If you were in charge of deciding whether the game had a cash shop or did not have a cash shop what would you choose?

[Inculpatus cedo.9234]

35 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

 

He's referring to things like :

 

Having to buy the extra bag slot (Called bag slot expansion on the store)

Having to buy more build templates if you want more than the default two (Called build storage expansion on gem store)

Having to buy extra bank spaces (Called bank tab expansion on the store)

Having to buy extra character slots

Having to buy extra equipment templates (Called equipment template expansion on the store)

Having to pay to change character look (Called total makeover kit/self style hair kit on the store)

Having to pay for more material storage (Called storage expander on the store)

Having to buy for additional crafting disciplines (Called additional crafting license on the store)

Having to pay to access your bank on the go (called Bank access express on the store)

Instant repair cannisters experience boost etc

Having to pay to summon black lion merchant (Merchant Express on the store)

Having to pay for world boss portal device (World boss portal device on the store)

 

None of these things stop you from completing content in the game but what they do is purposefully create systems in the game that WILL inconvenience you so they can SELL you the solution to the problems they have purposefully created. 

 

Essentially it means they make the game worse in these areas so you spend money to make the game better. This is what he means by convenience items.

 

Hmm.  I have purchased very few of those items, and have so many sitting in the bank.  I even have empty character slots. 

I will admit to acquiring additional bank slots (bit of a hoarder), but most of the time it was through Gold-to-Gems. 

I'm sure some do, but I don't feel inconvenienced by not having most of those items listed. 

[kharmin.7683]

29 minutes ago, Inculpatus cedo.9234 said:

Hmm.  I have purchased very few of those items, and have so many sitting in the bank.  I even have empty character slots. 

I will admit to acquiring additional bank slots (bit of a hoarder), but most of the time it was through Gold-to-Gems. 

I'm sure some do, but I don't feel inconvenienced by not having most of those items listed. 

Same here.  Same with several in my very small guild and others I know who aren't. We've all completed content well enough without many or most of these items.   /shrug

[Gibson.4036]

7 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Same here.  Same with several in my very small guild and others I know who aren't. We've all completed content well enough without many or most of these items.   /shrug

It's totally possible. I don't buy most of them, and get along. But in my ideal world, like the OP seems to be suggesting, I'd remove them and make the shop entirely cosmetic.

Some conveniences I don't feel the need for at all. Following are the ones I do feel:

Material Storage: Once you get to endgame and are saving up for big crafted things, you realize how much you get in materials and how many you need to craft some things. 250 suddenly feels reallly restrictive. At some point I did expand my storage to 500 in each slot. I'm still using my family's guild storage to add additional stacks of things.

Shared Inventory Slot: Not something I needed for quite a while, but once I started getting some other convenience items like the copper-fed-salvage-o-matic or portal tomes or a lounge pass it becomes something of a necessity if I'm going to play any more than one character regularly. Getting one on each character would be crazy.

I'm not saying any of these break the game, make it unplayable, or are P2W. But it does chafe to have a system like constantly salvaging hundreds of blues and greens, and having to constantly buy salvage kits. There's no real game purpose for that design. It does make it annoying enough to have made me want the infinite salvaging kit.

Same applies to harvesting. I haven't bought the infinite yet, but it is getting annoying to constantly buy the tools.

[voltaicbore.8012]

13 minutes ago, kharmin.7683 said:

Same here.  Same with several in my very small guild and others I know who aren't. We've all completed content well enough without many or most of these items.   /shrug

Yep. Perhaps it's a side effect of having played many other games that much more actively inconvenience players (most notoriously, Black Desert), but I feel what all characters get as a baseline is quite enough for a smooth and full game experience. Admittedly if you wanted to run several builds on the same character, it did cramp your bag space a bit before loadouts and the legendary armory came along. Now with those in place, there's almost no pressure to expand the capacities of most characters.

[nosleepdemon.1368]

1 hour ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

 

Just because they cut a bunch of employees doesn't mean they are making low or moderate profits. Take world of warcraft for example they made record profits in 2019 and they cut 8 percent of their staff (800 employers). Let's not just assume that all the profit goes back into the running of the game and new content creation.

https://blizzardwatch.com/2019/02/12/activision-blizzard-record-profits-cutting-8-staff/

 

I think we can assume that if the game were making enough money to not require in game purchases, there wouldn't be any.

[Goettel.4389]

I'd keep it as is because it's fine.

[Khisanth.2948]

"enough money"? 🤣

In an environment where investors expect continuous exponential growth? 🤣

 

No such thing as a business making enough money and then they stop like someone becoming full when eating and then they stop.

 

Due to the existence of the gem exchange, everything in the gem store is already obtainable in game. A 700gem store skin is around 200 gold. This both more and less expensive than skins that are not from the gem store

[Omega.6801]

Your second alternative isn't really a thing because there is no more income. As many have stated now, removing the cash shop as it is and not replacing it with some other form of monetization would simply not work. You have to sell SOMETHING.

