Jump to content
  • Sign Up

February 14 Balance Update Preview


Rubi Bayer.8493

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Dr Meta.3158 said:

This was during early lockdown when I could only work half time on site and half time just meetings at home so got to play around with some builds. That last boss was far and beyond harder than anything else in the dungeons across the board but it was doable on reaper but much easier to do on renegade or herald.. Now, I don't think so. Maybe on herald, maybe.

I'm sure I can solo it if I try really hard. After all, I've been soloing content that was supposed to be unsoloable since GW1. However, I'm trying to point to the fact that other professions can literally face-tank this kind of bosses and still deal way more damage than Necro/Reaper.

either they boost our damage to 50k or give us real sustain because right now, we have none.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Really minor but: for Berserker getting the "end Berserk mode" button, is it getting a tiny cooldown to prevent you from mashing F2 -> Enter Berserk -> whoops accidentally instantly exited Berserk?  Y'know, like with Spectre's Shadow Shroud, which you fixed in the Nov 29 2022 update?  Just asking as a thief main/warrior 2ndary who doesn't wanna get hit with the same problem twice in a row XD

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey CMC, Roy Roy Marks, and other related developers. Hope you guys have a good weekend and don't drown in feedback.

So I have some thoughts about the guardian changes proposed here, although overall I like a lot of what I see. I like seeing Hammer getting adjustments to improve its overall playstyle, as it has been severely underused for years. I like seeing sword and greatsword buffs as it means more damage for the damage dealing builds, and it does even benefit condi willbender, especially when paired with the changes to willbender virtues. I certainly love seeing buffs to dragonhunter, although I still believe that the F3 even at a 50 second cooldown is still slightly too long for a virtue that is intended to be used more actively. 

My big question is about Offhand Sword. Offhand sword was introduced as the willbender specific weapon but has been regarded as very weak for use in PvE. I'll grant you that it has good performance in competitive environments, but I don't think that it's good for an elite spec weapon to be PvP only. With the buffs to focus coming in this patch it seems like power willbenders are being told that focus is just superior to offhand sword in every way except mobility, and willbender already has plenty of other tools for that. When can we expect offhand sword to be brought in line with the other stronger guardian offhand weapons? 


Regarding mantras, I originally thought we were back to the age old problem of never using the final charge on a mantra, but doing the math it seems like with 70% quickness duration on a condi quickbrand you get 17 seconds of quickness just from expending all three charges of potence. With a 20 second cooldown and a 2.25 second cast time (before alacrity) you need only 6 seconds from another source to have perfect quickness uptime. Assuming my math is sound that actually means that for potence the best thing to do is to spam every charge out. the same thing seemingly applies to flame mantra. mantra of solace, lore, and liberation however you would certainly want to be strategic on using their final charge, and using mantra of solace's final charge comes at a very heavy price for any quickness support build as it means getting an emergency aegis but hurts your quickness uptime if running liberator's vow (which, as far as I know, every quickness support is doing). But then, if you have alacrity and 70% quickness duration you should be able to use liberator's vow and one charge of potence to get 7.75 seconds of quickness every 7ish seconds so there's actually no need to use the final charge for potence at all in an ideal scenario. So... actually, yeah, at least for the two most commonly used mantras it seems like the design goal is being met. It does however mean that the final charge on solace is now an emergency button, which I guess is the intended purpose.

So with all of that that said and assuming that I am understanding this correctly, I guess I'm scratching my head a bit at adding the page refresh to weighty terms. It's already the best trait for support builds in PVE and will continue to be used by firebrands solely for the sake of using mantras as often as possible for boon upkeep. A one page refund from using the final charge of a mantra feels kind of tacked on as a "sure, why not". Which I guess isn't a problem, and certainly I won't say no to a page refund, but it does make me feel like Stalwart Speed is going to be increasingly neglected in PvE. I suspect that trait will need to be visited down the line because its competing traits are just going to be that much stronger than it after this patch goes live. 

