GW2 Isn't made for people that has a real life job.

[Eraden.8740]

3 minutes ago, Mungrul.9358 said:

I like the cut of your jib Buzzbugs 👍

 

You are bang-on when you say that the team will struggle to design maps that are equally challenging for both those with and without the Skyscale.

And keeping up with the meta-train without one is nigh-on impossible. Eraden above saying that bunny and griffon are enough for Dragonfall obviously hasn't tried to keep up with the post-meta boss rush.

 

I have my Skyscale, but I certainly didn't enjoy getting it. I honestly couldn't describe it as anything more than a chore. But GW2 has always been plagued by the kind of design that forces you to replay content until you're so tired of it you never want to play it again.

 

It's a genuine shame, because this game really does have the best gameplay of any MMO or modern "Games as a service" variant I've ever played. That's including WoW, Neocron, Everquest 2, Age of Conan, DC Universe Online, D&D Online, Diablo 3, Black Desert Online, Shroud of the Avatar, The Division 1 & 2 and Destiny 2.

With the possible exception of the original Guild Wars, which was my first MMO.

 

But they strayed from the original games' philosophy, where the grind was initially purely for cosmetics.

Now you have grind for top tier gear stats.

Grind for quality of life improvements that would be free to all in other games, such as swappable stats on gear or build slots.

Grind for mastery points.

And yes, grind for mounts.

 

These are all things that affect your gameplay dramatically, and have definite impacts on how fun or easy you'll find any new content. And despite the protestations of the majority in this thread, they are only available to those (with or without jobs and families) who choose to dedicate all of their free time to Guild Wars 2 and Guild Wars 2 alone.

 

I know, because I am currently held hostage by the game this way myself. I just choose to recognise and acknowledge it.

Most others are uncomfortable admitting that the game holds sway over their lives this way, so will defend the game to the hilt, in a heady combination of buyer's remorse and confirmation bias.

Mungrul, you would be dead wrong. I have done a lot of post-meta boss rushes in Dragonfall, using my bunny. Do I get to every one of them? No, I do not. However, I do get to a fair number of them. Enough to make me happy that I was able to participate in them. It seems like some of you are just not happy unless you are squeezing out every last bit of efficiency out of this game. Almost makes this game seem like a sterile construct to some of you.

[Tiilimon.6094]

What about people who don't grind at all and still have BiS gear and all the mounts?

 

I'm super casual myself, usually play less than 7h/week these days. I even made that legendary harp for fun, didn't really take that much effort either, and I don't even have any characters that use a focus.

[Cuks.8241]

Most of the grind in gw2 is self inflicted.

I would agree that skyscale has become the norm in trains and for me there is an issue because it is a LW mount, so need to buy DLC. As for the collection. Not much of it is grind. Last part, maybe, allthough its much easier now with IBS and eternal ice. 

As for Dragonfall. Griffon is king. 

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

1 hour ago, Buzzbugs.1236 said:

As I've stated in my previous comments, I don't like flying mounts in the game at all. It's got nothing to do with the grinding. But feel free to just ignore what I said, I guess.

I have to wonder why you think this post was directed at you, and not the OP.

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

In Dragonstorm, the latest 'map', I've found using the Skyscale to be slower than the other methods provided by the Devs to get to the different parts of the event(s).

 

Seems like the Devs can create maps that don't favor only those with Skyscales.

[kharmin.7683]

8 hours ago, Clex Mix.7624 said:

 

Here’s the issue with every overtly casual player across all genres. They expect because they do other things than gaming that they’re somehow entitled to get the same things that other people get who play more than them.

 

Please don't paint all of us casual players with such a wide brush.  I am extremely casual, have a job, family and other obligations but do not share in this expectation.  There are things in GW2 (and in life, really) that I will never obtain due to other constraints and I accept that. 

[Rhokaz.1975]

Quote

Before I start I want to say that it is my opinion and I don't care if you don't agree with whatever I am saying and you don't have to read this either.

I do also not care about what you write, I do not expect that you read my comment. I work from morning till evening and have ENOUGH time for guildwars. For Fractals, Raids, Open World, Story. I simply have enough time. Don't see your point. But as you said, we should all have the "I do not care about your opinion"-mentality.

 

Another whine thread....

[Sobx.1758]

11 hours ago, Mortifera.6138 said:

Who said I'm angry? More upset, disappointed, etc.

Imagine being upset over grind in an MMO.  The two literally go together like milk and cookies.

