Don't Rangers and Thieves ever feel bad when commanders say "No Thieves. No Rangers, Please." — Guild Wars 2 Forums
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Don't Rangers and Thieves ever feel bad when commanders say "No Thieves. No Rangers, Please."

I play ranger myself and I don't feel bad, maybe because I play Firebrand too. But I feel like, anet should do something about these classes so they get to be welcomed to squads too. What do you guys think?

<1

Comments

  • Gotejjeken.1267Gotejjeken.1267 Member ✭✭✭

    I've never been told this. Is this a server specific thing? Or is this a map thing, like are you on EB (I never go to EB).

  • Stand The Wall.6987Stand The Wall.6987 Member ✭✭✭✭

    you need more then damage to be accepted into a comped party, you need team support/ some unique ability too.

    te lazla otstara.
    fingers crossed meta ~

  • Infusion.7149Infusion.7149 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    Most dagger or rifle thieves and longbow rangers are playing a different game in WVW than the commander is.

    If you want to be remotely accepted into a squad, play staff daredevil or immob melee (greatsword or sword+axe) stanceshare soulbeast instead of camping longbow.

    Any decent commander will organize their squad based on subgroup provided boons and buffs. If your build doesn't have any then you aren't wanted in the squad, it's that simple.

    P.S. a well played daredevil that has a perma-stealth build on swap is a decent plan B for in case a keep or tower push fails , due to shadow portal.

  • ASP.8093ASP.8093 Member ✭✭✭✭

    If I'm on thief I'm not trying to boonball, so I don't really care about getting in the squad.

    I do find it annoying how the viability of a ranged build in zerg-on-zerg fights is almost entirely decided by its ability to spam non-projectile AOE attacks, though.

  • Sansar.1302Sansar.1302 Member ✭✭✭

    Yes i do sometimes, esp frustrating when i see they have several raly bots in sqad that die in 2 sec in any fight.

    What i realy dont get is why my commander yells at me for sniping enemy commander, as it is super effective.

  • Kovu.7560Kovu.7560 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    Marauders or zerk Greatsword, Axe/Axe Soulbeast with a hyena and all of the merged damage multipliers and bonus stats provided by skirmishing & beastmastery (if properly supported) contributes similarly to reaper. Just with less boon corruption and more immobilizes. 7-10k mauls on (5 players in) an enemy group, prelude lash to pull a bunch of people, root them into whirling defense can drop several enemies at once. Doubles as a solid roaming build. Meme minstrels Druids have half their bars filled with skills that immobilize and can provide light healing support as well. Those Druids can really break up an enemy melee ball, especially if they spam their roots in a friendly bubble.

    But yeah, rangers and thieves have a bad rep when it comes to large group play. That can't be denied.

    ~ Kovu

    edit- I also hear musings about the potential of Glyph of the Stars being an anti-condi alternative should Purity of Purpose ever get that much needed nerf.

    Ranger, Necromancer, Fort Aspenwood.

  • Rogue.4756Rogue.4756 Member ✭✭✭

    Never ever ever. Never been told, never seen it in map chat, never been kicked from a squad because of profession choice. So, no.

  • LetoII.3782LetoII.3782 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Gotejjeken.1267 said:
    I've never been told this. Is this a server specific thing? Or is this a map thing, like are you on EB (I never go to EB).

    OCX is a srsbsns timezone.
    SoS gotta be ready in case a large group of OCX players suddenly start playing the game and don't also play on SoS.

    [HUNT] the predatory instinct

  • cobbah.3102cobbah.3102 Member ✭✭✭

    Nobody cares about rangers or thieves , look how badly Anet has treated them .

  • Hannelore.8153Hannelore.8153 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    I actually see alot of respect for LB Rangers these days for their role in destroying enemy siege thats hard to reach.

    Soulbeast is fairly well respected in general, compared to "bearbow" back in the day.