This can be a subscription, which can be argued is the inferior system. Cap'ing generated income and alienating the existing playerbase that came here because it is f2p+cash-shop. Also, as has been stated hundreds of times on these forums, for players who want a subscription fee that unlocks cosmetics or other items, sold in the shop at the moment,  there is the option to pay a set amount of cash each month for gems and simply purchase whatever item they desire.

This can be expansions. But by embracing the theme park, the company enters a race against it's most dedicated players that can only be lost in the long run imho. Sure, GW2 already is a theme park MMO, but the big, game changing expansions that cost extra are rare, while the smaller additions to the game, that still include new maps, new mechanics, new items etc., are free if you're somewhat active during the time of release and won't cost much later on.

This can be merch, but I doubt that the game can fly on bubble tea and t-shirts alone. Same goes for crowdfunding, donations, hopes and dreams.

I think the gemstore we have is as ok'ish as it gets. As I said ANet needs to sell something to keep the lights on, and I'd rather have a fair non p2w cash-shop for cosmetics and account upgrades that you can buy stuff from for in game currency even, than a subsription fee, 4 mediocre expacs per year or an even more aggressive cash-shop.

[IndigoSundown.5419]

4 hours ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

If there was a world where they could make enough money from the one time purchase of the game and individual expansions what would you pick?

 

That sentence makes this thread by-and-large irrelevant, consigning it to the realm of fairytales.  The OP's question is heavily biased.  It assumes there would be no impact to ANet's revenue if all the stuff in the store were to be in-game rewards.  This is hilarious and out of touch with reality.  It at best a pipe dream and at worst yet another attempt to gripe about the cash shop.

 

It also assumes that ANet does not already think there are enough in-game rewards.  If they did remove the shop, who is to say they would continue to produce the stuff they now sell?

[Southerncarl.2740]

48 minutes ago, IndigoSundown.5419 said:

That sentence makes this thread by-and-large irrelevant, consigning it to the realm of fairytales.  The OP's question is heavily biased.  It assumes there would be no impact to ANet's revenue if all the stuff in the store were to be in-game rewards.  This is hilarious and out of touch with reality.  It at best a pipe dream and at worst yet another attempt to gripe about the cash shop.

 

It also assumes that ANet does not already think there are enough in-game rewards.  If they did remove the shop, who is to say they would continue to produce the stuff they now sell?

so if you were to answer the original question which one would you pick?

[Sigmoid.7082]

31 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

so if you were to answer the original question which one would you pick?

I think that's the point. Why answer or entertain a question so leading, biased, and that's so far and away from any reality.

 

It's like you're jumping through hoops, bending reality and handwaving difficulty and realism just so you can say "HA, see, everything should be unlockable in game just like I personally think". 

 

We get it you want a very particular answer and will ignore and stop at no lengths to get it. 

Edited September 8, 2021 by Sigmoid.7082

[Gehenna.3625]

35 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

so if you were to answer the original question which one would you pick?

I would pick the gem store because if they wouldn't have the gem store, they would have to make their money in another way and this could only really be achieved by making this game have a subscription model or in-game advertisements. I mean you can't choose not to have the consequences.

Edited September 8, 2021 by Gehenna.3625

[Southerncarl.2740]

9 minutes ago, Sigmoid.7082 said:

I think that's the point. Why answer or entertain a question so leading, biased, and that's so far and away from any reality.

 

It's like you're jumping through hoops, bending reality and handwaving difficulty and realism just so you can say "HA, see, everything should be unlockable in game just like I personally think". 

 

We get it you want a very particular answer and will ignore and stop at no lengths to get it. 

 

Basically I'm trying to see whether people genuinely actually like having a cash shop where you can purchase armour, boosts, convenience items etc or do we all just tolerate it because we really like the game and a shop is just a standard feature of MMO's now. 

 

With all the variables about generating cash and profit removed we would as consumers still choose to have a cash shop in the game or would we not?

 

I'm phrasing it in this way to avoid people talking about the reasons why it has to be done but whether generally us as consumers would still choose to include it in the game if we had the choice. This isn't a gotcha question I'm genuinely interested.

 

 

[mercury ranique.2170]

This post lacks understanding of the essence of markets and businesses. It has an assumption that it is an option for a decision maker to pick, but reality is that there is no option at all. The game has stakeholders like customers, shareholders, employees, suppliers and much more. Once a path is chosen and it is successful, it is no longer an option to leave that path. A manager can only fix something that is broken for all stakeholders 

[Southerncarl.2740]

5 minutes ago, mercury ranique.2170 said:

This post lacks understanding of the essence of markets and businesses. It has an assumption that it is an option for a decision maker to pick, but reality is that there is no option at all. The game has stakeholders like customers, shareholders, employees, suppliers and much more. Once a path is chosen and it is successful, it is no longer an option to leave that path. A manager can only fix something that is broken for all stakeholders 

 

14 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

 

Basically I'm trying to see whether people genuinely actually like having a cash shop where you can purchase armour, boosts, convenience items etc or do we all just tolerate it because we really like the game and a shop is just a standard feature of MMO's now. 