Anyways, that's my ramble about the guardian changes based on what we've seen at the moment. I think some of the mantra final charges could be adjusted a little more to make using them feel more enticing rather than just tacking on a page refresh. Also the swiftness on the final charge of mantra of liberation feels oddly short. I'm sure there will continue to be much discussion about Firebrand going forward anyways so we'll see where things end up in the Spring.

Please buff offhand sword in PvE. The six willbender mains will thank you for it.

  • Like 5
  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, charles.9052 said:

Willbender virtues no longer remove the active effects of other willbender virtues.

Also in pvp and wvw?are you serious?

The lack of splitting between spvp and wvw over all in this patch is very disturbing.

I do not understand the conaj wepon nerfs in wvw at all same with cantrips nerfs. Even the scepter nerfs in wvw seem out of places for the game type.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nothing here I would outright complain about. Couple of missed opportunities though:

  1. Similarly to how Firebrand had busted tome activations (hence the addition of a cooldown), Facet of Nature has the same problem. It's really easy to screw up your quickness output on quick herald because it instantly deactivates itself on activation. The introduction of a short cooldown on it would fix this.
  2. When is the Untamed rework (Fervent Force) going to happen? It's still in the state where it theoretically works in PvE, except against half the bosses in the game in practice because getting FF to trigger consistently is a pain. It's not really in a good state, so it feels like a good time to rip off the band-aid and just rebuild it.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

changes looks good at first shot. I am still concerned about not enough change to ele sceptor in spvp.

 

The core issue not being addressed is the unending burning from the attack chains. The spamming of this condition cannot be removed fast enough with most builds and burning itself is one of the most powerful conditions for dmg. The duration should be reduced and it should not be as available on so many skills off low cooldown that fresh air offers.

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
  • Confused 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey Roy!
The main thing I'd like to see added is a fix to Rangers Signet of Renewal while you are doing a pass at it.
The condition cleanse portion of the skill does not work if your pet is not within 600 units of you, but the skill does NOT show if you are within range of your pet (it doesn't have the red bar underneath if your pet is out of range). 
This results in frequent uses of the skill in pvp where you thought pet was in range -> use skill -> doesnt cure conditions -> die -> respawn with skill still on cooldown.
Ideally I'd love to see that range requirement just removed. I don't know of any other skill with a similar restriction.

Seperate from that issue, you mentioned firebrands respawning from death with full pages. Can druids respawn with full astral power?

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 2/2/2023 at 5:19 PM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Reaper

  • Augury of Death: This trait no longer reduces the recharge of shout skills.
  • "Your Soul is Mine!": This skill now deals additional damage and grants additional life force per target struck within melee range of the caster. Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds.
  • "Nothing Can Save You!": This skill no longer grants additional unblockable attacks on all enemies struck. This skill now deals additional damage and grants additional unblockable attacks when striking targets within melee range of the caster. Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds.
  • "Rise!": This skill now deals additional damage and summons additional horrors when striking targets within melee range of the caster. The maximum number of shambling horrors that can be summoned is 5. Reduced cooldown from 40 seconds to 32 seconds.
  • "Suffer!": This skill now deals additional damage and transfers one additional condition to targets struck within melee range of the caster. Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds.
  • "You Are All Weaklings!": This skill now deals additional damage and grants more might when striking targets within melee range of the caster. Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 20 seconds.
  • "Chilled to the Bone!": This skill now deals additional damage, stun, and condition duration, and grants you additional boons when striking targets within melee range of the caster. Reduced cooldown from 45 seconds to 36 seconds.

Are you trolling us? Don't get me wrong, cd reduction being baseline is kind of nice. But you said you wanted to make shouts stronger in melee range. For the most part, you made them do what they already currently do but limited it to melee range only. I mean, if anything, all you did was nerf Reaper Shouts that hit targets outside of melee range. This is a joke right?

Edit: After looking further into the changes, I may have jumped to conclusions and read this wrong. It appears the only shout that is losing functionality outside of melee range is "Nothing Can Save You!". 