    Thief,.. well, like I've said in other threads they're not really great at anything. Acceptible, but not great, and they'll always be wasting a slot that any other class could fill better because of their lack of true versatility.

    Maybe their next Elite spec will change that, who knows.

    Hannah | Daisuki[SUKI] Founder, Ehmry Bay, NA | 24 charas, 18k hours, 29k AP | ♀♥♀
    No need to be best, only good and kind.

  • Justine.6351Justine.6351 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Rofl add extra spots in squads that only a ranger or Thief can fill :#

    Anet buff me :-(
    Make me good at game!

  • Cynz.9437Cynz.9437 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    @PrinceValentine.9320 said:
    I play ranger myself and I don't feel bad, maybe because I play Firebrand too. But I feel like, anet should do something about these classes so they get to be welcomed to squads too. What do you guys think?

    Yes, i feel bad and not just that. That is just another reason why i am actually bitter about Anet and their thoughts regarding thief design. It (the design) is main reason why thief is also not so wanted in other end content of the game be it raids, fractals, pvp. It is like Anet wants to tell us: dear thief players, please uninstall, tnks bye.

    How hard is it to add actual support spec to the class? Why does it work for other classes but thief can't have it?

    Those who say that such commander behavior doesn't happen - idk, where you play but it happens A LOT on my server (EU, one of the top servers, not allowed to name it nor the commanders that do it). You don't even get chance to do anything, just get insta kicked and get mocked on top of it (i am talking about pretty nasty verbal abuse here). It doesn't matter what build you run or if you actually contribute. It is even worse - if you choose to run thief as scout and inform the squad about what enemy is doing, contest etc. you just get laughed at, by your own "teammates". Of course you can run thief in zergs but even i will admit that thief just doesn't bring much to the group not to mention other classes do it better and bring more (e.g. engis). I just play other classes when i want to play with zerg.

    This kind of mentality practiced by wvw community is also the reason why thieves resort to roaming 99% of the time for which, oh the irony, wvw community hates us so much :# How dare i to specialize for 1v1, 1v2 situation and successfully kill enemies building for boonball! /facedesk x1000

    Meh~

  • Threather.9354Threather.9354 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    Give thief elite spec Ninja/Samurai and it can field greatsword like a Katana. Ton of AoE skills and one of those anime dashes where they dash while slicing behind them.

    Then thief might have a good weapon for blobbing, not just staff spam 5.

    Ranger has the same problem, the weapons are terrible.

    Ri Ba - Charr of logic
    twitch.tv/ribatime
    ~Key to fixing WvW with minimal effort resides in my post history~

  • MrForz.1953MrForz.1953 Member ✭✭✭

    Eh, these boon balls aren't what I signed up for, so no.

    Disgruntled Charr Engineer and Pirate - Jade Quarry

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Justine.6351 said:
    Rofl add extra spots in squads that only a ranger or Thief can fill :#

    They’d probably be left empty even then.... 😬

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • Solanum.6983Solanum.6983 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    Ranger and Thief are more solo/small group classes in WvW so I'd understand if I was to get kicked over a class that can benefit the group more.
    Hopefully the new specs with EoD will help and give thief especially some more options in playstyles so it's not left out of group play in a lot of end game content.

  • Tuna Bandit.3786Tuna Bandit.3786 Member ✭✭✭

    I can't remember ever being not invited or being kicked from a squad to be honest.
    What I DO get is requests to tap keeps, scout out an objective - usually offered squad participation for doing so to not loose that.

    Good commanders see individual value in any class.
    Unfortunately most commanders are average at best.

  • hobotnicax.7918hobotnicax.7918 Member ✭✭✭

    People who don't want rangers in squads don't really know how useful rangers can be in squads. A front line of around 5-7 melee soulbeasts in zergs usually gives you the advantage, since dolly stance makes melee pushes easy (aka, spin to win reapers on 10+ pulled and immo people). Once 10-15 melee are in the middle of enemies backline it's game over most of the time.
    But many will laugh at this, having not played a real melee soulbeast build and play it right.

