Do you regret pre-ordering SoTO?

[Gorem.8104]

12 minutes ago, Chronardis.4028 said:

Nope, Ultimate Edition is a great deal and I want to continue supporting this game. I'm sure I'll have lots of fun in the new expansion. 🙂

But isn't that the same as saying "if the devs kicked some dirt on the ground, I would pay them for it, and coddle it and treat it as my baby"? 

Supporting bad design choices and decisions is why games die and are removed from online play and are deleted forever, do you want gw2 to go away forever? Then give them more money when they make bad choices. Other mmo's have disappeared forever, why would you want gw2 to go away forever? Support the dev team when they make good choices. That's how you truly show support for a game you love. 
Most will only buy the min they are required too now because of bad dev choices, if they made the right choices and did things correctly, they'd make a lot more money. Its simple math, in POF it was a return to form for people and was the games best earnings by such a large margin it dwarfs anything they have made in the past 3 years. 

Do not forget that the expansion was announced only one month into EoD. Which means it was 100% always going to be rushed and delivered incomplete. Imagine if PoF released with only 2 maps and none of the features promised, while also taking away something many people have earnt and only giving it back to them after potentially a year. Would that have gone down well? No. Instead PoF delivered and they made bank. When they give us something with quality behind it, they are truly supported and they make a lot of money. 

But as it stands, they have lost all goodwill from their own playerbase and they need to earn it back. 

[Ashantara.8731]

8 hours ago, Min Min.9368 said:

Wait, just because you want to get legendary relics on launch and refused to get any lesser version, the rest of us can't have any too and have to wait for you?

Do you consider full legendary gears owners superior in game and deserve special entitlements?

Very interesting interpretation of what I wrote. 😂

Edit to clarify:

1. I don't feel superior to anyone, not in RL and not in-game.
2. If they postponed the system, it would not hurt you, because the current system works just fine, no? On the other hand, it would hurt players like me to be left in limbo for months, because we would have to either waste resources on something we will have to dump again next year or not use any relics for the time being, being at a significant disadvantage.

I hope this clarifies my previous post.
 

Edited July 23, 2023 by Ashantara.8731

[Knighthonor.4061]

On 7/22/2023 at 2:30 AM, Mungrul.9358 said:

With recent feature revelations, there has been a lot of kick-back from the community. Are you among the disaffected?

vocal minority

[Endaris.1452]

I will only regret when the expansion drops and the writing continues being a kitten-show.

Anet is backloading a huge portion of features they advertised with (legendary armor, legendary relic, new weapons) so I hope that personal story will at least be up to par.

Edited July 23, 2023 by Endaris.1452

[Sugar Min.5834]

7 hours ago, Sobx.1758 said:

Wait, just because you want something faster, anet is supposed to start delivering half-baked expansion features because if players want a finished product, it's their elitism or sth?

 

As for the topic, I didn't prepurchase.

Your reasoning is flawed. I did not ask for something faster, it was intended to be released in the launch. Please read the news again. This time slowly. Ash is the one that asked for delays in the Relic release, not that I ask for a faster release. Don't twist words please.

PS:  and neither did i pre-purchase SotO

Edited July 23, 2023 by Min Min.9368

[Gazrul.3086]

3 hours ago, Gorem.8104 said:

Supporting bad design choices and decisions is why games die and are removed from online play and are deleted forever, do you want gw2 to go away forever?

I'm not supporting bad design choices. So far I'm happy with everything they've presented to us in SotO. I get that some people aren't happy about some of the changes, and that's fine. We all have different views and opinions. 🙂

[Raknar.4735]

Not really, everything announced seems fine so far.

[Sigmoid.7082]

6 minutes ago, Chronardis.4028 said:

We all have different views and opinions.

I wish more people understood this. 

[vares.8457]

2 hours ago, Knighthonor.4061 said:

vocal minority

And this poll shows it. There will always be people that complain and fear change. But we shouldn’t let them hold us back. 

[Lincolnbeard.1735]

4 hours ago, Gorem.8104 said:

Supporting bad design choices and decisions is why games die and are removed from online play and are deleted forever, do you want gw2 to go away forever? Then give them more money when they make bad choices. Other mmo's have disappeared forever, why would you want gw2 to go away forever? Support the dev team when they make good choices. That's how you truly show support for a game you love. 

Truest thing in the entire thread.
Yet people are more than happy to pay for an unfinished product, which seems to have the quality of LS and no new features.
This subpar xpac (and EoD for that matter) are already a death flag, they have a new shiny toy and couldn't be bothered to work on GW2.

[Funky.4861]

1 hour ago, vares.8457 said:

And this poll shows it. There will always be people that complain and fear change. But we shouldn’t let them hold us back. 

We should let them hold us back from making low-quality decisions and from extorting money from people with a promise of future content. Inserting emotion into what is an objectively bad decision is an appeal to emotion; this signals that your argument can't stand on its own merit. Remember that they promised us wvw alliances with the launch of PoF.