[blackheartgary.8605]

so here's a thing:

i used to be unemployed due to an injury to my back. 

as i healed, i played tons of this game, as well as others.

before i was hurt, i would have time to play, then not have time to play. the game was there when i was able to come back and play some more.

see, i play games for the sake of having fun. to relax. unwind. take a load off. destress from the day-today grind.

and when i have the time, and when my schedule allowed it to, i would do just that. go have fun.

then things changed. 

i lost my place to live, became homeless, fought back, got a place to live, got a job and am also now going to medical school.

my back is healthier.  i feel stronger. and now i have little time to play anything....

BUT

when i do have that time to play anything, i choose to focus on having a good time. escaping. destressing. focusing on fun.  i don't give a rat's kitten if i max out anything, achieve anything collect anything.... i don't care  that i am not the wealthiest of players, the most popular of players....

i don't even care  that i might not get the top tier stats of anything. or stats at all. 

i'm not playing a game for any of that. i am here for a good time, not for a long time.

so, to the OP... i say this.  the real world will always come first. should always come first. handle your business. do you. handle whatever it is that you gotta handle from day to day. i can promise you 2 things.

first, the game will still be here when you are able to play it,

and second, if you play the game to have fun... you will.

period.
 

[Spirit Ritulist.9315]

On 5/13/2021 at 7:19 AM, Blakhart.5024 said:

GW2 has ALWAYS been an extremely grindy game if you actually want to accomplish anything big and saying otherwise is pure hogwash.

Ive played the game since launch, albeit I probably havnt been "active" for around 3 of the last 9 years.  I play casually and havnt been in any big raiding guilds or PvP guilds.  Im currently rank 29 in PvP Arenas and around 50 in WvW.    Ive completed 1 legendary and could, potentially, be close to finishing a second.  Three of my characters have full Ascended Armors, two have completely ascended Armor/Weapons/Accessories.

Do you mean WvW rank 50? That is extremely low that's like telling someone "yeah I play PvE, my mastery level is 15" I went up 30 WvW ranks tonight alone by playing for 4 hours... granted, its a WvW boosted week but even without the boosters I go up that much in a single week without even trying that hard. 

 

You must not of played many MMO's if you think GW2 is a grindfest, GW1 was more of a grindfest than GW2 some of the titles (achievements) in that game require hundreds of hours of grinding per every character you want it on. 

 

Legendaries are suppose to be challenging to craft but even then they can be done with literal no effort. Log on once every day for 20 minutes, do your dailies (to get the 2 gold), do ley-line anomaly (gives a free mystic coin) log out. If you spend the 2 gold on a mystic coin you will make 80 mystic coins per a month and all the T6 mats in laurels you'd ever need. Thats enough to get a season 1 legendary or armor within 3 months and it only takes <20 minutes of effort every day. 

 

I don't know how many hours you have on this game, but I do 4 hours of EASY raids a week for the last year. It has given me enough raid currency to fully buy 3 sets of ascended armor not even counting the sheer number of ascended weapon drops. Or when I ran T4 fractals for 1 hour a day I got plenty of currency to get whatever ascended trinkets I ever needed. 

 

I know this is a casual game, but you actually have to *play* the difficult content if you want the difficult content's rewards. I spend no more than 6 hours in PvE a week, I now have a near full set of legendary armor/trinkets. Rest of my time is in WvW (which gives less rewards than PvE or PvP). Game is not a grindfest, nor is it impossible to play if you have a real life job (buy alt accounts when they go on sale for 50% off, if you log on for 1 minute every day to get daily rewards, each account will give you 20 mystic coins you have a job, you can afford to put 15$ onto this game if you want to skip the grind that badly).

 

Like honestly, posts like these worry me that anet will see one super casual player saying the grind is too much, and then decide they need to hand out rewards for no effort even more.  If this game is too grindy for you, let me do you a favor and say don't bother playing any other MMO, you won't like it. Or alternatively look to see if they have P2W options so you can skip any grind you don't care for. 

[Xanadrine.4352]

I kinda agree with some. I do find by the time I get home I have enough time to do the daily, maybe knock out a DRM or do a few hearts on low levels. It really is harder to keep up in this game when you work, have a property to take care of and or kids. But that would be the same with any MMORPG, I think thats why we see the rise of mobile games. They allow for short bursts of slim down gaming, if you can call it that. Personally I despise mobile games, to me that isnt anything I would invest in, its like ADHD disorder of gaming. I still prefer the vast amount of content and things to do in MMORPG's, it just takes me a long time to get things done because I have to do them in small time allotments. But I would never want to see the demise of the MMORPG, its a truly magical world to play in.

[Clex Mix.7624]

4 hours ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Please don't paint all of us casual players with such a wide brush.  I am extremely casual, have a job, family and other obligations but do not share in this expectation.  There are things in GW2 (and in life, really) that I will never obtain due to other constraints and I accept that. 

Hence the word “overtly”. You don’t go out of your way to announce it to the world. You don’t use it as an excuse to complain about not having things.