  • Arheundel.6451Arheundel.6451 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Tuna Bandit.3786 said:
    I can't remember ever being not invited or being kicked from a squad to be honest.
    What I DO get is requests to tap keeps, scout out an objective - usually offered squad participation for doing so to not loose that.

    Good commanders see individual value in any class.
    Unfortunately most commanders are average at best.

    9 commanders out of 10 who do add a ranger to the zerg..will usually place you in a "no support" spot at the bottom or the top alongside thieves or some other "fringe" build not considered meta and at that point you may as well play outside the zerg...same thing

    -A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"

  • meerfunkuhtron.9725meerfunkuhtron.9725 Member ✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    you need more then damage to be accepted into a comped party, you need team support/ some unique ability too.

    This is the second time I'm hearing this reasoning. Aren't SB stances when shared useful anymore? I used to run a boon and stance share SB and it used to work quite well back then. Did something change regarding their functionality?

  • kash.9213kash.9213 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    It's not hard to build as a thief to hang out in large fights but I'd rather not have my name in squad so I won't count towards dots a commander sees getting lost and make sure I don't mess up their circles and blasts. I'll join squads or groups once in awhile if they're just inviting whoever is there but I need to be at certain distances and angles during drives and whatever to get at our downs or support or to intercept something. I don't feel like there's a lot of issue around OP as much as there might have been, I think most people kind of get it.

    Northern Shiverpeaks [EL] & [SD]

  • Fat Disgrace.4275Fat Disgrace.4275 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Well, the commanders cant force you to not follow anyway

  • Cynz.9437Cynz.9437 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
    Well, the commanders cant force you to not follow anyway

    No, they can just be total jerks and spam you with slur as well as squad members. Have experienced enough or it.

    Meh~

  • UmbraNoctis.1907UmbraNoctis.1907 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    Never got kicked from a squad or told to gtfo/swap class - i'm the one declining squad invites.

    Ranger being more self sufficient (and selfish) is one of the reasons why i like the class and i'd hate if that got changed one day. If i wanted to blob on a regular basis i would just play a class that is more suited for that kind of playstyle. A "zerg ranger" wouldn't play much different than those "zerg classes" we already have anyway and it also doesn't really fit into the ranger archetype. So i don't really understand those that desperately want to have a class changed instead of playing something that fits their preferred playstyle better.

    And if you really want to, both ranger and thief can already work in zergs just fine, just gotta put a little bit more work into it i guess.

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Cynz.9437 said:

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
    Well, the commanders cant force you to not follow anyway

    No, they can just be total jerks and spam you with slur as well as squad members. Have experienced enough or it.

    Block and report?

    Personally on one of the larger servers, and we rarely see that type of behavior from the commanders.

    If people are spamming you with stuff like that, block and report. I am sure on some level that would be construed as harassment.

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @kash.9213 said:
    It's not hard to build as a thief to hang out in large fights but I'd rather not have my name in squad so I won't count towards dots a commander sees getting lost and make sure I don't mess up their circles and blasts. I'll join squads or groups once in awhile if they're just inviting whoever is there but I need to be at certain distances and angles during drives and whatever to get at our downs or support or to intercept something. I don't feel like there's a lot of issue around OP as much as there might have been, I think most people kind of get it.

    I think the major issue comes from relatively new people.

    Their feelings get hurt when the commander relegates than to irrelevance.

    @meerfunkuhtron.9725 said:

    @Stand The Wall.6987 said:
    you need more then damage to be accepted into a comped party, you need team support/ some unique ability too.

    This is the second time I'm hearing this reasoning. Aren't SB stances when shared useful anymore? I used to run a boon and stance share SB and it used to work quite well back then. Did something change regarding their functionality?

    They bring nothing that others don’t do, and don’t do better.