 

With all the variables about generating cash and profit removed we would as consumers still choose to have a cash shop in the game or would we not?

 

I'm phrasing it in this way to avoid people talking about the reasons why it has to be done but whether generally us as consumers would still choose to include it in the game if we had the choice. This isn't a gotcha question I'm genuinely interested.

 

 

 

Man it's a hypothetical question read it and answer it's not hard.

[Gehenna.3625]

9 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

Basically I'm trying to see whether people genuinely actually like having a cash shop where you can purchase armour, boosts, convenience items etc or do we all just tolerate it because we really like the game and a shop is just a standard feature of MMO's now. 

 

With all the variables about generating cash and profit removed we would as consumers still choose to have a cash shop in the game or would we not?

 

I'm phrasing it in this way to avoid people talking about the reasons why it has to be done but whether generally us as consumers would still choose to include it in the game if we had the choice. This isn't a gotcha question I'm genuinely interested.

Well of course people would choose not to have to pay for something, you don't need to ask that question if it doesn't come with consequences. So that's really a non-question.

[Rogue.8235]

8 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

 

Basically I'm trying to see whether people genuinely actually like having a cash shop where you can purchase armour, boosts, convenience items etc or do we all just tolerate it because we really like the game and a shop is just a standard feature of MMO's now. 

With all the variables about generating cash and profit removed we would as consumers still choose to have a cash shop in the game or would we not?

I'm phrasing it in this way to avoid people talking about the reasons why it has to be done but whether generally us as consumers would still choose to include it in the game if we had the choice. This isn't a gotcha question I'm genuinely interested.

(emphasis added).

 

Why stop there?  Let's answer the bigger question extending from such a premise.  

I would like for there to be no cost for anything in existence.  I would like to be able to obtain everything I need and want without ever allocating any personal resources I have to its acquisition.  So, in effect, I would not want the cash shop because, in this world you pose, everything is free.  Why pay for anything when there is no cost for anything?

Alternatively, we can acknowledge that people require wages in order to live in modern society, resources have a cost, and there must be a way to attain the finances to pay these expenses.

You are literally asking people if they want to pay for stuff in a world where there is no reason to pay for stuff.  

This is a tautological exercise, not a genuine inquiry.  

 

[Doggie.3184]

I'd choose cash shop with various swimsuits.

[Danikat.8537]

9 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

 

Basically I'm trying to see whether people genuinely actually like having a cash shop where you can purchase armour, boosts, convenience items etc or do we all just tolerate it because we really like the game and a shop is just a standard feature of MMO's now. 

 

With all the variables about generating cash and profit removed we would as consumers still choose to have a cash shop in the game or would we not?

 

I'm phrasing it in this way to avoid people talking about the reasons why it has to be done but whether generally us as consumers would still choose to include it in the game if we had the choice. This isn't a gotcha question I'm genuinely interested.

But it's a fundamentally flawed premise.

 

It's like asking if I actually like having a supermarket nearby with a large selection of foods to buy or if I'd rather just have whatever I want to eat appear in my kitchen. Obviously I'd choose the second one if I could, but it's an irrelevant question because that's an impossible fantasy which cannot happen.

 

"What if Anet made all the money they could ever need without selling anything except the base game" is about as likely as an infinite supply of food appearing in my kitchen, so it doesn't matter if everyone would agree or not because it's not a situation which is ever going to come up.

[Southerncarl.2740]

You guys are way overthinking it.

 

Let's try this another way. If money wasn't an issue for Anet would you like to have the ability to pay for certain items in the game with real world money or would you prefer that those items are only attainable through doing in game content? Which would you choose?

[b k.1648]

Why provide a sensible answer to an insensible question?

[Sigmoid.7082]

8 minutes ago, Southerncarl.2740 said:

You guys are way overthinking it.

 

Let's try this another way. If money wasn't an issue for Anet would you like to have the ability to pay for certain items in the game with real world money or would you prefer that those items are only attainable through doing in game content? Which would you choose?

I dont think people are. I don't think you understand why you're getting the answers you are honestly.

 

Extremely hypothetical, fictitious, non questions are not worth really answering.

 

You say you're genuinely interested but, by the very nature of the question, it has, and you're looking for, a specific answer. Therefore it serves no purpose in being asked or answered in the first place. 

[Dean Calaway.9718]

[This message is unwelcomed and was removed.]

Edited September 30, 2021 by Dean Calaway.9718

[Southerncarl.2740]

16 minutes ago, Sigmoid.7082 said:

I dont think people are. I don't think you understand why you're getting the answers you are honestly.

 

Extremely hypothetical, fictitious, non questions are not worth really answering.

 

You say you're genuinely interested but, by the very nature of the question, it has, and you're looking for, a specific answer. Therefore it serves no purpose in being asked or answered in the first place. 

 

It's a really simple question. 

Edited September 8, 2021 by Southerncarl.2740

[Vancho.8750]

The only good alternative to the cash shop is a sub, but we already know how that would have ended considering another NCSOFT game that was quite like GW2 and had a sub, Wildstar .