Selfish much?

[Kabuki Theatre.9752]

I'm new to GW2, but there is something strange I've found about the use of the word "Selfish".

I've got a couple of 80 level characters already, but I decided to start up a Guardian from scratch.

As I began to peruse this forum, I became strangely aware of the use of the word "selfish".

For example . . . I'm now approaching the point to choose my Elite specification.

As I looked through the discussions I began to get a handle on the build differences between Dragonhunter and Firebrand.

And I saw a lot of talk about how Dragonhunter was a more "selfish" build, than was Firebrand.

Excuse me?? Somehow the build I choose for my character is "selfish" depending on what viewpoint you are coming from?????

What Nonsense.All the time I help unknown, non-guild players, to revive them, to help them survive a difficult mob, to help them finish off several kinds of instances.I give what I can to anybody I can help, and any time with no expectation that they will do the same to me.BUT, that is because I have had the benefit of receiving the same from many others in the game.

And You are going to call me "Selfish" because of MY BUILD!!?!?!

Are you nuts???

[Blocki.4931]

"Selfish" is not a personal attack, it's just that you do not offer much if anything to a group so it is indeed selfish, because it is focused on yourself rather than others.

[Kabuki Theatre.9752]

@"Blocki.4931" said:"Selfish" is not a personal attack, it's just that you do not offer much if anything to a group so it is indeed selfish, because it is focused on yourself rather than others.

I'm sorry if I did not make myself clear:

To call someone selfish implies that they are only in it for themselves.That is complete nonsense.What you offer, is what you offer. No more, no less.Being judgemental is being superfluous, you obviously have an ego to overcome.

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

They’re talking about the build, not you. The build is “selfish” in that it doesn’t help others as much as other builds when the player is grouped up. It’s not a moral judgement. “Selfish” build are best for solo players and “not selfish” builds are needed for difficult group content such as raids or fractals. For example, since I solo play my build is very “selfish” and designed to keep me alive.

[ugrakarma.9416]

You're creating a storm in a glass of water. This term only refers to builds that do not share many boons / buffs, it is information that only serves for top-end PVE (Raids, T4 fractals) / WVW content. Not even in Pvp is that much talked about. It is almost a "technical term" its has no judgment value.

[Kabuki Theatre.9752]

@"Just a flesh wound.3589" said:They’re talking about the build, not you. The build is “selfish” in that it doesn’t help others as much as other builds when the player is grouped up. It’s not a moral judgement. “Selfish” build are best for solo players and “not selfish” builds are needed for difficult group content such as raids or fractals. For example, since I solo play my build is very “selfish” and designed to keep me alive.

THATwas a very nice explanation.Thanks for your neat expository.So, being said, the definition of the word selfish here seems to be in reference to groups.

And if one is not used to grouping much, and does mostly solo,except for PUG stuff, and just occasional fall-ins for individual instances,Then the selection of your build, and other attributes, points to whether or notyou are suitable for a group situation. And THAT defines the meaning of "selfish".Yes?

Is that correct?

[Just a flesh wound.3589]

@Kabuki Theatre.9752 said:

@"Just a flesh wound.3589" said:They’re talking about the build, not you. The build is “selfish” in that it doesn’t help others as much as other builds when the player is grouped up. It’s not a moral judgement. “Selfish” build are best for solo players and “not selfish” builds are needed for difficult group content such as raids or fractals. For example, since I solo play my build is very “selfish” and designed to keep me alive.

THATwas a very nice explanation.Thanks for your neat expository.So, being said, the definition of the word selfish here seems to be in reference to groups.

And if one is not used to grouping much, and does mostly solo,except for PUG stuff, and just occasional fall-ins for individual instances,Then the selection of your build, and other attributes, points to whether or notyou are suitable for a group situation. And THAT defines the meaning of "selfish".Yes?

Is that correct?

Yes. My selfish build is great for me playing solo but if I wanted to group up to do raids or fractals the group would expect me to have a build that fits into the group and supports the other members of the group.

[saerni.2584]

Some builds shine in groups by healing or providing boons or otherwise supporting directly enhancing others. These are generally described as support builds

Other builds enhance mainly themselves and are reliant on either doing damage or self sustaining. These are good builds for plus one or going one vs. two based solely on personal ability to apply or take damage.

A “selfish” build falls into the second category. But the word isn’t used as a negative judgment. A selfish build can be a vital team player and ultimately a game changer.

The only judgment could be either from ignorance by the complaining person or if the player is acting like a support when they should be doing something else.

[Sobx.1758]

@"Kabuki Theatre.9752" said:And I saw a lot of talk about how Dragonhunter was a more "selfish" build, than was Firebrand.

And You are going to call me "Selfish" because of MY BUILD!!?!?!

Calm down and understand what people tell you before you act insulted. They say DH is a more selfish build, because it is. It doesn't mean you -as a player- are selfish. It means the spec is, because it has less support capabilities than FB. You're free to calm down now.