    Now... that’s not to say they don’t have some use, and some builds can be more effective than others. @Balthzar.3807 could likely give a decent rundown of how they have been able to function well in Zergs, but a larger issue comes in when many players use ranger, they don’t know a viable build to bring that brings some elements of group support, or synergy.

    Lastly, some commanders don’t utilize their (the rangers) strengths effectively because those commanders are used to a specific type of commanding... They either can’t or won’t be flexible.

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • @Strider Pj.2193 said:
    They bring nothing that others don’t do, and don’t do better.

    Now... that’s not to say they don’t have some use, and some builds can be more effective than others. @Balthzar.3807 could likely give a decent rundown of how they have been able to function well in Zergs, but a larger issue comes in when many players use ranger, they don’t know a viable build to bring that brings some elements of group support, or synergy.

    Lastly, some commanders don’t utilize their (the rangers) strengths effectively because those commanders are used to a specific type of commanding... They either can’t or won’t be flexible.

    I see. Thanks, that makes a lot of sense.

  • Svarty.8019Svarty.8019 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @PrinceValentine.9320 said:
    I play ranger myself and I don't feel bad, maybe because I play Firebrand too. But I feel like, anet should do something about these classes so they get to be welcomed to squads too. What do you guys think?

    Yes, Arenanet should put other classes in the game! ... oh wait...

    This post contains my opinion.

  • Sobx.1758Sobx.1758 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    Nah -choose, play and build accordingly to the role you want to fill. If I want to roam, I pick something I enjoy roaming with; if I want to zerg, I pick something that's useful in zergs. That's about it.

  • Fat Disgrace.4275Fat Disgrace.4275 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Cynz.9437 said:

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
    Well, the commanders cant force you to not follow anyway

    No, they can just be total jerks and spam you with slur as well as squad members. Have experienced enough or it.

    i have never witnessed that, at least from a commander who is well known. com will ask you to reroll to something else or leave.

  • Arheundel.6451Arheundel.6451 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @UmbraNoctis.1907 said:
    Never got kicked from a squad or told to gtfo/swap class - i'm the one declining squad invites.

    Ranger being more self sufficient (and selfish) is one of the reasons why i like the class and i'd hate if that got changed one day. If i wanted to blob on a regular basis i would just play a class that is more suited for that kind of playstyle. A "zerg ranger" wouldn't play much different than those "zerg classes" we already have anyway and it also doesn't really fit into the ranger archetype. So i don't really understand those that desperately want to have a class changed instead of playing something that fits their preferred playstyle better.

    And if you really want to, both ranger and thief can already work in zergs just fine, just gotta put a little bit more work into it i guess.

    ^This

    I play ranger for its solo gameplay...I got a ready to go guardian and necro when I want to farm bags that badly

    -A wise man once said- "Fight cheese with cheese or be cheesed in return, mind not those who will accuse you of being a cheese as they like cheese themselves"

  • Noah Salazar.5430Noah Salazar.5430 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2021

    Arent Rangers/thiefs roamer role, means to place supply traps, build defense, scout for enemy zerg?
    both class got hight mobility or dashes, i think that roles was not mean to fight in larger squads, more of taking down camps/towers in time your zerg fight other zerg

  • Tuna Bandit.3786Tuna Bandit.3786 Member ✭✭✭

    @Arheundel.6451 said:
    9 commanders out of 10 who do add a ranger to the zerg..will usually place you in a "no support" spot at the bottom or the top alongside thieves or some other "fringe" build not considered meta and at that point you may as well play outside the zerg...same thing

    That is more like 50/50 for me.
    And then there can still be value in being part of the squad, even if unsupported.
    For me it works 2 ways, if a commander wants me to scout, I simply ask squad participation so I do not bleed my t6 away.
    Same with contesting/other tasks.

    Also being able to report to the squad and not necesairily the map/world can be valuable.

    But yeah when I am in a squad not scouting/contesting etc... it's 50/50 if I am in a supported party or not.

  • kamikharzeeh.8016kamikharzeeh.8016 Member ✭✭✭✭

    do u really question those choices? like, seriously?