It appears that all of the cooldowns have been set at the cooldown the skill would of had if you took the trait and hit two enemies. So this is only a nerf for your build if you are taking the trait currently and always hitting 3+ enemies.

I will say though, this leaves the Augury of Death trait in shambles. I mean, the only thing it will do now is add a bit of health siphon to shouts. Now, both Augury of Death and Relentless Pursuit feel kind of week compared to Chilling Nova. It would be nice to see some better options for Reaper Adept traits in the future.

Edited by Shaogin.2679
  • Like 5
  • Thanks 4
  • Confused 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Deadeye:

  • "Shadow Meld: This skill no longer removes revealed in PvP and WvW."

The whole purpose of this skill is to remove revealed and get back to your rotation... Maybe make ammo count to 1 instead of 2 similar how you did with shout warrior "Shake it off".

As now any class can apply revealed debuff and stack it BACK TO BACK on a deadeye thief to kill it, shodow meld provided a counter to revealed spamming...

Maybe unify all revealed effect of all classes to 4 sec and NO ability to stack them back to back ... then removal of shadow meld will be justified and balanced. (Other wise each deadeye thief will need to memorize all classes revealed effect duration.... to counter them..).

As this just make revealed = Back to back chains of revealed = K.O with almost 0 counter play.

Edited by xlalax.4821
  • Like 7
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, charles.9052 said:

Willbender virtues no longer remove the active effects of other willbender virtues.

Also in pvp and wvw?are you serious?


The willbender, at least in WvW only needed nerfs, and instead only got buffs, indirectly also to mobility (Which already has tons) with Whirling Wrath. 
 

Maybe the devs are dragonball fans and won't stop until the roam is populated by just willbenders who keep Blink > Burst > Block > Dash > Blink > Burst > Block > Leap > *Repeat* .
 

While random elementalists keep pumping up their auras and dropping energy bombs
 

And finally the rangers arrive:
"Guys, no need to fight! I mean, you guys don't need to fight"
*start immobilization spam*

IDK 

Edited by Greviathan.6107
  • Like 4
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hello, here are my two cents on the PvE pReaper changes:

Once again, buffing a weapon that no one uses and buffing traits that are competing with already good traits is not the most productive way to make this class relevant. Other specs are hitting much, much higher numbers, we're *still* uncomfortably close to boon givers and we're *still* required to be melee and avoid all damage to not lose DPS. This is *still* not a tanky spec. You tank damage, you lose all your damage. That's not useful in any end game content aka the only place where balance actually matters. Something like virtuoso is so much tankier, more mobile and fully ranged but I'm sounding like a broken record at this stage.

 

About the dagger buffs: Cool to see it get something but it's not going to be an option because it still is very much a terrible choice. A full staff loop currently takes around 1950ms and has an overall coefficient of 7.62. A dagger "loop" using 2 and 3 will take around 2000ms assuming you cancel the aftercast of both skills and have an overall coefficient of 6.45. An auto chain is 3.1 with a cast time of 1400ms. Dagger won't replace staff, but what about greatsword? A full GS loop above 50% is currently 5700ms long with an overall coefficient of 18.9. This is ignoring the benefits of nightfall hitting in shroud and gaining in value. This is also ignoring the huge buff greatsword gets below 50% when gravedigger can replace the auto attack chain. A dagger loop of that length would be : 2->3-> 2 aa chains->auto 1->auto 2. That'll end up taking 5500ms for a total coefficient of 14.45. These dagger buffs, while nice, are not going to do *anything* for power reaper.

The warhorn buffs are quite funny given how laughably useless the two skills are. They do nothing for you and the only reason you'd take it is because *ALL* power necromancer off hand weapons are beyond useless. Focus is simply never going to be good if it still requires to strip boons to do damage, that's just too unreliable and rare and you're left with, well, nothing really.