[SoftFootpaws.9134]

I think the belief in selfish builds is mostly a falsehood. It only applies to a few specific areas of PvE, and for the rest of PvE, and all of PvP/WvW, selfish builds don't really exist because everyone has something to contribute (except maybe Thieves /s). The Dragonhunter sniping down that runner who always escapes is just as valid as the Firebrand who unloads boons onto the front of the blob.

Whether some builds are more viable with only a few players versus many players, that's a different story, and that's where the problem comes in. Most builds that are viable in competitive modes are also viable in any zerg-based PvE, such as meta events, but not in small scale like Fractals and even raids, and possibly not even in regular events in open-world.

That's because in small numbers, damage always exceeds defense and support, because you need damage to win every encounter, and the less players you have around the less people are doing DPS, leaving no room for the other roles.

[Astralporing.1957]

@"Hannelore.8153" said:That's because in small numbers, damage always exceeds defense and support, because you need damage to win every encounter, and the less players you have around the less people are doing DPS, leaving no room for the other roles.Sure, but you need to realize what those "small numbers" are. The number from which we start talking about "selfish" builds is the size of a base group - 5 players. Is that a lot?

[Ashen.2907]

Selfish is being used as a shorthand technical term in this context. It means a build that does not share many boons or provide much AoE healing. It is not an insult but rather a descriptor of how the build functions in a group environment.

[Hashberry.4510]

Stop hoarding all the deeps :p

[Dragon Priestess.9760]

Eh, just ignore it. They can't do anything except complain about it.

[Tukaram.8256]

@"Kabuki Theatre.9752" said:I'm new to GW2, but there is something strange I've found about the use of the word "Selfish".

I've got a couple of 80 level characters already, but I decided to start up a Guardian from scratch.

As I began to peruse this forum, I became strangely aware of the use of the word "selfish".

For example . . . I'm now approaching the point to choose my Elite specification.

As I looked through the discussions I began to get a handle on the build differences between Dragonhunter and Firebrand.

And I saw a lot of talk about how Dragonhunter was a more "selfish" build, than was Firebrand.

Excuse me?? Somehow the build I choose for my character is "selfish" depending on what viewpoint you are coming from?????

What Nonsense.All the time I help unknown, non-guild players, to revive them, to help them survive a difficult mob, to help them finish off several kinds of instances.I give what I can to anybody I can help, and any time with no expectation that they will do the same to me.BUT, that is because I have had the benefit of receiving the same from many others in the game.

And You are going to call me "Selfish" because of MY BUILD!!?!?!

Are you nuts???

That is why I have played games since the mid 70s and never considered myself a "gamer". Ignore the gamers and have fun. I mostly solo, so all my builds are geared that way. Yet when I join a group, no one complains. I am always ressing folks, and helping out. I have never heard of a 'selfish' build except on this forum. Just ignore them :)

[Ashantara.8731]

@"Kabuki Theatre.9752" said:And I saw a lot of talk about how Dragonhunter was a more "selfish" build, than was Firebrand.

Excuse me?? [...]

You completely missed the context. In solo open world, you are free to play whatever you like. But some game modes require coordination and co-operation, such as WvW and raids, which both heavily rely on group synergy.

Dragonhunter in WvW is only useful in small roaming groups, but never in a squad, because a) there are professions better suited for the kind of damage that zerg fights need, and b) Firebrands are a must-have supporter class without which the zerg is pretty much lost.

Dragonhunter in raids can be okay, depending on what else your current squad has got to offer profession- and build-wise. Who is going to play what needs to be coordinated between the members of the squad before they can enter a raid instance. If you are not "selfish" and no one else can provide a supporter character, you will offer to play support Firebrand (or any other supporter class suited for the job).

So, there is group content that requires teamplay and a certain degree of "selflessness", and there is content that doesn't. I, for one, refuse to play Firebrand in open world content, because I prefer Dragonhunter. But when I enter, let's say, the Boneskinner strike mission with a group of random players and no one else can (or is willing to) switch to a supporter character, I always switch to Firebrand willingly to help out because I want the mission to succeed. That's the spirit of teamplay.

[Teratus.2859]

It's more a poor choice of words, I expect people look on my Necromancers as selfish all the time just because they're Necromancers and the class has a reputation for being solo oriented.

Most of my Necros have support functionality though specially my Minion Master which can single handedly keep a small squad alive in most PvE instances due it's exceptional ability to pull/revive downed players and facetank almost anything.I always go out of my way to get others back in the fight.. so I contest claims of selfishness as well although I recognize the context there isn't a personal attack either lol

It's Just funny to me that people will see me running around with minions and think, Minions.. yep that guy totally has a me first selfish build.. typical Necro lol and yet when I see a couple of people getting beaten up by a champ, bounty or some nasty event monster I jump in and keep them all alive :)

[saloja.7920]

Old proverb: don't feed the troll.

[Infusion.7149]

The only place that's applicable is WvW. In PvE , Dragonhunter is meta due to the quickness from "feel my wrath" elite as well as signet power bonus sharing (Perfect Inscriptions).