    99% of rangers won't even have any group support build, and even the immobbeasts on largescale just handicap more than they help. they are easy to kill, have only melee options, good FB + scrappers (yes, both are rare enough these days) just cleanse the sh**t away in seconds.

    if u cannot do anything in a squad that u can do outside of it as well, why bothering to join one? good groups need coordination, and that's absurdly hard to gain these days. the meta acceptance got sooo much more open to weird classes yet. u see berserkers, immobeasts, core guards, dragonhunters way more often in squads, what however only leads to overall bigger sustain issues.
    the FBs need to be extrawoke, which many aren't, leading to disasterous fights. the classic composition provides way less sheer damage, but far more synergy.

    in the end the ongoing of how squads look is just sad. it's not fun to play a damage class, if in 8/10 fights u live way longer than your firebrand. (probably some genius pepebrands who thought they'll try axe for more dps... trading a lot of aegis for a pull, sabotaging your own squad)

  • Cynz.9437Cynz.9437 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:

    @Cynz.9437 said:

    @Fat Disgrace.4275 said:
    Well, the commanders cant force you to not follow anyway

    No, they can just be total jerks and spam you with slur as well as squad members. Have experienced enough or it.

    i have never witnessed that, at least from a commander who is well known. com will ask you to reroll to something else or leave.

    Just because it doesn't happen to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen at all (same as i don't meet bots in plat but i know they exist in lower ranks). I am not saying every commi does it but it occurred too many times to just ignore it. Reporting doesn't help much as support doesn't bother with verbal abuse unless roleplayers are affected. Once again, i am not expecting anything from comis or wvw community at this point outside of:

    • Anet giving support spec to thief
    • WvW community to stop to QQ about roamers

    Meh~

  • lolol. Here we go again, and again. In one corner we have the “I really have no clue what a ranger can do” , in the other corner the true Rangers waving the SMH emoji.

    I’m typically the last to die, get more kills hitting MULTIPLE targets, not single targets like people who don’t know Ranger think, and the top 10 dps overall.

    AND I do both range and melee, go figure.

    ya sounds useless to me. 😏

    Just another WvW lifer who'll never say die... while dying again and again!

  • ArchonWing.9480ArchonWing.9480 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 10, 2021

    /shrugs. We do have 5 character slots and exotic gear costs almost nothing, after all. If you choose to only play 1 class, that's going to be a disadvantage at times. Also overly choosy groups tend to just find excuses to boot people out of their little circle; shouldn't get offended.

    That being said some people run stuff like Arcdps and if they're kicking high performers, it's kinda their loss. However, the truth is that the average player is really bad even if in a meta build, and much less said about the average not meta player. So it's not unreasonable to expect that some random joining is going to be useless. It's unfair, yes, sadly but you can't really expect commanders to screen like a squad of 40 and find the snowflake. It's just easier to tell randoms to pick up some support roles that even a monkey can hit random buttons and still provide a lot of impact.

    However, if you do make yourself known to the community, and perhaps agree to make the concession that you can switch to a desired class if really needed, then you'd have more leeway.

    Social skills and all, of course. Now if the other side lacks said social skills, well, screw them. They'll probably bandwagon off eventually.

    Honestly though, there are no useless classes; only useless players. (and yes putting a tag on doesn't make you useful either)

  • Shroud.2307Shroud.2307 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 10, 2021

    @Some Call Me Tim.2319 said:
    lolol. Here we go again, and again. In one corner we have the “I really have no clue what a ranger can do” , in the other corner the true Rangers waving the SMH emoji.

    I’m typically the last to die, get more kills hitting MULTIPLE targets, not single targets like people who don’t know Ranger think, and the top 10 dps overall.

    AND I do both range and melee, go figure.

    ya sounds useless to me. 😏

    Anything can do a lot of damage, the question is whether you're doing it in the right spots at the right times.
    Like a DH that throws a bunch of Sword of Justice and tops the DPS charts, all it's doing is cleaving, it doesn't necessarily mean it's getting kills.