 

About the shouts buffs: I really REALLY hope the changes are going to affect the shouts baseline, without having to pick the trait. Why would you buff a trait (chilling nova) then next patch buff a new traits competing with it to make very largely useless skills less useless. I do realize it's very probably going to be the effect of the trait to buff shouts but in this case, you'll lose 800 dps on the bench that'll need to be compensated first by the trait before any DPS can be gained from taking it. If it does end up being a baseline characteristic of the shouts, the best one is currently You are all Weaklings and contributes around 700 dps. In the unlikely event that these changes double the shouts damage, this will be no more than a 700 dps increase, making this the biggest and only buff reaper gets this patch.

 

It's overall very disappointing to see so many other classes getting huge buffs while reaper is left there getting way too conservative changes. These won't make reaper a decent option. Everything else will be better, as is the case now. I do not understand why buffing it in a meaningful way is so hard or scary. It's melee and can't tank damage without losing a lot. It's the basic definition of a glass cannon with a different flavour and a more new player friendly playstyle that still leaves room for improvement. There is nothing inherently wrong with it being a strong class.

 

To not end on a gloomy note here are the things I would change ranging from realistic to complete delusion:

 

-Buff shroud damage. Seriously, reaper does NOT have strong burst. Compared to a real class it's, like, almost half of what they peak to. Buffing shroud would let you raise the bench while raising the need to avoid damage to fully benefit from the added damage.

-Buff Chilled to the Bone to be a real elite skill and not the absolute farce it still is. It's been completely irrelevant since reaper came out with it's stupidly long cooldown, now it's still irrelevant due to it's goofy cast time. If it absolutely needs to take this long to cast double its damage or something, go ham it's a 3 coeff while literal utility skill Well of Suffering is comfortably sitting at 6 with a shorter cooldown, shorter cast time and can benefit from shroud multiplier. Come on make it a real elite skill.

-Buff axe/warhorn/focus to be viable options. Axe used to be better than staff and it was arguably more fun to use than staff which is the most boring and bland weapon in the game out of all the professions, one skill copy and pasted 4 times is kind of outdated design, and I am still to meet a reaper player who thinks staff is more fun than axe was. Making axe good would be nice if accompanied with *meaningful* warhorn/focus buffs. I would probably say focus and just swap the condition to do more damage if the target has no boons instead then tweak the numbers to make it a valuable offhand in PvE instead of a WvW/PvP exclusive.

-Rework a couple traits that simply don't do anything useful, such as death's embrace and other underwhelming options.

-Rework staff, make it a weapon up to today's standards like the old guardian staff rework or the engi rifle rework. I'm biased because I don't play competitive gamemode that much but I have a hard time believing these gamemodes would suffer as greatly to have such an outdated weapon reworked as PvE is to have it be so bland.

-Rework Lich Form. Make it another good elite skill. It's super niche right now and you only use it for one of its skills, ONLY when you can precast it. Everything else about it is outdated. Extra long cast time on both the activation and the skill in question, extremely long cooldown for no reason, an okay auto attack but you're still losing damage if you stick around in it so it's worthless, it deserves an overhaul such as making it have a very fast cast time, much shorter cooldown and better skills inside it. I understand it's another competitive gamemode skill but you can atleast change around cooldowns and cast times between gamemodes...

 

I really do hope we get more for Power Reaper in PvE this patch. It's time to stop throwing the old "it's got two healthbar" argument around and start making good changes for the class. Let Necromancer have at least one good power build, it currently doesn't.

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

elementalist staff changes are an improvement,  but i sill think Static Field needs to be buffed: increase it's AoE size, and pulse daze (like a well) for guaranteed daze / damage on enemies within the field. the skill currently has very little reward for very high risk (it's easy for the target to stand still while in the field, or avoid the field entirely while outside it, and the skill doesn't affect the target.) another option would be to change the animation to a Tesla Ball that pulses daze + damages foes that are dazed. (i say daze, but it may be a stun... i don't remember because i never use the skill because it's bad and clunky to hit, like the pre-change gust)

 

Also, earth 4 should drop a poison field and earth 5 should be a projectile to interact with the field. (yes, earth 1 would also interact with the field.), since earth is supposed to be the condition element, but only applies bleed as a damaging condition. YES, Poison would also fit the theme of Staff as a support weapon since it reduces incoming healing of enemies, just as weakness reduces their damage output.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, HotDelirium.7984 said:

Ele- can you clarify that the conjure cooldown removal also means conjures are getting refunded some cooldown?