[Funky.4861]

Dragonhunter is a meta build in pve because of it's high burst damage with some extra bells and whistles. It IS a selfish build and you are making a selfish decision to play it. However, you can play it in an unselfish manner and that's probably the distinction you're looking for. I don't understand why you're feeling so attacked about this; just because you make a selfish decision does not make you a selfish person.

[Bladestrom.6425]

selfish is a poor choice of word to describe a build choice that is focused on a single aspect, that s the problem op so don't worry about it.

[Carnifex.3275]

Oh boy.. stay away from thief class then. You'd have a "time of your life" on this one. Not only you're selfish apparently but you're also toxic and you deserve to get nerfed into oblivion and also you will be kicked out of WvW squads cuz your class is useless too. And not only community but even game devs have negative feelings about you and constantly deal you a bad hand every balance patch. Face it.. this game is "as racist as it gets". Well not racist but "class'ist" where you're judged on your class. So all is well no worries. Just play until you loose your patience completely. Then carry on onto other games. Hey cheer up. Atleast on Guardian u do have an option to play "non-selfish" builds eh.

[Dante.1508]

@"Kabuki Theatre.9752" said:I'm new to GW2, but there is something strange I've found about the use of the word "Selfish".

I've got a couple of 80 level characters already, but I decided to start up a Guardian from scratch.

As I began to peruse this forum, I became strangely aware of the use of the word "selfish".

For example . . . I'm now approaching the point to choose my Elite specification.

As I looked through the discussions I began to get a handle on the build differences between Dragonhunter and Firebrand.

And I saw a lot of talk about how Dragonhunter was a more "selfish" build, than was Firebrand.

Excuse me?? Somehow the build I choose for my character is "selfish" depending on what viewpoint you are coming from?????

What Nonsense.All the time I help unknown, non-guild players, to revive them, to help them survive a difficult mob, to help them finish off several kinds of instances.I give what I can to anybody I can help, and any time with no expectation that they will do the same to me.BUT, that is because I have had the benefit of receiving the same from many others in the game.

And You are going to call me "Selfish" because of MY BUILD!!?!?!

Are you nuts???

Meta people are not worth listening too, play whatever you like as you like.. Ignore the meta wannabes.. but stay out of the meta content imo.

[Cuks.8241]

@"Dave.6819" said:Oh boy.. stay away from thief class then. You'd have a "time of your life" on this one. Not only you're selfish apparently but you're also toxic and you deserve to get nerfed into oblivion and also you will be kicked out of WvW squads cuz your class is useless too. And not only community but even game devs have negative feelings about you and constantly deal you a bad hand every balance patch. Face it.. this game is "as racist as it gets". Well not racist but "class'ist" where you're judged on your class. So all is well no worries. Just play until you loose your patience completely. Then carry on onto other games. Hey cheer up. Atleast on Guardian u do have an option to play "non-selfish" builds eh.

It is how it is in pretty much every multiplayer game (not even only computer game). If you want to play with the group you have to to some extent conform to the group needs.I play basketball and am 2 meters tall, can play good under the rim but am not the fastest and most agile. I am not demanding the ball on our side and do not try to play play maker if we have fast agile guys that know how to do it.The same way is your example with the thief. Thief is very good in WvW as a roamer, havoc maker, ganker but does not bring much to the blob on the tag. There is no need for a thief to be on tag, doesn't help the group and doesn't help the thief and is actually a liability. Why would you want to play on the tag with a thief?

Anyway selfish builds in pve pretty much means you don't have many important boons to share. Not really much else. Doesn't mean you are unwelcome if you can do something else really good.

[Obtena.7952]

@"Kabuki Theatre.9752" said:I'm new to GW2, but there is something strange I've found about the use of the word "Selfish".

I've got a couple of 80 level characters already, but I decided to start up a Guardian from scratch.

As I began to peruse this forum, I became strangely aware of the use of the word "selfish".

For example . . . I'm now approaching the point to choose my Elite specification.

As I looked through the discussions I began to get a handle on the build differences between Dragonhunter and Firebrand.

And I saw a lot of talk about how Dragonhunter was a more "selfish" build, than was Firebrand.

Excuse me?? Somehow the build I choose for my character is "selfish" depending on what viewpoint you are coming from?????

What Nonsense.All the time I help unknown, non-guild players, to revive them, to help them survive a difficult mob, to help them finish off several kinds of instances.I give what I can to anybody I can help, and any time with no expectation that they will do the same to me.BUT, that is because I have had the benefit of receiving the same from many others in the game.

And You are going to call me "Selfish" because of MY BUILD!!?!?!

Are you nuts???

Yeah ... there are two things going on here. People have termed builds that have low team support as 'selfish'. That's not really a comment about the player.

On the other hand, you're also going to see meta-pushers try to convince you that if you don't play meta builds ... you are also a selfish player because you aren't optimized for the fastest team clears. THAT is unacceptable. This game is designed so you can play how you want and still be successful ... within reason of course. If anyone tries to convince you that you NEED to play the highest DPS build or whatever ... they are just pushing their agenda on you. Just laugh at them and think how bad they are the can ONLY succeed with the most optimal builds in this game.