What makes celestial armor so good?

[Sewedir.3027]

It has a lot of prefixes but from my experience if Gear doesn't specialize doesn't it mean that is rather mediocre?

Gear that has only 3 attributes has double the amount of stats values.

Isn't it better to have a higher number of given stats than larger stats overall?

Thanks for the info,

Cheers

 

[Chiral.8915]

Hybrid stats are great in competitive modes, particularly in WvW and great in open world "solo" mode. It's mediocre for most builds in instanced PVE.

In WvW, celestial has a good combination of...everything. Defense, offense, boon duration, etc. That makes it hard to kill. In instanced PVE, you're better off with more defined stats for each role. More DPS stats to kill faster, more heal/concentration stats to boon and keep people alive better. 

[LuRkEr.9462]

Celestial is mainly for a jack of all trades build where you want damage, sustain, and boons. You won't be the best at any of them though. 

In PvE celestial healbrand is a thing in fractals, outside of that its a staple of most of the "solo hard content" builds. 

In WvW its a pretty common roamer armor because it gives everything, power and condi burst along with defense and boon duration.

[Sobx.1758]

21 minutes ago, Sewedir.3027 said:

It has a lot of prefixes but from my experience if Gear doesn't specialize doesn't it mean that is rather mediocre?

Gear that has only 3 attributes has double the amount of stats values.

Total amount of stats added by celestial gear is greater than any other gear. If you can make use of most/all of the stats you get, it makes for a resonable mix of offence/defense/support.

21 minutes ago, Sewedir.3027 said:

Isn't it better to have a higher number of given stats than larger stats overall?

Depends what you want to do.

As far as the numbers go, berserker chest piece sums up to 343 stats in total. Trailblazer 376.  Celestial 603. It's not highly specialized, but it's a substantial bulk of stats.

Edited July 10, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Danikat.8537]

The important thing is to have stats that match your skills and traits. If your skills aren't being powered up by relevant attributes they won't do much, and powering up attributes you don't use won't achieve anything at all. For example if you focus on condition damage but rarely or never apply conditions then all those points are going to waste. Equally if you have a condition build and focus on power you'll be boosting the weakest part of your attacks and won't achieve much.

Celestial boosts everything, so it's good for 'jack of all trades' builds which can use most/all the stats, and it's also a decent choice for someone who is undecided and wants to experiment or otherwise changes builds frequently without wanting to get new equipment each time. That's why it's given by the level 80 boost. (Which used to give soldier's stats, but that left a lot of people with the impression their character was just weak.)

Like any stat combination it depends on what and how you play. It's not a universally good choice, but it is one of the more popular ones.

[Sewedir.3027]

1 minute ago, Danikat.8537 said:

The important thing is to have stats that match your skills and traits. If your skills aren't being powered up by relevant attributes they won't do much, and powering up attributes you don't use won't achieve anything at all. For example if you focus on condition damage but rarely or never apply conditions then all those points are going to waste. Equally if you have a condition build and focus on power you'll be boosting the weakest part of your attacks and won't achieve much.

Celestial boosts everything, so it's good for 'jack of all trades' builds which can use most/all the stats, and it's also a decent choice for someone who is undecided and wants to experiment or otherwise changes builds frequently without wanting to get new equipment each time. That's why it's given by the level 80 boost. (Which used to give soldier's stats, but that left a lot of people with the impression their character was just weak.)

Like any stat combination it depends on what and how you play. It's not a universally good choice, but it is one of the more popular ones.

And that is why it cost like horse on the auction house.

[Endaris.1452]

20 minutes ago, Sewedir.3027 said:

And that is why it cost like horse on the auction house.

That's more due to the acquisition method of celestial inscriptions and insignias than anything. Quartz is both relatively expensive AND timegated, creating artificial scarcity and thus bumping the price. Add on top that the same Charged Quartz has various other key uses such as Grow Lamp, Skyscale treats and guildhall upgrades and that's where your price comes from.

[Arianth Moonlight.6453]

in PvE, Celestial can make you virtually unkillable. You'll be incredibly weak, but you'll eventually be able to kill anything.

in WvW, Berserker's damage, for example, is excessive, but you'll die very easily. Soldier's sustain is excellent, but you'll be so weak that you'll eventually die before killing anything. Celestial provides a balanced amount of damage and sustain, but it's not a magical stat. If you're a noob, you'll die regardless.