Cat- please still look into optimizing jade orb energy vs cooldown and the tough way of maintaining elemental empowerment at 10 stacks. Also, PLEASE give us a jade orb mini ❤️

It looks like that removing Conjure wepon cdr -% on the trait is talking about the conjaure wepon skill cdr effect but with no added effect. Its just gives the fire aura and nothing more. So its a blunt nerf to conja weapons in all game types for builds that did run the cdr.

At the same time it seems the cantrips cdr is being removed so the cd on conatrips will not get redcused unless they started for that given game type see lighting flash being 20 sec cd in pve but in the other spvp and wvw game type saying 35 sec. This is also another major nerf over all.

These are massive nerf to skills that are often not even use. They seem wildly out of places and only partly though out.  They are such massive nerfs to wvw ele game play that was out side of the meta.

This NEEDS clarification badly.

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The dagger on necromancer even with this tiny buff is still underperforming so much, that there is no use of ever wielding a dagger in main weapon slot unless you kid around while leveling. 
You need to make Dagger the closerange weapon with insane attack speeds and maybe stack conditions, instead of this "life force" generation which is no a problem for most experienced necromancers anyway. 

I could see people use the dagger main IF it had conditions, maybe some bleeding on the first hit, poison on the second hit and both of those and chill for 1 second on the third hit. 
Making it the close combat variant of the "new" elementalist scepter in terms of speed. Something that has synergy with condition build across the different elite specs. Change the Life Siphon aswell, making it deal less power damage and more about the crit which Condi necromancer is focusing on (traitline wise) so that if Life Siphon crits, it deals an additional stack of a condition (randomly between poison, bleed or torment) would make sense. 

This is how the elite specs would benefit:

Reaper with Deathly chills will have a superior melee weapon which deals conditions and chills for the Deathly chill proc every 3rd time. 
Scourge would have the melee weapon it always wanted with its Shroud ability which is more of a melee tool anyway, along with some sustain from Life Siphon. 
Harbinger would like the Scourge, get a melee focused weapon which functions as helping sustain with Life Siphon and with Doom Approaches (the grandmaster trait which deals torment to enemies in close proximity) 

SOMETHING has to happened to main hand dagger on necro as its utterly underwhelming for any build. 
And since Axe is mostly an extremely well crafted power weapon which functions in both close and ranged proximity, why have dagger be the "power" melee weapon of necro when any with the Heart of Thorns expansion would just use Greatsword on reaper as its far better than ever using dagger. 
 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just for the thief since I know it best, specifically for PvE. I'll go over the actual listed changes as opposed to wishes in the future *cough*acrobatic rework*cough*

  • Signets of Power: This trait has been reworked. It now causes signet skills to grant initiative when activated.

How much initiative? If it is only 1 or 2, it's worthless because it competes with Twin Fang. Twin Fang is a whole other can of worms I won't get into.

  • Signet of Malice: Reduced cooldown from 15 seconds to 12 seconds.
  • Signet of Shadows: Reduced cooldown from 20 seconds to 16 seconds.
  • Infiltrator's Signet: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds in PvE, and from 35 seconds to 28 seconds in PvP and WvW.

Nice to have CDR on underused signets.

  • Trickster: This trait no longer reduces the cooldown of trick skills. Increased the number of conditions removed from 1 to 2.
  • Caltrops: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds.
  • Haste: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 24 seconds in PvE, and from 45 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW.
  • Roll for Initiative: Reduced cooldown from 35 seconds to 28 seconds in PvE, and from 50 seconds to 35 seconds in PvP and WvW. Reduced initiative gain from 6 to 4 in PvP and WvW.

