suppose, the story is not the reason I play this game - the map design on the other hand is superb.

[Zychuu.7294]

@McPero.3287 said:When I saw Aurene get resurected in first instance I just Alt+F4 the game. If you are gonna bring her back at least don't do it immediately, what was the point of her dying if she is instantly back. Terrible story telling. You kill a quality villain in the first fight (Joko) and bring back a mute dragon (which yes speaks now) that had no character to it but was just liked by people because it looked cute and shinned. Not sure if I'll even play this episode now maybe if Taimi dies I will. Does she?

! Unfortunately (for you) she does not

My main problem is that they denied Zojja her part in the god damn fight with THE Kralkatorrik again. Wtf? Nobody remembers original Destiny Edge and how important they were for the story and how that story resolved around fighting Kralkatorrik? Her absence is stupid at this point.

[Anela.3867]

I really enjoyed it

[Astralporing.1957]

@Zychuu.7294 said:My main problem is that they denied Zojja her part in the god kitten fight with THE Kralkatorrik again. kitten? Nobody remembers original Destiny Edge and how important they were for the story and how that story resolved around fighting Kralkatorrik? Her absence is stupid at this point.That one, from what i heard, is due to real world reasons and certain voice actor valuing herself as if she were a first class star.

@Aridon.8362 said:Harry Potter was resurrected instantly and people applauded it....you do remember, that it was a book for the children (or at least a younger audience), right?

The commander was resurrected instantly and nobody said anything.You haven't been paying attention, apparently. There were complains aplenty. And at least that resurrection arc wasn't a snap of fingers, it required a bit of effort on our part.

Trahearne was boring and nobody said anything.

Again, you haven't been paying attention.

Scarlett and the entirety of living story season 2 was both cringey and boring and nobody said anything until Lions Arch was destroyed....and now, you really haven't been paying attention.

But Aurene gets resurrected and people alt+f4? You have to understand that Aurene is like the Guilds Child, it's different because if you actually even bothered to finish the whole story through, you'd see some foreshadowing that she will probably try to kill the ones she loves at some point.

Also if you bothered to play the other stories, Aurene was called the scion for a specific reason, and not appreciated simply because she was cute.Gleam/Vlast was called the same, if you don't remember. That didn't prevent him from getting killed.

The story telling fits perfectly, there are no plot holes like the ones prior to season 4I'd really laugh at this point, except it isn't funny.

@PirateSpice.8735 said:

@"hugo.4705" said:WASN'T IT STATED TO AVOID KILLING DRAGONS?People keep saying this. You're forgetting that Aurene is the solution to this. Killing Elder Dragons is bad because their power just goes to other Elder Dragons, making them stronger. But the Pact learned that Aurene could absorb Kralk's magic instead.And? There's not even a word explaining why it's okay for her to eat magic while it isn't for others. Why her holding a power of several dragons (and more, considering she got also part of balthasar's power, Joko's magic, and all of the immense amount of magic Kralky has eaten in the mists) does not unbalance the world, while it would cause a cascade failure if held by any other dragon.Remember also, that it was stated in this very story that no being could have as much magic as Kralkatorrik did without being tormented and going insane. Why Aurene is suddenly an exception to this is also not explained.

It is a "solution" by handwaving, talking very loudly and hoping noone will notice it all doesn't really add up.

[Aridon.8362]

@Astralporing.1957 said:

@Aridon.8362 said:Harry Potter was resurrected instantly and people applauded it....you do remember, that it was a book for the children (or at least a younger audience), right?

The commander was resurrected instantly and nobody said anything.You haven't been paying attention, apparently. There were complains aplenty. And at least that resurrection arc wasn't a snap of fingers, it required a bit of effort on our part.

Trahearne was boring and nobody said anything.

Again, you haven't been paying attention.

Scarlett and the entirety of living story season 2 was both cringey and boring and nobody said anything until Lions Arch was destroyed....and now, you

really

haven't been paying attention.

But Aurene gets resurrected and people alt+f4? You have to understand that Aurene is like the Guilds Child, it's different because if you actually even bothered to finish the whole story through, you'd see some foreshadowing that she will probably try to kill the ones she loves at some point.