    Ranger has utility value in zergs for doing things like hard sniping backliners and players caught outside their group or for destroying siege in objectives. But because the majority of Rangers validate themselves by how much damage they can do or how long they survive, few are contributing anything of worth.

    It isn't so much that Thieves and Rangers are useless as it is that what they provide is niche and not often needed.

    @ArchonWing.9480 said:
    Honestly though, there are no useless classes; only useless players. (and yes putting a tag on doesn't make you useful either)

    Necro/Engi/Ranger/Rev | Maguuma | Diamond Legend
    [YWY] Weeping Valley | [xo] Fantasies
    My Youtube: Shroud
    "I'd rather lose playing something I enjoy than win playing something I don't."

  • Strider Pj.2193Strider Pj.2193 Member ✭✭✭✭

    @Shroud.2307 said:

    @Some Call Me Tim.2319 said:
    lolol. Here we go again, and again. In one corner we have the “I really have no clue what a ranger can do” , in the other corner the true Rangers waving the SMH emoji.

    I’m typically the last to die, get more kills hitting MULTIPLE targets, not single targets like people who don’t know Ranger think, and the top 10 dps overall.

    AND I do both range and melee, go figure.

    ya sounds useless to me. 😏

    Anything can do a lot of damage, the question is whether you're doing it in the right spots at the right times.
    Like a DH that throws a bunch of Sword of Justice and tops the DPS charts, all it's doing is cleaving, it doesn't necessarily mean it's getting kills.

    Ranger has utility value in zergs for doing things like hard sniping backliners and players caught outside their group or for destroying siege in objectives. But because the majority of Rangers validate themselves by how much damage they can do or how long they survive, few are contributing anything of worth.

    It isn't so much that Thieves and Rangers are useless as it is that what they provide is niche and not often needed.

    @ArchonWing.9480 said:
    Honestly though, there are no useless classes; only useless players. (and yes putting a tag on doesn't make you useful either)

    Probably one of the most objectively based explanations of ranger/thief issues for squads.

    Thank You for the {MEME}

  • Some Call Me Tim.2319Some Call Me Tim.2319 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2021

    @Shroud.2307 said:

    @Some Call Me Tim.2319 said:
    lolol. Here we go again, and again. In one corner we have the “I really have no clue what a ranger can do” , in the other corner the true Rangers waving the SMH emoji.

    I’m typically the last to die, get more kills hitting MULTIPLE targets, not single targets like people who don’t know Ranger think, and the top 10 dps overall.

    AND I do both range and melee, go figure.

    ya sounds useless to me. 😏

    Anything can do a lot of damage, the question is whether you're doing it in the right spots at the right times.
    Like a DH that throws a bunch of Sword of Justice and tops the DPS charts, all it's doing is cleaving, it doesn't necessarily mean it's getting kills.

    Ranger has utility value in zergs for doing things like hard sniping backliners and players caught outside their group or for destroying siege in objectives. But because the majority of Rangers validate themselves by how much damage they can do or how long they survive, few are contributing anything of worth.

    It isn't so much that Thieves and Rangers are useless as it is that what they provide is niche and not often needed.

    @ArchonWing.9480 said:
    Honestly though, there are no useless classes; only useless players. (and yes putting a tag on doesn't make you useful either)

    That’s true. It’s positioning and knowing where to hit etc. All comes with experience. But with that experience you can be very useful. Problem is, yes I’m saying it, most Rangers just do NOT know how to play their class well enough.

    Just another WvW lifer who'll never say die... while dying again and again!

  • SWI.4127SWI.4127 Member ✭✭✭

    People's identities shouldn't be tied to one class. Branch out and learn new things. Then you can't be offended if someone asks something as simple as "can you bring another more useful class?".

    Ideally things would be balanced so they have a viable place in big fights, but instead of waiting for something that probably won't ever happen, just adjust!