Nice to have. The nerf to RfI in pvp/wvw is strange given the repeated spikes in initiative costs. Perhaps only 5? I haven't PvPed on Thief in a long time because of the constant nerfs. 🙃

  • Skelk Venom: Reduced cooldown from 30 seconds to 25 seconds.

I'm glad this one is getting looked at. That cast time is unfun though, but I get why it's there.

  • Keen Observer: Reduced health threshold requirement from 90% to 75% in PvE only.

Best change in the entire patch. Thief is in dire need of QoL changes.  Will help immensely for power builds, especially crit dependent deadeye. I wish Twin Fang got the same love.

  • Steal is no longer replaced by Swipe when the daredevil specialization is equipped.

So glad this is back. I miss the range; elite spec tradeoffs were a terrible idea.  I'm assuming the unblockable in PvP is leaving. It is a rather hefty nerf to DD.

  • Impairing Daggers: Reduced cooldown from 25 seconds to 18 seconds.

Most likely a dps increase over devour venom on cDD. With alac this skill will be very spammy in rotation, but I'm fine with that.

  • Impact Strike: Reduced cooldown from 40 seconds to 30 seconds.

It's funny trying to make Impact Strike more appealing to use.😆 Basi Venom is just too good to drop for CC.  The cast times outside of the final chain are atrocious.

  • Deadeye's Mark is no longer removed when the deadeye goes into the downed state.

Nerf after nerf, this needed to happen a long time ago. It was way too punishing. Nice to see it's finally here.

  • Shadow Meld: This skill no longer removes revealed in PvP and WvW.

Biggest red flag in the patch.  This is not worthy of an elite skill anymore.  Sic'em Soulbeast is now able to effortlessly destroy a DE in WvW, which is very poor balancing.  Combined with stealth denial everywhere, DE is going to be in a really rough spot in Pvp/wvw.

  • Shadow Sap: The enemy-targeted version of this skill now grants might in an area around the specter. The ally-targeted version of this skill now grants protection.

How much might and for how long?  Heal specter is still a meme, not as much now I guess, but being slightly less of a meme still makes you a meme.

 

Overall good changes save for some PvP nerfs.  Thief is slowly getting to a better place. Maybe I'll make a post about wishes for future changes later. Please save acrobatics.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 2/3/2023 at 3:19 AM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Core

  • Master of Manipulation: This trait no longer reduces the recharge of manipulation skills, and it now grants aegis to nearby allies instead of superspeed.

You deleted MoM, but where the hell is compensation for BLINK cd that wont get ever reduced ???????????????? 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 2/3/2023 at 8:19 AM, Rubi Bayer.8493 said:

Mesmer mantras now require an initial casting time to prepare the mantra charges. The effects they grant when completing the initial cast are as follows:

  • Mantra of Recovery: Heal yourself, and heal nearby allies for a lesser amount.
  • Mantra of Concentration: Grant boons to yourself and nearby allies.
  • Mantra of Distraction: Reduce the recharge time of Diversion.
  • Mantra of Pain: Grant might to yourself and nearby allies.
  • Mantra of Resolve: Remove all conditions from yourself, and remove fewer conditions from nearby allies.

This is all amazing. I really enjoyed the previous iteration of mantras! Glad to see that you had the courage to revert this change. Really good stuff there ANET!

Just hope you can consider changing one of the 2 power focused master traits in chrono. I would love to see if one of them were made to be more support-y. I would generally prefer the "danger time" trait to be reworked as it feels too dependent on a condition (slow) that is quite hard to come by making it quite inconsistent. Just my thoughts!

Overall, can't wait to try out these changes! 

P.S I love the old (and now upcoming) voice line when casting mantra of pain:

"Agony! Torment! Pain!" (Scream noise)

Edited by FaeriFrie.1827
Alignment stuffs
  • Confused 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...