[Ashen.2907]

40 minutes ago, Funky.4861 said:

We should let them hold us back from making low-quality decisions and from extorting money from people with a promise of future content. Inserting emotion into what is an objectively bad decision is an appeal to emotion; this signals that your argument can't stand on its own merit. Remember that they promised us wvw alliances with the launch of PoF.

Yeah, his comment was a bit off IMO.

Even if we are taking the poll results at face value as he seems to be doing, when, as a business, 22%+ of the people who spent money on your new product regret doing so, others are saying that they will delay spending money on your new product,  still others are saying that they will stop spending money on any of your products, and still others are saying that they will no longer use your products.....you are not in good shape. In general those who preorder your product are among your most loyal customers, and 22%+ of them regret giving the company their money.

That said, despite his implication, this sort of poll is not sufficiently representative to be taken too seriously. They can be an interesting snapshot of forum attitudes but the most interesting aspect, to me at least, is the number of people with low or no prior post counts logging into the forum to leave a comment for the first time.

[Ashen.2907]

1 minute ago, Lincolnbeard.1735 said:

with low message count, which means they're probably new to the game.

Not so sure about that. I believe that the vast majority of players do not come to the forums under normal circumstances. Otherwise we would have to conclude that even at its highest population level the game had only a few hundred (at most) players. I am in two guilds of significant size and the only one from the first to use the forums and am only one of two to do so from the second.

I think that the low post count means that they prefer to spend their, potentially limited, free time playing the game rather than typing about it....until something comes along to impact the game for them in so significant a manner as to change their behavior.

[Khaos.6479]

I pre-ordered it and yes I regret it now. I feel like Anet doesn't care about veterants players and only focus on new players and how quick they can reach veterants. I feel like they are not doing something good, and always disapoint me (and a lot of people). SOTO is a mini expanssion, but will also delivred as kit, that's is not good. 

 

That game used very good, but now it's just a shadow. 

Edited July 23, 2023 by Khaos.6479

[Randulf.7614]

Not pre-purchased yet for various reasons (finances being one). I'm also a bit concerned about the direction over the past couple of years, compounded with the rushed relics system which clearly isn't fully thought through and not ready for release in fullness. Companies rely more on metrics than feedback, so not rushing out to preorder makes a vastly bigger statement than any feedback will.

Having said that, I'm too invested not to get it. It's more content and it's not exhorbitantly priced. I just hope the maps are rammed full of content this time

[voltaicbore.8012]

Initially I wasn't going to preorder, but I've wanted to interact with the Wizard's Tower for so long, Anet hooked me and I bought the most basic version of SotO.

I regret doing this, though. Their handling of relics (which represents a brazen betrayal of one of GW2's core attractions) and the new "fractal" seem to affirm that something is (again) going wrong at the studio, on a similar level of dysfunction that we saw leading up to the layoffs.

[Shazan.9638]

I did not pre-order, because the "slightly reduced price" is too much to pay for what is essentially Anet saying "Trust us - future portions will be great".  They have proven over the years that their content and design choices are hit and miss.  For example, I hope to be proven wrong but they have problems balancing things now.  Not sure how they are going to balance when they will be introducing a lot more variables with relics and weapons. 

I am thinking they are afraid to charge a fair price for the content as they release it, because they themselves are aware that they have a difficult time getting it right, and they do not want to give people the ability to not pay for substandard releases.

 

Note:  I have been playing for almost 10 years and do read forums, but seldom post.  I simply dislike this new "pre-pay and trust us that the releases over the nest year will be good" system enough that it has motivated me to post.

 

[vares.8457]

37 minutes ago, Shazan.9638 said:

I did not pre-order, because the "slightly reduced price" is too much to pay

25€ is too much? Seriously? 

[Izzy.2951]

I havent preorder and i dont think i will, until theres some change of direction with the game in general. And i dont think thats ever gonna happen, they are too busy making their new mmorpg (maybe gw3)

Edited July 23, 2023 by Izzy.2951

[Izzy.2951]

14 hours ago, leila.7962 said:

I regret buying it more because most of the features will come in other patches.. which doesn't really seem anything different than a Living Season.. It angers me a bit that they advertised it as an expansion, when it isn't. If it was a real expansion, all the features would come at launch.. like any other game does with their expansions. I've never seen a game that has an expansion that is like a promise of content for the future AFTER it's release.

Open world legendary armor, legendary relics, even MAPS!! Two maps will not be ready at the release... WTF? It's literally what living seasons were.. just that now they are taking more money than the full content is actually worth.. 

• Living Season 2 full pack - 1280 gems, a little bit more than 12 US dollars
• Living Season 3 full pack - 960 gems, a bit more than 10 US dollars
• Living Season 4 full pack - 960 gems, a bit more than 10 US dollars
• Living Season 5 aka "Ice Brood Saga" - 960 gems, a bit more than 10 US dollars

They already fooled us with back then saying that IBS would have an "expansion amount of content" .. and what we got was.. well the same as any other season just with a lesser quality story and rushed AF. 