Also if you bothered to play the other stories, Aurene was called the scion for a specific reason, and not appreciated simply because she was cute.Gleam/Vlast was called the same, if you don't remember. That didn't prevent him from getting killed.

The story telling fits perfectly, there are no plot holes like the ones prior to season 4I'd really laugh at this point, except it isn't funny.

@PirateSpice.8735 said:

@"hugo.4705" said:WASN'T IT STATED TO AVOID KILLING DRAGONS?People keep saying this. You're forgetting that Aurene is the solution to this. Killing Elder Dragons is bad because their power just goes to other Elder Dragons, making them stronger. But the Pact learned that Aurene could absorb Kralk's magic instead.And? There's not even a word explaining why it's okay for her to eat magic while it isn't for others. Why her holding a power of several dragons (and more, considering she got also part of balthasar's power, Joko's magic, and all of the immense amount of magic Kralky has eaten in the mists) does not unbalance the world.Remember also, that it was stated in this very story that no being could have as much magic as Kralkatorrik did without being tormented ang going insane. Why Aurene is suddenly an exception to this is also not explained.

It is a "solution" by handwaving and talking very loudly

Kralkatorik was afraid that he would be killed so he fought back, in the process the commander slays 2 dragons so he absorbs their torment, which made him angrier so balthazar came and said he wanted to kill Kralkatorik to prove why he shouldn't have been imprisoned in the mists, and instead the commander kills balthazar and Kralkatorik absorbs balthazars torment because he was imbued with the energy of primordus and jormag. Then the commander goes with Aurene to kill off the torment that was haunting Kralkatorik but because he was so badly wounded he just wanted to end the suffering so you and Aurene end the suffering but at the cost of Kralkatorik's CLEAN energy being absorbed by Aurene.

No plot holes here.

[ChronoPinoyX.7923]

@Aridon.8362 said:The commander was resurrected instantly and nobody said anything. Trahearne was boring and nobody said anything. Scarlett and the entirety of living story season 2 was both cringey and boring and nobody said anything until Lions Arch was destroyed.

For a start, the commander didn't resurrect instantly. We actually had to play the game to get that to happen unlike Aurene where we stood there and literally just watched an instanced dungeon that could have just been cutscene... We didn't fight, heck we didn't even have to do anything like collecting anything (something we actually did when Commander dies).

And both Trahearne and Scarlet had their fair share of people who disliked them. Scarlet moreso than Trahearne from what I remember.

But Aurene gets resurrected and people alt+f4? You have to understand that Aurene is like the Guilds Child, it's different because if you actually even bothered to finish the whole story through, you'd see some foreshadowing that she will probably try to kill the ones she loves at some point.

Aurene getting resurrected isn't the issue, it's already been established that most of us knew this. The problem is the fact that in a single instanced dungeon that lasted a couple of minutes, we get Aurene back. We did absolutely nothing during that instance. When the commander died, we did something like I said before. We watched, we collected, we chased people stealing our identity, we did collection, we killed a fat demon. That was an effort to actually come back to life, Aurene just Paleus Ex Jokona'd us.

Also if you bothered to play the other stories, Aurene was called the scion for a specific reason, and not appreciated simply because she was cute. The story telling fits perfectly, there are no plot holes like the ones prior to season 4, and you are therefore wrong.

The biggest plothole in Season 4 is literally beating at us right now (pun intended for those who already did story). Why is Kralkatorrik part good guy? Zhaitan and Mordremoth both showed personality that are completely centred around their own personal gain but Kralkatorrik is apparently a good guy out of nowhere? If they actually covered any of that your point would have been fine but there was next to nothing covering what Kralkatorrik, or any of the other dragons, were like aside from the fact that they were violent creatures with deadly personalities that screamed narcissism.

I already spoke in another thread about how potential for corruption occurs on Elders but that's a speculation, ANet never covered it in their overall story and lore.

Also Joko a quality villain? Are you serious? The guy had cheesy punchlines and there wasn't a single moment I could take him seriously as a villain.