[Clex Mix.7624]

On 5/13/2021 at 6:19 AM, Blakhart.5024 said:

I think the people ignoring this complaint are being a bit obtuse.

I have found the same thing.

Try doing a Legendary on a "casual" timeframe lol  when you need X hundred Obs shards, mystic clovers and other materials you only get from really grinding out certain aspects of the game.

Silverwastes Runs are productive but do them for a week straight and you wont feel like youre having "fun"


GW2 has ALWAYS been an extremely grindy game if you actually want to accomplish anything big and saying otherwise is pure hogwash.

Ive played the game since launch, albeit I probably havnt been "active" for around 3 of the last 9 years.  I play casually and havnt been in any big raiding guilds or PvP guilds.  Im currently rank 29 in PvP Arenas and around 50 in WvW.    Ive completed 1 legendary and could, potentially, be close to finishing a second.  Three of my characters have full Ascended Armors, two have completely ascended Armor/Weapons/Accessories.

I havnt finished my skyscale as im still acquiring the 250 stones for each zone for the saddle.  A project I have focused my gametime on the last 2 months and still havnt completed yet.

Im not complaining about the game myself.  Anymore.  I certainly bished about it during my first Legendary.  The collection bits were fun but the final grindy bits for the Mystic Forge are simply ridiculous.  But it is what it is.  But call it what it is please.  Its a grindfest.  Dont sugarcoat it with your fanciful notions.

Legendary gear is literally the same stats as ascended. They won’t magically make people better players. They are designed to be a long term goal, not an instant reward for playing the game. They’ve always been designed as such.

 

The 250 zone mats are easier than most people think. Do the hearts and buy the 5 from each heart each reset.... or whenever you play. If you have a couple level 80’s just focus on one zone at a time doing it that way. 

 

Obsidian shards are easy to get. If you don’t want to use karma on them and you don’t need the trinkets from bitterfrost fronteir, farm winter berries and consume them for the unbound magic and buy shards that way. The farm takes 5 minutes. You can get 40-50 winterberries per character a day, they give 20-30 unbound magic a piece. Let’s say that averages out to 1125 unbound magic (not including the magic gained from farming the nodes) 1 obsidian shard cost 100 magic and 96c. That’s any easy 11 a day per character. 77 a week per character for 5 mins a day. 

 

Don’t blame your time management or your lack of understanding of the game’s systems on it being a grind fest.

[Clex Mix.7624]

1 hour ago, Spirit Ritulist.9315 said:

 

 

You must not of played many MMO's if you think GW2 is a grindfest, GW1 was more of a grindfest than GW2 some of the titles (achievements) in that game require hundreds of hours of grinding per every character you want it on. 

I think the only character specific titles that took a while was party animal/kind of a big deal. All the eotn ranks were fairly easy, though yes still took some time.

mayybe skill hunter if you were doing that solo? 

 

But yeah, kind of a big deal on it’s own was pretty insane, especially if you did it before the presearing “revamp” with the added quests, back when you had to death farm the char.

[Yakuzai.6593]

Regarding the content of your topic, it is like the top comment says - thats why there are guides 

But regarding the topic title "isnt made for ppl with a job /real life" i can actually understand you pretty good. One of the core contents which is linked to most of the progresses are meta events. But if u just wanna randomly log in after a good day of work, often you simply can not do those events because they are heavily time gated. If youre unlucky, that event just ended and you would have to wait another 2 (!!!!) hours to participate at that event again but actually you just wanted to play 2 hours at most and go to bed after that so another "useless log in session" in which you didnt make any progress with a goal of yours. It is somehow "wasted time" because one of the most motivating things in games like this are goals.  But if you cant make progress to your goals it is wasted time. 

[Stalkingwolf.6035]

it depends on you want to do. get shinys? GW2 ist Grind Wars. Want to play the storie and have fun doing minor things? its easy and rewarding. Yes skyscale is a lot of work but you dont need the mount. i have it and never use it.

[Conncept.7638]

On 5/8/2021 at 4:21 PM, Dawdler.8521 said:

... this is why people use guides. 

 

But hey, if you dont have time, you dont have time. I fail to see the point of calling others kids or unemployed just because you are frustrated though.

Guides should be optional, needing them to complete content is a sign of kitten poor game design.

 

A good game is no different than a good book or movie, if you have to go outside of the body of material just to understand it, the body of material is not well made.

[Ayrilana.1396]

15 hours ago, Buzzbugs.1236 said:

The Skyscale is not optional. It's going to be hugely relevant to have a Skyscale for EoD. Anet are going to be designing maps and events with the flying capabilities of Skyscales in mind. They are not going to hamstring their game design by creating encounters that can be completed equally well by flying mounts and ground mounts. It's unrealistic.