  • Dawdler.8521Dawdler.8521 Member ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2021

    @Shroud.2307 said:
    Ranger has utility value in zergs for doing things like hard sniping backliners and players caught outside their group or for destroying siege in objectives.

    Except well... they dont. Not anymore at least. Zergs today have so much sustain that focus groups has long since become obsolete. Commanders dont utilize them because commanders dont want to utilize them and the impact of loose players around the zerg is negligable. Not even when there is a full 50 man do we see secondary squads created just for focus, because additional tags - even when we can now hide them - is taboo and forbidden.

    I'm not saying that kind of player cant be "usefull". When I run as an flanking engie and sometimes plow into an enemy zerg backline with a lucky tornado and knock people around like ragdolls, a single push from our zerg at the right moment would wipe them. A hammer to the anvil, sort of speak. But they dont do that. Because the commander dont see it. They only see two entities stance dancing and fighting each other and thats it. The dogs barking around them are irrelevant. Its become a culture.

    gaggle - /ˈɡaɡ(ə)l/ - noun
    A disorderly group of Asura.
    "The gaggle of Asura tried to agree on whether a phase-shifted thermonuclear energy matrix was sufficiently powerful for a device capable of heating bread"

  • Teratus.2859Teratus.2859 Member ✭✭✭✭

    Not at all.

    I actually feel more bad when I constantly reject squad or party invites because I would rather not take up a slot that someone who actually wants to be in a squad/party would take.
    I'm perfectly content running around on my own or following a Zerg and doing my own thing while they do theirs.

    I will never be a high level competitive player, I don't enjoy that content enough to work for that so I'll not put myself in a position where I am constantly a hinderance on a group.
    So it's better I stay out of squads, do not actively take on a defined competitive role and just help them get kills and take out siege etc, and they don't have to worry about me if I fall behind or get downed either.

  • Novahh.7426Novahh.7426 Member ✭✭
    edited March 11, 2021

    Well usually they just swap off ranger/theif if they want to join squad. If not then no squaddy invite lol

  • Caedmon.6798Caedmon.6798 Member ✭✭✭✭

    "Were thieves in a world where no one don't want us no more"

  • God.2708God.2708 Member ✭✭✭
    edited March 11, 2021

    @Dawdler.8521 said:

    @Shroud.2307 said:
    Ranger has utility value in zergs for doing things like hard sniping backliners and players caught outside their group or for destroying siege in objectives.

    Except well... they dont. Not anymore at least. Zergs today have so much sustain that focus groups has long since become obsolete. Commanders dont utilize them because commanders dont want to utilize them and the impact of loose players around the zerg is negligable. Not even when there is a full 50 man do we see secondary squads created just for focus, because additional tags - even when we can now hide them - is taboo and forbidden.

    I'm not saying that kind of player cant be "usefull". When I run as an flanking engie and sometimes plow into an enemy zerg backline with a lucky tornado and knock people around like ragdolls, a single push from our zerg at the right moment would wipe them. A hammer to the anvil, sort of speak. But they dont do that. Because the commander dont see it. They only see two entities stance dancing and fighting each other and thats it. The dogs barking around them are irrelevant. Its become a culture.

    If only there was a way for you to alert the commander to what you were doing so they could act on your initiative generating actions instead of assuming the game mode revolves around you and that all should be aware of your presence.

    I mean, at least 50% of commanders now a days can barely recognize what their own squad is doing in relation to the enemies. Try to factor in a bunch of green names of which more than half are probably skill clickers running some rabid magi mix 'because it's what I like to run'? That's a tall order, not everyone is omniscient.

  • cyberzombie.7348cyberzombie.7348 Member ✭✭✭

    I must be really out of the loop. As a thief player I've probably been kicked from a squad for being a thief once out of the 7 years of playing WvW. Though, I typically don't join a squad if they're asking for meta builds which is not often in most servers I've been linked to.