Except in terms of an actual villain, Joko is a quality villain. His personality might not be as serious as most villains but the way he is built is engaging. He's not just randomly killing things or causing destruction everywhere. He was meticulous, he had plans, he knew how to play the Commander against their senses. Hell he even went as far as to nearly kill Taimi in front of the Commander. Not only that, Joko actually made a legitimate statement about whether or not what we do as the Commander is indeed justifiable. He knew what the Elder Dragons were and we didn't and we just blindly killed two of them because we simply saw them as destructive creatures. Joko literally covered a lot of stuff for being a guy with cheesy punchlines.

[zealex.9410]

@Paradoxoglanis.1904 said:Ive pretty much always thought the story was mediocre at best. Compared to other mmos like wow, ffxiv, even swtor, the lore, plot, and characters have always felt shallow and boring. The main reason why gw2 has been a good game is because of the combat.

Ff14 idk, swtor makes sense since its vasically a story mmo. WoW i dissagree, it has a higher production value for sure but the story as a story and its characters are pretty on par.

[zealex.9410]

The best way i can articulate how i feel about this episode is that it reminds me of ep5 of got se8.

Its believable, i can see how it could happen but it got there too fast, the time in the oven wasnt there.

Yes the ressurection was set up months ago so its not an asspull, but for real, 5 minutes of dead aurene before shes back and kicking?

[Squirrel.6318]

please don't kill taimi, she's carrying the game as it is lol

[Mahou.3924]

@nosleepdemon.1368 said:Wait wait wait. Hold on. You mean to say you lot have actually paid attention to the shlock they called a story in this game ever since Destiny's Edge and their High-School angst were introduced? Welcome to reality I suppose, the story is not the reason I play this game - the map design on the other hand is superb.

Surprise, surprise. Not everyone is you. So yes, some people - complaining or not - do play for the story, despite GW2 being an MMO. Pretty hard to swallow, right?

[Astralporing.1957]

@"Aridon.8362" said:Kralkatorik was afraid that he would be killed so he fought back, in the process the commander slays 2 dragons so he absorbs their torment, which made him angrier so balthazar came and said he wanted to kill Kralkatorik to prove why he shouldn't have been imprisoned in the mists, and instead the commander kills balthazar and Kralkatorik absorbs balthazars torment because he was imbued with the energy of primordus and jormag. Then the commander goes with Aurene to kill off the torment that was haunting Kralkatorik but because he was so badly wounded he just wanted to end the suffering so you and Aurene end the suffering but at the cost of Kralkatorik's CLEAN energy being absorbed by Aurene.

No plot holes here.Let me just cover three plotholes present in what you mentioned (there are a ton more in things you didn't mention, by the way).

1. "Kralkatorik was afraid that he would be killed"oh, really? in this very story he states clearly that no elder dragon is afraid of death and that was never his motivation for acting (although that is pretty much inconsistent with what we've heard before). That one is minor, though, it's the two next ones that are massive.
2. what clean energy? there's no "torment" energy (unless we're talking Abaddon, and as far as we know he wasn't involved). It was stated that he was in torment because he held too much power. Not because it was some wrong kind of power. It's not like the power was somehow inimical to him, but there was so much of it it was tearing him apart. Aurene now holds even more (as she added his power to her), and yet she's perfectly fine.
3. "Clean" energy or not, it moving from Kralky to Aurene didn't address the unbalance that threatens to destroy the world. It's been already explained that the 6 sources of power must be in balance, or the world goes boom. Now we not only have only 4 sources, but those 4 sources are not equal in power. Bubbles has his normal share of Zhaitan and Mordy's powers, Jormag and Primordius are weakened, with part of their power siphoned off to Kralky and then to Aurene, and Aurene has Kralky's normal power, his share of Zhaitan and Mordy's powers, her share of Mordy's powers (notice how the egg also absorbed some), part of Jormag and Primordius powers (some via Kralkatorrik, some siphoned off Balthasar directly), Joko's powers (not so insignificant, if it can let Aurene do things elder dragons can't), and all the stuff Kralky's eaten from the mists.And yet somehow, this all is in perfect balance now? Really?HOW?

It seems to me we are seeing a clear case of Draco Ex Machina. With no explanation whatsoever.