[Parasite.5389]

although the overall stat values are lower than other 3/4 stat prefixes, it offers some combinations that don't otherwise exist: for example, if you wanted something with Condition damage, Expertise, and Healing power(for whatever reason), you wouldn't be able to with a single prefix

[AliamRationem.5172]

4 hours ago, Sewedir.3027 said:

It has a lot of prefixes but from my experience if Gear doesn't specialize doesn't it mean that is rather mediocre?

Gear that has only 3 attributes has double the amount of stats values.

Isn't it better to have a higher number of given stats than larger stats overall?

Thanks for the info,

Cheers

 

It depends on the context.  For specialized roles, celestial is generally not a top pick.  However, for solo play it is usually a top pick for any condition-based build because you benefit from having some power stats and the boon duration can help you maximize what boons you're able to provide for yourself.  For many solo builds it is near top tier damage while also having among the best possible sustain.

Here's an example of celestial stats in action:

 

[Hotride.2187]

The boon and condi vomit you can build for, combined with the excessive stat amount. Your dmg is only mediocre when compared to full dps builds with a support. In solo situations where you are getting actually dmged, must kite and use defensives, cele will let you push dmg for way longer than a full dps build. So you will be doing decent dmg even when compared to a full dps build. Your passive sustain and mitigation are just that good.

Edited July 11, 2023 by Hotride.2187

[Dante.1508]

Jack of all trades wins in GW2..

While all those high damage Viper, Berserkers and Rampagers are dying on the ground my Celestial characters are ressing them and still fighting.. 🤣

My Thief, Ranger, Mesmer and Necro all run Cele.

 

Edited July 11, 2023 by Dante.1508

[The Boz.2038]

If your goal is to pump out DPS, then 3/4 stat offensive sets (Berserker, Marauder, Viper, Grieving) are the go-tos. Even if they give fewer total stats, they give you more of *a* specific stat you want, and a lof ot the damage calculation is multiplicative.

 

[Dawdler.8521]

13 hours ago, Danikat.8537 said:

The important thing is to have stats that match your skills and traits.

TL;DR play any PoF/EoD spec because Anet designed them to do all the damage with all the boons thus gain massive advantage from the buffed cele gear. 

[ASP.8093]

15 hours ago, Sewedir.3027 said:

Isn't it better to have a higher number of given stats than larger stats overall?

When playing solo? It's the Boon Duration indirectly boosting every other stat.

Boons and conditions are abundant in this game, they're often present on abilities that you'd use anyway even if they didn't add any boons or conditions (like a good spammable attack giving you a few Might stacks or the basic attack on your Power-focused weapon set applying a little bit of Bleed).

Your Berserker gear character with 0 Might and your Celestial gear character with 25 Might have very roughly the same base attack damage (before precision/ferocity turn your attacks into crits). Now, it's more likely you'll self-generate some Might even with Berserker gear, but the Boon Duration means that it stays longer and therefore stacks harder.

AND the Celestial character also has Condition Damage *AND* Condition Duration, which translates into a big power boost for their conditions as well (because Might boosts both).

So it's like you stapled 60% of a power DPS character to 60% of a Condi DPS character. Oh, and the Toughness, Healing Power, and defensive Boon Duration give you a lot more self-sustain, too.

 

Now, in a group setting, you've got dedicated boon support builds that stack Boon Duration in order to provide everyone with Alacrity or Quickness, and those same support builds are also spewing out enough Might, Fury, Regeneration, Protection, &c. to cap everyone's boons. So now your Berserker gear character does like 50%+ more damage than any Cele geared equivalent because you've got the more useful base stats AND you're both massively overcapped on boons. (n.b. The Celestial-geared character might themselves be a viable boon support in this situation, though i think more typically you'll see Diviner, Ritualist, or Harrier gear on these builds.)

[Khisanth.2948]

16 hours ago, Endaris.1452 said:

That's more due to the acquisition method of celestial inscriptions and insignias than anything. Quartz is both relatively expensive AND timegated, creating artificial scarcity and thus bumping the price. Add on top that the same Charged Quartz has various other key uses such as Grow Lamp, Skyscale treats and guildhall upgrades and that's where your price comes from.