Now what rises my concern is that a lot of what they said is in the SoTO expansion isn't ready yet but they want to take our money ahead.. it will be released at bits but almost at the price of a full expansion!!! When in reality, since all the content will be delivered like a Living Season, it should cost 960 gems just like the other seasons. Anet is being shady by calling it expansion while it will be released like a LS. Why couldn't they just be like, "hey, free LS for everyone is a bad business model and it took us 10 years to realize that, so now we will have to charge for that". Cool, no problem, as long as the price would have been fair to what will be delivered and at the frequency it would happen?

If its going to be released at bits, just like a LS episodes, we should be able to buy it in bits.. as the episodes come out, so we can actually think if its worth or not buying the rest of this clown fiesta..  At the current price that the """expansion""" is being sold, it should be content worth of 2 living seasons.

I mean its not that the expansion is unfinished, a dev said more than 1 month ago that they were finishing the 2nd part of the 3 map that will come in the future. So basically all the expansion (launch) and post expansion content is done.

They dont deliver it the same day of launch because then, they will have 1.5 years of 0 content until the next expansion, which was the complaits of the community. So they basically want you to be login at least every 3 months, while also trying to make you purchase stuff from the gemstore in that process.

Im not mad at that. They are gonna be delivering content more often. What im mad about is the quality of the content, the abandonned raids and pvp, and that we will get probably no big features anymore, since they have a small team with rushed expansion cycles.

Edited July 23, 2023 by Izzy.2951

[Sobx.1758]

7 hours ago, Min Min.9368 said:

Your reasoning is flawed. I did not ask for something faster, it was intended to be released in the launch. Please read the news again. This time slowly. Ash is the one that asked for delays in the Relic release, not that I ask for a faster release.

It's flawed the same way your previous response was. You're technically "not asking" for something faster, but you're ok with an unfinished product because the unfinished part doesn't directly affect you and you're apparently baffled that someone might want the product to be finished instead of being half-baked on release.
I'm still not sure how you went from Ashantara (and other players) wanting a feature to be fully developed before it's released to "wow do you think you're better than everyone else"?

7 hours ago, Min Min.9368 said:

Don't twist words please.

Exactly the point. This is what you did in your initial response.

Edited July 23, 2023 by Sobx.1758

[Stelawrat.6589]

3 hours ago, vares.8457 said:

25€ is too much? Seriously? 

You quoted him but left out the most relevant part of what he said, i.e., his justification: " I did not pre-order, because the 'slightly reduced price' is too much to pay for what is essentially Anet saying "Trust us - future portions will be great". 

That's a very strange way to quote someone... <.< 

Edited July 23, 2023 by Stelawrat.6589

[vares.8457]

27 minutes ago, Stelawrat.6589 said:

You quoted him but left out the most relevant part of what he said, i.e., his justification: " I did not pre-order, because the 'slightly reduced price' is too much to pay for what is essentially Anet saying "Trust us - future portions will be great". 

That's a very strange way to quote someone... <.< 

No, 25€ isn’t even too much for “trust us - future portions will be great”. It’s 25€, seriously that’s how much you spend on dinner for a single day. 
 

Edited July 23, 2023 by vares.8457

[Stelawrat.6589]

55 minutes ago, vares.8457 said:

No, 25€ isn’t even too much for “trust us - future portions will be great”. It’s 25€, seriously that how much you spend on dinner for a single day. 
But I guess for some everything has to be cheap 

You might want to consider that it has nothing to do with the amount, but rather the reason. With that in mind, then it may well be that for some, 1 unit of any denomination would be too much to pay on a gamble. It's not a reflection of someone's spending habits, but rather their motivation to spend that money. 

I could be wrong, but I think this person just isn't motivated to spend money at this time on this expac. It has nothing to do with preferring to buy cheap, but rather buying tangible quality. 

It's unfortunate that you choose to categorize players in a demeaning way. 

Edit: At today's exchange, 25 Euro = 36.79 CAD + tax + 20% tip (because I'm not cheap as long as the service is good) & you're looking at 50.77$, let's say 51$ for dinner, daily no less! Sorry, not sorry but, I'm not paying 51$ for any dinner, any day let alone daily, no! Not even for the best poutine in the world! It's not happening. 

By all means enjoy your daily 25 Euro dinners though. Make sure you chew well before you swallow. I wouldn't want you to choke. 😛 

Edited July 23, 2023 by Stelawrat.6589

[Sobx.1758]

29 minutes ago, vares.8457 said:

No, 25€ isn’t even too much for “trust us - future portions will be great”. It’s 25€, seriously that how much you spend on dinner for a single day. 
But I guess for some everything has to be cheap 

"Cheap" isn't an objective term btw. Different people, levels of income, countries/currencies, different outlook on the worth of money or even worth of the specific item it's supposed to purchase are just some of the easy variables that will stand right in the way of your "but this is cheap!".
Like in this context, "slightly reduced price is too much to pay" doesn't mean that it will break his budget, it means that he doesn't think content offered on expansion release is worth the money they asked for. How do we know it's about the content available at the release? Exactly because of the rest of the sentence where he mentions he'd need to trust future portions of the expansion will make it worth the money.

Edited July 23, 2023 by Sobx.1758