 

Players are going to fall behind if they don't have a Skyscale. How can you keep a straight face when you say they are optional? It's like telling someone they don't need Exotic stats or amulets to play the toughest content... it's dishonest. The player is going to have a very hard time trying to do PoF content while wearing Rare stats and no amulets.

 

I'm willing to bet 1000 gold there will be areas and events in EoD that either require a Skyscale, or at the very least favor having a Skyscale. Now that they exist in the game, A-net have to apply that to all of their designs going forward.

 

Put yourself in the shoes of a designer. How do you design content that is challenging for a player who has X Y and Z mobility but at the same time, keep a player who can only travel on the ground able to complete said content with similar challenge? Have a think about that and get back to me, I want to hear your solution.

 

My solution would have been not to put flying mounts in the game in the first place but it's too late for that. Now we're repeating the same mistake other games already made before. The temptation to sell Dragon flying mount skins in the Gemstore took a higher priority. Now the rest of the game suffers.

 

PoF wasn't designed with gliding in mind so there's no reason to expect Cantha would be any different.

 

Skyscale is an optional mount as its not required for anything but a few achievements and a legendary accessory. 

 

Also, addressing something you mentioned in an earlier post, skyscale is not a flying mount like in WoW.  Freeflying doesn't exist in this game.  Yes you can do something with the griffon swoop but it's impractical to use.

Edited May 15, 2021 by Ayrilana.1396

[Linken.6345]

44 minutes ago, Conncept.7638 said:

Guides should be optional, needing them to complete content is a sign of kitten poor game design.

 

A good game is no different than a good book or movie, if you have to go outside of the body of material just to understand it, the body of material is not well made.

It saves time something the OP had very little off, not needed at all to use guides.

[Ashen.2907]

On 5/12/2021 at 9:02 PM, Obtena.7952 said:

If anything, the Skyscale is exactly tailored to people who "have real life jobs" because of the fact that it is time throttled and it has many parts that you can complete in small segments of time over numerous days. The complaint is just doesn't make sense. The Skyscale quest is actually disliked MORE by people that want to pound out a quest in quick succession. 

Solid point.

[Sobx.1758]

15 hours ago, Buzzbugs.1236 said:

The Skyscale is not optional. It's going to be hugely relevant to have a Skyscale for EoD. Anet are going to be designing maps and events with the flying capabilities of Skyscales in mind. They are not going to hamstring their game design by creating encounters that can be completed equally well by flying mounts and ground mounts. It's unrealistic.

It is optional and you're basing your whole "it's not optional" claim on content that's not released yet, that we have no information about and that YOU have just decided will definitely make the skyscale obligatory for some reason. For now, that's just simply false and you base your opinion on absolutely nothing.

 

 

 

Edited May 15, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[Zephire.8049]

It should also be noted that Grothmar, Bjora, and Drizzlewood all came out after the Skyscale but you can move around them just fine without. In fact, the skyscale is slower in Grothmar and Drizzlewood than other mounts and unless you have endurance or stealth off cooldown, you will absolutely get sniped out of the sky by snipers.

 

Also Grothmar heavily favours the raptor, beetle, and jackal given how flat it is.

 

Really, the skyscale is more "I don't feel like swapping mounts so I'm fine going slower" than "this mount invalidates all other content. So it's weird to assume that the skyscale will invalidate EoD maps when we have three maps (four if you count Dragonstorm) that prove that doesn't have to be the case.

[lezbefriends.7516]

8 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Imagine being upset over grind in an MMO.  The two literally go together like milk and cookies.

I’m not upset over grind, I’m upset over the manner of grind...

[Sobx.1758]

11 minutes ago, Mortifera.6138 said:

I’m not upset over grind, I’m upset over the manner of grind...

All I know when someone said you're "mad about grind", the only thing you've corrected was "not mad, more like upset" after initially stating that "Everything since War Eternal has brought stupid grind to the game. This is not the Guild Wars 2 I fell in love with. ".  So what was the grind you liked if it's not about the grind itself but just "the manner of grind"?

 

 

Edited May 15, 2021 by Sobx.1758

[Conncept.7638]

On 5/15/2021 at 1:47 PM, Linken.6345 said:

It saves time something the OP had very little off, not needed at all to use guides.

If you can't do it in a reasonable amount of time without guides, then the guide is necessary. 

 

To continue my analogy, if you watched the same badly written movie or read the same badly written book enough times, your understanding of it would grow regardless of its failings as a work, but that doesn't change how badly written either one is.

 

Extra time and effort spent on content should bear extra insight into the content, not mere baseline understanding.

 

EDIT: Pardon me, I meant without.

Edited May 16, 2021 by Conncept.7638