Which can be bypassed with stat selectable gear. So the other reason is because of the chosen acquisition method

[SlayerXX.7138]

For Math reasons.
Stats affect Damage in GW 2 in a multiplicative fashion. So most of the time it is smart to "overinvest" in Damage stats as much as possible.
Celestial breaks the mold by giving you so much more stats total. In OW and WvW the lose of efficiency that comes with not stacking Damage stats is offset by the sheer quantity of stats you gain from celestial.

[Super Hayes.6890]

1 hour ago, Khisanth.2948 said:

Which can be bypassed with stat selectable gear. So the other reason is because of the chosen acquisition method

The other reason it costs more is that celestial gear used to be account bound. It hasn't been available on the TP anywhere near as long as most other stats. Lower supply

Edited July 11, 2023 by Super Hayes.6890
Clarity

[Khisanth.2948]

26 minutes ago, Super Hayes.6890 said:

The other reason it costs more is that celestial gear used to be account bound. It hasn't been available on the TP anywhere near as long as most other stats. Lower supply

It has been at least 2 years.

The demand for these are probably holding up because the game makes no attempts at informing players about the alternatives.

[Dayra.7405]

Sum up the total attr points and the answer is obvious.

[AliamRationem.5172]

14 hours ago, Dante.1508 said:

Jack of all trades wins in GW2..

While all those high damage Viper, Berserkers and Rampagers are dying on the ground my Celestial characters are ressing them and still fighting.. 🤣

My Thief, Ranger, Mesmer and Necro all run Cele.

 

Not according to your endless complaints about how difficult everything is. 🙄

[Cuks.8241]

The important distinction is solo vs group. In group your deficiencies are mitigated by other players. You have all the boons so if its not your job to share boons you dont need concentration. Same with healing or tanking (where relevant) which make defensive stats redundant. When solo, especially in pvp situations, defensive stats are almost always utilised. And extra boon duration will make up for a lot of dmg compared to specialised dmg builds that can't sustain boons by themselves. There's a reason why there is no celestial in spvp. 

[Accipridae.1589]

On 7/11/2023 at 12:56 AM, Chiral.8915 said:

Hybrid stats are great in competitive modes, particularly in WvW and great in open world "solo" mode. It's mediocre for most builds in instanced PVE.

In WvW, celestial has a good combination of...everything. Defense, offense, boon duration, etc. That makes it hard to kill. In instanced PVE, you're better off with more defined stats for each role. More DPS stats to kill faster, more heal/concentration stats to boon and keep people alive better. 

Ok but with full celestial gearing,I’m having difficult times (solo) against “Elite Phoenix” in The Echovald Wilds.Serious DPS lack with Mace&Axe and Staff in Vindicator/ Herald with Shortbow and Renegade as well,doesn’t matter🤔

Edited November 10, 2023 by Accipridae.1589

[Farohna.6247]

8 minutes ago, Accipridae.1589 said:

Ok but with full celestial gearing,I’m having difficult times (solo) against “Elite Phoenix” in The Echovald Wilds.Serious DPS lack with Mace&Axe and Staff in Vindicator/ Herald with Shortbow and Renegade as well,doesn’t matter🤔

Check out Lord Hizen's videos on YouTube.  Great builds for soloing, and explanations of how to play them.  It might help.   I play celestial renegade since I wander around solo mostly in open world and enjoy a level of chewiness when I poke sticks at things.  Sometimes it's just your placement or dodge, and sometimes things...you're not invincible just chewy lol. 

[AliamRationem.5172]

3 hours ago, Accipridae.1589 said:

Ok but with full celestial gearing,I’m having difficult times (solo) against “Elite Phoenix” in The Echovald Wilds.Serious DPS lack with Mace&Axe and Staff in Vindicator/ Herald with Shortbow and Renegade as well,doesn’t matter🤔

When you say you experience a serious lack of DPS, what's your frame of reference?  Are we comparing to other builds you've played? 

I don't play Rev, but on weaver I find the DPS on my celestial builds is quite good for such a high sustain build.   A fully offensive setup nets me around 24k DPS on a straightforward champion (e.g. Balthazar, vinetooth, etc.) While a more defensive setup that I might use for tougher stuff like legendaries will deal up to 17k.

Again, I don't know Rev but from what I've seen of Hizen's builds he usually hits around that 15k ballpark.  If that's too slow you could give up some sustain for more damage.